Hornby 2021 - SR Bogie Luggage van

[Dunsignalling]

7 hours ago, Jack P said:

I use #18 Kadees on my Maunsell stock, and the corridor connectors touch on straight track, but i've not had any issues with buffer locking. The club's test track is probably slightly wider than R4 on the curves though. 

 

Will use #17's on the GBL's as #18's make them sit too far away.

You may encounter buffer locking when propelling over crossovers if you go as short as a #17 though, naturally, if you don't want/need to propel it probably won't hurt.

 

When using Kadee heads in CCUs, there is always the problem that the pivots allow the CCU to deflect the wrong way (outwards) when propelling round curves, this becomes more pronounced as the load ahead of the vehicle so fitted increases. There is no issue if one uses couplers that have no pivot, e.g. Roco or the longer Hornby equivalent. 

 

I have a large fleet of NPCS, and decided that, in general, I want to be able to vary formations at will, and not just in the fiddle yard. I therefore fit most such stock with two Kadees. Within my overall plan that defines them as "loose". My other two categories are "outer", generally brake-end coaches with a Kadee on the van end and a Roco on the other, and "inner" with two Roco heads.   

 

Empirically, if I want to shunt "loose" vehicles without trouble, I need to set the Kadees up to leave a gap of approximately 4mm between buffers when being pulled. 

 

My 18-fitted GBL was layout-tested last Sunday, at varying positions within a very mixed parcels rake that included some long 4-wheelers, and no crossover issues were encountered. If I decide to run my second one permanently attached to a passenger rake, I will set it up as an "outer" vehicle, and the NEM mounts allow me to change my mind. 

 

John

Edited May 20, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[melmerby]

8 hours ago, Jack P said:

I use #18 Kadees on my Maunsell stock, and the corridor connectors touch on straight track, but i've not had any issues with buffer locking. The club's test track is probably slightly wider than R4 on the curves though. 

 

 

What is R4?

My track is Streamline with a minimum radius of 3' and medium points.

 

Maunsells definitely buffer lock if pushed through reverse curves, as do others, as the CCUs move sideways under pressure.

Originally I started fitting all my Hornby stock that had CCUs with #18s but all have now gone over to Roco couplers with Kadees only on the end of rakes.

 

I only tried this again a couple of days ago. I put a GBL fitted with #18s at the front of a rake of Maunsells (which have #18s on the brake ends and Roco couplers in the rake) and reversed into a platform through a crossover, it promptly buffer locked and derailed between the two #18 fitted vehicles

 

For that reason I and others on RMWeb don't use Kadees with CCUs, we stick to Roco (or other) couplings

[Jack P]

33 minutes ago, melmerby said:

What is R4?

 

I'm confusing the Maunsell coach width restriction moniker for set-track 4th radius. 

 

I've not has the same experiences with #18 kadees. Next time i'm at the club i'll spend some time testing them.

 

I'm building all my stock to 5' radius minimum, so hopefully that mitigates the issue. Having said that, I wouldn't be opposed to swapping to roco couplings. I only use them inside coach sets, with screw-links on the outside of the set.

[Combe Martin]

1 hour ago, melmerby said:

What is R4?

My track is Streamline with a minimum radius of 3' and medium points.

 

Maunsells definitely buffer lock if pushed through reverse curves, as do others, as the CCUs move sideways under pressure.

Originally I started fitting all my Hornby stock that had CCUs with #18s but all have now gone over to Roco couplers with Kadees only on the end of rakes.

 

I only tried this again a couple of days ago. I put a GBL fitted with #18s at the front of a rake of Maunsells (which have #18s on the brake ends and Roco couplers in the rake) and reversed into a platform through a crossover, it promptly buffer locked and derailed between the two #18 fitted vehicles

 

For that reason I and others on RMWeb don't use Kadees with CCUs, we stick to Roco (or other) couplings

 

If you'r a Somerset & Dorset Modeller and have some Maunsell sets in the 390-399 set number range, you could maybe remove the intermediate buffers (those within the set) as the prototypes didn't have them.  I don't know when they were removed or if this applied to all the sets.  I havn't tried this myself so it's just a suggestion and have no idea how they'd behave when being shunted. These sets stayed in their own fixed formation for their whole life and weren't broken up and and reformed into other sets with other coaches.  I appreciate this idea dosn't help with other coaches.

