Hornby 2021 - HST & Mk3 range

[spamcan61]

On 09/09/2021 at 16:27, woodenhead said:

The Oxford tooling is the wrong scale is it not?

The difference is less than 1mm over the length of a coach so not noticeable unless you try and put a Hornby body on an  Oxford underframe or vice versa.

[sanspareil]

I asked Simon at one of the last shows before Covid about the MK3 chances. It wasnt a positive rely, more very defensive about the current offering. I think I used the wrong (or right?) words to describe their current offering as a lash up of Hornby and ex-Lima toolings. He pretty much said sales are very strong and proved Hornby made the right choice in re-using the Lima TGS, so no need to invest in a replacement rake any time soon. Hmmm. 

 

How much better would sales be if they had a decent MK3 offering? Maybe if the new sliding door sales are good it might change their mind.....before maybe Accurascale et al jump in if not!

 

Never say never and just hope I guess - wouldnt be the first time I have been told at a show no chance only to see in the next years catalogue! I think I will give up asking stuff at shows TBH, I was also told the spares situation was going to be sorted for sure...its got worse.

Edited October 1, 2021 by sanspareil

[sanspareil]

And given they are doing the MK4's gives us hope - i hear pre-orders are very strong. Initially they showed no interest. The low price will only help sales. Imagine if they could do that for the MK3's I would buy a sack full! I am still running Lima's full offering given how poor the current Hornby is.

[adb968008]

4 hours ago, sanspareil said:

I asked Simon at one of the last shows before Covid about the MK3 chances. It wasnt a positive rely, more very defensive about the current offering. I think I used the wrong (or right?) words to describe their current offering as a lash up of Hornby and ex-Lima toolings. He pretty much said sales are very strong and proved Hornby made the right choice in re-using the Lima TGS, so no need to invest in a replacement rake any time soon. Hmmm. 

Interesting, I once said the exact same to Rod at Riko in the early 1990’s about the Lima class 50, and his words were near identical… look what happened next at Lima, and of course Hornby subsequently entered the 21st century with their new class 50, which was light years ahead of anything else in the UK market.

 

Within a few years everything of mass sales within Lima had been picked off in new toolings… 08, 20,31,37,40,47,50,52 I cant help thinking, in 2021, we are in similar times when you look at that list.

Edited October 1, 2021 by adb968008

[Godfrey Glyn]

It's the task of model railway company reps at exhibitions to discourage any speculation by a member of the public. I remember suggesting that it would be a good idea to redo the Southern Bogie wagon and being firmly told by Paul it was not on the agenda when subsequently it was clear he had been working on it. Many moons ago at Warley Mr Hubbard basically told me that my suggestion for Bachmann to  build on their excellent Mark 1 coaches and create a SR EMU was a very stupid idea that would never come to pass. At the last GDSF Simon Kohler spent at least 15 mins (it was a quiet period on day 1) trying various dates and demonstrating it was impossible to find an excuse for developing the Rocket when he would have known it had been in development for months.

It must be a source of real amusement in the debriefing meetings following an exhibition and make up for some of the aggressive verbal attacks that they have to endure at times.

 

all the best

Godfrey

 

[andyman7]

I sae the Mk3s in the flesh today at the MK exhibition. The overlap line isn't really noticeable at normal distance (which isn't to justify it or otherwise, just my opinion). Interestingly I picked up an example of the newly released Blue Grey Mk1 BCK last week and a similar line is visible. As far as I can see, it appears to be caused by the 'grey' being applied first and extending lower than the actual break point between the colours. The blue is then applied, and the faint 'stripe' effect is caused by a very slight bleed through of the grey colour underneath the blue. 

[andyman7]

1 hour ago, The 158 Man said:

 

That looks a darker blue as well.

 

It's the same darker blue used on the Mk1 and Mk2 coaches so matches the rake.

[adb968008]

Some food for thought today…

A wander down to Euston tonight, saw toppled celebrity 43274  fallen from rock star to sifting infrastructure.

 

as has 43272…

 

This power-car is an archaelogical dig waiting to happen, under all those layers is VTec, LNER, EMR and Colas.. sticker ontop of sticker..

