Hornby 2021 - 4 & 6 wheel period coaches

[Dunsignalling]

8 hours ago, nathan70000 said:

Well this is very cheeky.

 

The BR(E) ones are just the thing for generic East Anglian branches. They definitely lasted in to the early 50s, long enough for locos pulling them to gain an early crest.

 

There's a slight lack of joined up thinking here, though. The LNWR ones are orphans in the Hornby range, unless they do something next year to complement them. The NBR ones *don't really* have anything accurate to pull them, either, as Maude is in preserved condition. Would it have hurt to push the retooled A3 back a year and retool the J83 instead, allowing for it to be tooled in NBR condition? Perhaps with the GWR 2721 following?

 

It's curious that out of all the announcements it's this one that has sparked the most discussion. Houses aren't getting any bigger and pre-grouping suits smaller layouts, so I suspect that this is a market that will only get bigger.

Smaller locomotives means smaller prices, too: look at the going rate for the J15 vs. an A4. Far more affordable to the average modeller, and I seriously wonder whether all those £200> diecast Pacifics will actually sell when they start mass producing them.

Never say never, but these kinds of coach were very much on the way out even before nationalisation. Indeed, most probably only lasted as long as they did because of WW2. I doubt BR would have considered they had enough use left in them to justify repainting, unless being prepared for departmental use, which could be expected to extend their lives considerably.

 

As far as I can make out, the diecast Pacifics aren't intended for general release. They are just limited-run specials aimed at collectors and those with especially heavy trains they need pulling, and priced accordingly.

 

If they have the same internals as the standard plastic-bodied versions, I do hope they fit better gears!

 

John

 

[Caledonian]

2 hours ago, gc4946 said:

I wonder if the NBR and LNWR versions are released this year because of the nature of batch production ...

and Hornby have matching locos up its sleeve in the next year or two?

 One can but hope...

[HonestTom]

16 hours ago, spamcan61 said:

 

There's a huge range of other options they could've gone down rather than copy somebody else's idea. As already suggested how about some updated clerestory coaches. I've largely been very positive about Hornby's products and way of doing business over the decades but this is a tipping point for me. 

 

 

I've often thought that they could make a few quid by producing a second, flat roof moulding for the short clerestory coaches. People have been bashing the clerestories into pre-grouping Southern coaches that way for donkey's years.

[Dunsignalling]

5 minutes ago, MattA said:

Hatton's have since adjusted their pricing. Pre-order price is now £162 on their site https://www.hattons.co.uk/stockdetail.aspx?SID=619194

Matter of interest, is the Terrier in that pack the new model or the Railroad one?

 

John

[boxbrownie]

14 hours ago, Mel_H said:

Or, is Hornby 'leaky' and others find out first and step in, given that Hornby is already working on its 2022 and 2023 ranges?

Highly improbable, if you were a small/new/start up manufacturer (or a business who’s core is selling not producing) and heard one of the biggest successful manufacturers in the world were coming out with an item, would you fancy going up against them with an almost identical item?

[MattA]

Just now, Dunsignalling said:

Matter of interest, is the Terrier in that pack the new model or the Railroad one?

 

John

New tooling

[PhilJ W]

If Hattons are offering the Hornby coaches on pre-order it appears that they are not that fussed about the competition. Perhaps they reckon the market is big enough for both.

[adb968008]

7 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

If Hattons are offering the Hornby coaches on pre-order it appears that they are not that fussed about the competition. Perhaps they reckon the market is big enough for both.

Or every £ is a £ regardless what the customer buys.

 

no point cutting your nose to spite your face. 

Edited January 6, 2021 by adb968008

[AMJ]

The lighting kits for these from Hornby with a magnet to turn on and off reminds me of Rapido's US models but instead of them using track power I'm not so keen on the idea of battery power.  Taking vehicles apart each time a battery fails could result in damage to the vehicle.

[maunsellman]

Its a pity this duplication has happened whether deliberate or not, however I'll wait to see what the final models look like, from what I have seen to date the Hattons coaches appear more detailed than Hornby's and at a similar price so I'll stick with my order. The increased options for mixing & matching I guess will partly be determined by how the liveries match up but I imagine in real life at the turn of the 20th century there was probably a fair degree of variation in this.

[Phil Parker]

12 minutes ago, AMJ said:

The lighting kits for these from Hornby with a magnet to turn on and off reminds me of Rapido's US models but instead of them using track power I'm not so keen on the idea of battery power.  Taking vehicles apart each time a battery fails could result in damage to the vehicle.

 

It's very easy as I show in the video - and the battery is good for 200 hours, more than for several years enough for most people.

[Invicta]

1 hour ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

Please forgive me if this has been commented on before, I will admit that I haven't read all 10 pages, but the most interesting thing about these coaches to me is the lighting.

 

Are these the first Hornby (or indeed any UK manufacturer) coaches offered with lights? ANd battery lights at that.

 

European manufacturers always used to offer lit versions - but British??

 

Very interesting use of reed switches and the way they can easily be retro fitted by the end user.

 

I am aware that similar component parts for modellers to use to make their own lighting units are offered by small suppliers (I use them myself in my HO stock) but to have a ready made product seems a breakthrough and a first for Hornby but I may be wrong as I don't model 00 any more.