 

By 'reverse curves' I presume you'r meaning things like a crossover ?

 

Sorry for being off subject slightly.

 

Peter.

[Dunsignalling]

2 hours ago, melmerby said:

What is R4?

My track is Streamline with a minimum radius of 3' and medium points.

 

Maunsells definitely buffer lock if pushed through reverse curves, as do others, as the CCUs move sideways under pressure.

Originally I started fitting all my Hornby stock that had CCUs with #18s but all have now gone over to Roco couplers with Kadees only on the end of rakes.

 

I only tried this again a couple of days ago. I put a GBL fitted with #18s at the front of a rake of Maunsells (which have #18s on the brake ends and Roco couplers in the rake) and reversed into a platform through a crossover, it promptly buffer locked and derailed between the two #18 fitted vehicles

 

For that reason I and others on RMWeb don't use Kadees with CCUs, we stick to Roco (or other) couplings

Not sure if I've mentioned this earlier in the thread, but the CCU deflection problem can be brought under control by fitting guides to the bogies which "steer" the CCU as they turn.  This is unavoidable when using Keen CCUs, which (unlike Hornby's) do not self-centre. I would post pics, but my Bachmann 5-set that formerly had them has been refurbed and now has Symoba CCUs on the outer ends along with new bogies. 

 

No problems arose propelling over a 3' radius crossover when I tested my GBL Kadee to Kadee with a Hornby Stanier BG and Van B, both similarly fitted with #18s, which produces my pragmatic 4mm between buffers under traction. I therefore have no immediate intention to modify it.  

 

Things get proportionately less forgiving the closer one wishes the buffers to get and Roco heads (or another rigid type) is the only way to ensure good behaviour if you want them to touch on the straights.

 

John

Edited May 20, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[Dunsignalling]

29 minutes ago, Combe Martin said:

 

If you'r a Somerset & Dorset Modeller and have some Maunsell sets in the 390-399 set number range, you could maybe remove the intermediate buffers (those within the set) as the prototypes didn't have them.  I don't know when they were removed or if this applied to all the sets.  I havn't tried this myself so it's just a suggestion and have no idea how they'd behave when being shunted. These sets stayed in their own fixed formation for their whole life and weren't broken up and and reformed into other sets with other coaches.  I appreciate this idea dosn't help with other coaches.

 

By 'reverse curves' I presume you'r meaning things like a crossover ?

 

Sorry for being off subject slightly.

 

Peter.

Within sets, the buffers on all coaches with Pullman gangways can (and should) be retracted anyway. The buffing action on the prototype is taken care of by the gangway assembly.

 

On Hornby Maunsells, I remove the springs behind the buffers and lightly glue them in the retracted position. I leave the van ends alone. That reminds me, I must get round to doing so on my 59' Bulleid 3-set...

 

John  

 

EDIT: Some sources infer that side-buffers were later put back onto the former "Torrington" 3-sets used on the S&D, I'd love to see a dated picture to either confirm or debunk that. 

Edited May 20, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[Tony Wright]

I'm writing the review about these excellent models for BRM.

 

 

Naturally, I couldn't leave it as it is (I've already taken off the tension-locks and fitted the headstock pipework).

 

 

Then dry-brush/enamel wash weathering to produce an excellent 'layout van'.

 

 

[Wickham Green too]

I guess my one's been out of the paintshop rather longer .......

 

[GreenGiraffe22]

Now that it is legal for me to visit my parents (what a weird time to be alive) , I've had a chance to  'play trains', so here's a link to a tweet with a video of my H2 with the new Luggage van heading an express, I don't have a proper lined 3 set yet so it's a composite brake, comp, brake third, restaurant, open third, then the Dunkirk 3 set. 

 

H2 pulls them all with ease because it is one of the greatest 00 locomotives on the market!  No track too bumpy, no curve too tight, no load too heavy!

 

 

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, GreenGiraffe22 said:

Now that it is legal for me to visit my parents (what a weird time to be alive) , I've had a chance to  'play trains', so here's a link to a tweet with a video of my H2 with the new Luggage van heading an express, I don't have a proper lined 3 set yet so it's a composite brake, comp, brake third, restaurant, open third, then the Dunkirk 3 set. 