 

 

Whilst seeing a HST at the stop boards is a rare thing at Euston these days, it is also a reminder of 2 less class 37’s.. if these power cars are successful, the end maybe insight for the mainline tractor.

 

The consist today included Test coach Mentor, which itself is an ageing beast.

 

 

 

more power cars are returning to service under colas next week…

Edited October 5, 2021 by adb968008

[boxbrownie]

As a workhorse it’s very elegant though……not like a bruising 37 

[newbryford]

11 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

 

The consist today included Test coach Mentor, which itself is an ageing beast.

 

 

 

MENTOR has had more facelifts than some Hollywood actresses of a lesser age.

[surfsup]

21 hours ago, The 158 Man said:

 

It'll be out of gauge at this rate. 

 

Then maybe Heljan can measure it for a new model. 

 

I think that prize is still taken by the ex Northern Spirit 158s which ended up at EMT - NS TPE livery overlayed with First TPE, Central Trains CCC and finally EMT all on top of each other 

 

Hornby must be enjoying this though - finally the price of those LNER / VTEC Power cars will probably start to rise at last! 

[adb968008]

On 06/10/2021 at 19:22, surfsup said:

Hornby must be enjoying this though - finally the price of those LNER / VTEC Power cars will probably start to rise at last! 

Have you got shares in them ?

 

ive a spare LNER class 43 set, quietly burning a hole in my desk, pondering wether to EMR it.. but on the other hand Hornby are a bit overdue an EMR set and those LNER coaches need encouragement….

an EMR set in either ex-Stagecoach or ex-LNER would be most welcome, as well as the purple one and 43102.. but somehow I suspect we may only see one of that lot next year, with my bets on the ex-LNER as its cheapest to do.. just use the LNER paint masks, and it could help shift those LNER mk3’s… if that happens I may have a purple and 102 pair resprayed.

 

For now it and I await.

 

[surfsup]

3 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Have you got shares in them ?

 

ive a spare LNER class 43 set, quietly burning a hole in my desk, pondering wether to EMR it.. but on the other hand Hornby are a bit overdue an EMR set and those LNER coaches need encouragement….

an EMR set in either ex-Stagecoach or ex-LNER would be most welcome, as well as the purple one and 43102.. but somehow I suspect we may only see one of that lot next year, with my bets on the ex-LNER as its cheapest to do.. just use the LNER paint masks, and it could help shift those LNER mk3’s… if that happens I may have a purple and 102 pair resprayed.

 

For now it and I await.

 

Nope, perhaps it's just me but it just feels like there has been several releases of the VTEC / LNER Liveried PC's over the recent years and for a while the Power Cars seemed to languish in the "bargain bins". That said, since the transfer over to EMR and now Colas they seem to have disappeared again - just like FGW, it wouldn't surprise me if we see another batch produced with either EMR or Colas on the side this time! 

[scouse889]

16 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Have you got shares in them ?

 

ive a spare LNER class 43 set, quietly burning a hole in my desk, pondering wether to EMR it.. but on the other hand Hornby are a bit overdue an EMR set and those LNER coaches need encouragement….

an EMR set in either ex-Stagecoach or ex-LNER would be most welcome, as well as the purple one and 43102.. but somehow I suspect we may only see one of that lot next year, with my bets on the ex-LNER as its cheapest to do.. just use the LNER paint masks, and it could help shift those LNER mk3’s… if that happens I may have a purple and 102 pair resprayed.

 

For now it and I await.

 

 

Yes, would be nice to see an EMR HST in some form as part of next years range (my personal preference would be 43102/43274 but appreciate a lot might disagree as they were only in service for a short time). Whatever happens, if we do get an ex-VTEC/LNER EMR power car pack of any description, I hope we also get a specific run of the ex-VTEC/LNER EMR coaches to go with the power cars, as the EMR ones have some fairly obvious external differences from the ECML service days - the "EMR INTERCITY" logo added to the bodysides, and a different style of coach lettering.