 

Hornby certainly used to offer a coach lighting kit as an add-on back in the 80's- I've got a couple of the LMS 'Stanier' coaches from my teens lurking in the loft which I fitted with them -from memory a couple of strips of metallic tape inside the roof with the bulb(s) stuck to them, and wires leading to a plastic moulding clipped to the underside of the bogie, with brass plungers to pick up power from the rails. I don;t remember them ever being offered factory-fitted though

[Legend]

4 minutes ago, Invicta said:

 

Hornby certainly used to offer a coach lighting kit as an add-on back in the 80's- I've got a couple of the LMS 'Stanier' coaches from my teens lurking in the loft which I fitted with them -from memory a couple of strips of metallic tape inside the roof with the bulb(s) stuck to them, and wires leading to a plastic moulding clipped to the underside of the bogie, with brass plungers to pick up power from the rails. I don;t remember them ever being offered factory-fitted though

 

Yes lighted coaches first appeared with their Mk2s in 1969 and then in 1978 they brought out the coach lighting kits for their new range of big 4 and BR coaches .  The issue with both was that it significantly increased drag . I see that as the main benefit of this battery system 

[spamcan61]

1 hour ago, TEAMYAKIMA said:

 

Are these the first Hornby (or indeed any UK manufacturer) coaches offered with lights? ANd battery lights at that.

 

Hornby have made their latest (i.e. introduced around 2013) Mk1s available with lights on an intermittent basis, and Bachmann have Mk2Fs with dcc controlled lighting - although these types are both track powered not battery powered.

Edited January 6, 2021 by spamcan61

[Invicta]

Just now, Legend said:

 

Yes lighted coaches first appeared with their Mk2s in 1969 and then in 1978 they brought out the coach lighting kits for their new range of big 4 and BR coaches .  The issue with both was that it significantly increased drag . I see that as the main benefit of this battery system 

 

Yes, increased drag was my main recollection of them, combined with a certain amount of light bleed glowing through the coach sides. Even as a teenager, I wasn't particularly impressed by them!

[adb968008]

51 minutes ago, Phil Parker said:

 

It's very easy as I show in the video - and the battery is good for 200 hours, more than for several years enough for most people.

Unless you forget to turn them off, in which case its a week or less

(been there done that ).

Also Ive had batteries corrode, especially in winter.

 

latching reed switch with a magnet is nicer than fumbling for a miniature switch however.

Edited January 6, 2021 by adb968008

[6990WitherslackHall]

I'm sure that you're aware that Train-Tech offer Automatic coach light strips in N and OO. I have seen some in action and they look pretty realistic. Perhaps they could be used? 

[The Stationmaster]

2 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

The clue to its inappropriateness is in the name.

 

Hornby's range is somewhat lacking in bread-and-butter locomotives - the J15 being an honourable exception.

And yet regrettably the J15 has either been over-produced or has been a poor seller (or both) which might put Hornby off such an approach for the future.   However as they will have soon exhausted LNER 'big engines'  (with the exception of  various NER types and, arguably, the B17 streamliner) where will they turn then for their apparent love of big steam?   Turbomotive is the most obvious to my way of thinking.

[Dunsignalling]

Trouble with factory-fitted coach lighting is that it's usually four or five times too bright.

 

It's made so you can see how clever it is in a fully lit room and if you try to run a proper twilight/night scenario with dimmed lighting, trains looks like strings of mobile welding workshops!

 

Really needs a method of turning it down.

 

John

 

 

[adb968008]

3 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

Trouble with factory-fitted coach lighting is that it's usually four or five times too bright.

 

It's made so you can see how clever it is in a fully lit room and if you try to run a proper twilight/night scenario with dimmed lighting, trains looks like strings of mobile welding workshops!

 

Really needs a method of turning it down.

 

John

 

 

Add some masking tape over the lights, you can put acrylic paint on clear tape to if you want a tint.

Edited January 6, 2021 by adb968008

[melmerby]

11 hours ago, Knuckles said:

 

!!

 

I thought they were freelance.

 

Sweet.

 

I used to have a blue one.  Then it fell off the old layout decades ago and I could never get the motor mount spring back in.  Think it got binned.

 

Want to buy a new one now.

The chassis is a generic one but it generally fits in reasonably with the various loco bodies most of which (all?) seem to have a prototype they are obviously based on.

IMHO a cheap & cheerful starter loco.

[The Stationmaster]

1 hour ago, MattA said:

New tooling

But still a major anachronism - although no doubt some folk will buy it.    Effectively you get a model of an engine the GWR acquired in 1940 (and probably never saw any use on GWR passenger trains) with coaches in a livery style that had most likely vanished before then.  But it's only a toy train so why worry and I see some substantial future discounting for this one.

[The Stationmaster]

7 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

Trouble with factory-fitted coach lighting is that it's usually four or five times too bright.

 

It's made so you can see how clever it is in a fully lit room and if you try to run a proper twilight/night scenario with dimmed lighting, trains looks like strings of mobile welding workshops!

 

Really needs a method of turning it down.

 

John

 

 

Especially if it's on coaches with the notorious 'pot' lamps which had a reputation for being near useless. 

[Dunsignalling]

8 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Add some masking tape over the lights, you can put acrylic paint on clear tape to if you want a tint.

Personally, I detest night-time running (unless purely as a spectator) and the only lit coaches I countenance are Hornby Pullmans.

 

John

Edited January 6, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[6990WitherslackHall]

My Granddad has some Dapol Gresley teaks in N gauge some of which have been fitted with lighting.  They are used on his N gauge layout that he has in a spare bedroom. They aren't too bright but get hot if they are on for a long period of time. and when things get hot, they tend to overheat. Because the layout is DCC, the coaches remain lit if the train is stationary and or in a siding. Nevertheless, they look brilliant when running with his sound fitted 5029 Nunney Castle. If only there was a way to turn them off...