I've been completely perplexed why Hornby have felt the need to do three runs of the ex-VTEC/LNER coaches - the initial rake of 9 to go with the LNER power cars R3802 made complete sense but I'm not sure I understand what the two follow up rakes of seven coaches (randomly omitting a TF and TS from the prototypical make up) are really supposed to be for...? But I wouldn't say no to another (couple) of pairs of LNER power cars to go with them!

[surfsup]

5 hours ago, scouse889 said:

 

I've been completely perplexed why Hornby have felt the need to do three runs of the ex-VTEC/LNER coaches - the initial rake of 9 to go with the LNER power cars R3802 made complete sense but I'm not sure I understand what the two follow up rakes of seven coaches (randomly omitting a TF and TS from the prototypical make up) are really supposed to be for...? But I wouldn't say no to another (couple) of pairs of LNER power cars to go with them!

 

That's what I was thinking of - I'm glad im not the only one to be perplexed by Hornby's seemingly random batch generator. 

 

I would like to hope we will see some EMR Intercity Mk3s - It's not too difficult to do, using the VTEC base, and they will be doing similar with the the ex GA LSL Mk3s. In fact, they'll be doing similar version of the VTEC livery with the TFW Mk4s! 

[scouse889]

10 hours ago, The 158 Man said:

On a personal note I would like to see another release of the Revised BR InterCity 125 Executive livery. On paper it was a short lived colour scheme, only lasting from around 1984 to 1987 officially, but in practice some power cars were still wearing it as late as 1991, possibly later, though in pretty tatty condition.

 

So far Hornby have only released it once with their 'new' tooling and, as per, sadly made a half-hearted effort with it at best.

 

So another release of those power cars (with the correct white logos this time) as well as the accompanying rake of 8 Mk3 coaches (with the correct lettering this time) in Hornby's current interpretation of Executive Light Grey* would be welcomed with open arms. 

Can I add “with the correct tooling used for the buffet car roof” to that list, please?

[adb968008]

10 hours ago, The 158 Man said:

On a personal note I would like to see another release of the Revised BR InterCity 125 Executive livery. On paper it was a short lived colour scheme, only lasting from around 1984 to 1987 officially, but in practice some power cars were still wearing it as late as 1991, possibly later, though in pretty tatty condition.

 

 

3 years is that it ? Gosh it felt to me every power car seemed to be wearing it… 

I just woke up one morning and blue was gone.

Exec did feel like it lingered.

[adb968008]

8 hours ago, The 158 Man said:

 

Also, is it me or does Executive always seem to look a bit grubby?

Design by comittee, constrained by a limited palette of colours to choose from.

 

I always thought the class 43 DVTs were the worst example of colour clashing, reminded me of something you’d see on a run down VW Beetle in Brazil.

 

Intercity Swallow was a real breath of relief.

Edited October 10, 2021 by adb968008

[scouse889]

It would be nice if Hornby did any version of the HST (Executive or Swallow) without making some form of significant error.

First pack of swallow power cars had no suitable coaches apart from a TGS with CDL, and then you had to make do with non CDL coaches in the loco hauled 10xx/11xx/12xx series.

Then executive with the aforementioned issues.

Next Swallow was XC power cars with post 1998 warning flashes (so prototypical for about 12 months while they worked for VT) and the coaches were an incomplete part of one of the ECML Pullman sets, with Coach D ‘skinhead’ buffet car.

Last year was buffer fitted XC Swallow but with an 8 car ECML set, a seven car XC set with standard class buffet would have seemed more appropriate?

My cunning plan was to use the new rake of coaches with the original release power cars but the executive light grey has now changed shade.

A plain, run of the mill [2+8] Swallow set that represents the bulk of these trains as running in the early/mid 1990s would be great…

The skinhead buffet cars really spoil the look of the coach for me as it’s most often seen, in model form at least, from above. I’m really hoping that this year’s FGW buffet car uses the correct mould and is lettered F, as I would like to replace my R4371A buffet in the FGW rake I have….. wonder if they will use the same shade of blue…?

[adb968008]

2 hours ago, The 158 Man said:

 

In my opinion the vast majority of modellers just want the run of the mill, mundane, every day workhorses. The latest Dutch 31 being a classic blunder (bloody useless). And how many more times do people have to ask for a Blue 31/4?! 

 

Well excuse me… 

 

I think the head code, headlight Dutch 31/4 is the best mistake theyve made this year…

 

A Dutch 31/4 / 31/5 was ubiquitous to anyone modelling north of Coventry, coast to coast up as far as Carlilse in the late 1980’s/90’s… singularly or in plural.

 

31147 with its name was pretty much a niche to the Cambrian coast, few midlands opendays and civ-eng trains… but without pairing it with 31146 to go with it… was much more pointless…

 

so personally i’m very grateful for their oversight, its given me oodles of potential, ive two on my renumber shelf already and a third tbd.

 

However head code, headlight Blue 31/4 is too way way overdue… i’m still using my Lima 31402 / 31468 in that capacity.. oh and 31568 in Grey, oh and 31413 SVR, oh and 31101 large logo, oh and 31327, oh er redstrip railfreight 31232/31242, and just whilst i’m thinking about it.. 31116, 31306 in Dutch. Though 31541 / 31530 in Dutch might be soon biting the bullet.

 

I was hoping they were going to re-do the correct bodies as they should have, then i’d do my 31/1’s too, but I suspect the sun is fading on the hope of that.

 

ive still got 20 Lima class 31’s from the 1990’s.. simply because no one has made a replacement none-exploding version…its my only substantial gap in modern image, though at least now they are all sitting on Hornby Railroad chassis, which considering we are now entering the days of 10x the Lima price for a diesel, but not 10x the 1990’s salary, I maybe keeping my Lima fleet a little longer.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 11, 2021 by adb968008

[scouse889]

I see the LNER farewell tour buffet car is now in stock on the Hornby website and a few retailers. Anyone seen one in the flesh yet and able to confirm whether it has the correct roof moulding?

[InterCity80s]

@scouse889 Kernow have got a picture up on their website of the actual model now: LINK

[XChris]

3 hours ago, InterCity80s said:

@scouse889 Kernow have got a picture up on their website of the actual model now: LINK

Ohh dear, and look at how obvious the overspray is on it. Just so disappointing, how can Hornby actually feel that is acceptable? It’s so clear to see, and the QC department have just let it happen? 

[GordonC]

22 minutes ago, XChris said:

Ohh dear, and look at how obvious the overspray is on it. Just so disappointing, how can Hornby actually feel that is acceptable? It’s so clear to see, and the QC department have just let it happen? 

 

they should be ashamed of trying to sell the coaches when they've been painted like that

[scouse889]

1 hour ago, XChris said:

Ohh dear, and look at how obvious the overspray is on it. Just so disappointing, how can Hornby actually feel that is acceptable? It’s so clear to see, and the QC department have just let it happen? 

 

It does look quite bad, doesn't it?

I read the posts about the other Hornby blue/grey stock with interest, and finally got the opportunity to have a look at some of my blue/grey stock this week - Mark 1, Mark 2e/2f, and Mark 3. I'm sure @andyman7 is correct about what causes the line - the grey being applied first to a larger area than necessary, and then the blue being oversprayed.  Interestingly, there is no such line on any of the Mark 2 stock, the Mark 3's released with the 40th Anniversary HST set, or the original releases of the blue/grey Mark 1s. However, as with the new Mark 1 BCK, there is also a very small line visible on the Mark 1 RBR that I have in blue/grey, so it seems that Hornby may have recently changed the way they are printing the blue and grey livery. In the case of the RBR, I've never noticed it before - it really is not obvious unless you look very closely for it, in contrast to these new LNER Mark 3s where a line is much more evident. The differences I can see are the thickness of the overspray area and the shade of blue. Both of these things look to be conspiring against the LNER Mark 3s: the overspray band is thicker on them than the Mark 1 stock and they are painted in a much lighter shade of blue than the rest of the stock, which doesn't seem to cover up the light grey anywhere near as well as the very dark blue of all the other coaches.

All of this doesn't bode well for the "matching" £329.99 MRP power car packs...