 

H2 pulls them all with ease because it is one of the greatest 00 locomotives on the market!  No track too bumpy, no curve too tight, no load too heavy!

 

 

I wonder what is different between the H2 and the very similar GNR C1 as my C1 is pathetic?

[Jack P]

6 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

I guess my one's been out of the paintshop rather longer .......

 

 

Oooooh, is that bullion van behind it? I must get on and finish mine. 

 

Humble suggestion - you should start a thread, I would love to see more of your work!

[Wickham Green too]

Yes, it's a Specie ( Bullion ) Van ....... built it yonks ago but only got it in front of the camera yesterday.

[trevor7598]

My Hornby crimson GBL arrived the other day.

Well done Hornby for a fine model, at a reasonable price, and to TMC for the light weathering

and prompt service. If Hornby produce one in future without droplights in a BR livery I will have another.

[GWR-fan]

I had always thought that my Tri-ang Hornby olive green SR bogie vans would be more than acceptable considering the approximate GBP40.00 replacement cost for the new model.  I was more than happy with the three mint models that I have,  however,  with a local store offering R60020 and R50020A at around 2/3 the price of other eBay stores and well below full retail,  I could not resist.   I will run the new models with the Maunsell and Pullman coaches that I have and either onsell the mint older models or perhaps run them as part of a parcels train.  The older olive green models seem to attract a cult following, holding their value well.

[The Johnster]

Mine got delivered direct from Hornby this morning, and I am very pleased with it, It is a crimson S 2467 S.  Detail is excellent, and it has the best rendition of torpedo vents I've seen on an RTR model, kudos Hornby.  At the price, I feel justified in carping criticism, but haven't found much to criticise.  There are potential improvements to be made, however; a piece of wire between the handbrake wheels wouldn't come amiss, and a very minor disappointment is the moulded electical cable connections on the ends, easily cut off and replaced with whitemetal retrofits.  Worst criticism is that, if the van is stongly lit from behind, there is notiiceable light bleed through the centre door droplight frames, and a little beneath them.  It is not noticeable in normal lighting conditions, but is worth noting if you intend internal lighting in the van.

 

It will be given a weathering wash, running/clearance trials, and put into service later today.  There are vacuum and heating bags in a plastic bac, and 4 blackboards, but I can't find prototype photos showing where these went.  I would guess that they were fixed on the ends of each side at about door handle height.  On the Van B, they were fixed between the doors, 4 to a side, but there are only 4 supplied with the GLV.  Maybe beneath the fixed paired lights; everywhere else seems blocked by framing or ventilators.  Just confirmed this by backreading; Tony Wright and Wickham Green have attached theirs and if it's good enough for them, who am I to argue. 

 

Might be worth picking out the gangway door handles in brass paint. My layout has setrack curves in the fiddle yard and uses tension lock couplings, so the vac/steam heating bags must be left off, sadly.

 

Happy bunny in Cardiff today!

[Dunsignalling]

3 minutes ago, The Johnster said:

Mine got delivered direct from Hornby this morning, and I am very pleased with it, It is a crimson S 2467 S.  Detail is excellent, and it has the best rendition of torpedo vents I've seen on an RTR model, kudos Hornby.  At the price, I feel justified in carping criticism, but haven't found much to criticise.  There are potential improvements to be made, however; a piece of wire between the handbrake wheels wouldn't come amiss, and a very minor disappointment is the moulded electical cable connections on the ends, easily cut off and replaced with whitemetal retrofits.  Worst criticism is that, if the van is stongly lit from behind, there is notiiceable light bleed through the centre door droplight frames, and a little beneath them.  It is not noticeable in normal lighting conditions, but is worth noting if you intend internal lighting in the van.

 

It will be given a weathering wash, running/clearance trials, and put into service later today.  There are vacuum and heating bags in a plastic bac, and 4 blackboards, but I can't find prototype photos showing where these went.  I would guess that they were fixed on the ends of each side at about door handle height.  On the Van B, they were fixed between the doors, 4 to a side, but there are only 4 supplied with the GLV.  Maybe beneath the fixed paired lights; everywhere else seems blocked by framing or ventilators.  Just confirmed this by backreading; Tony Wright and Wickham Green have attached theirs and if it's good enough for them, who am I to argue. 

 

Might be worth picking out the gangway door handles in brass paint. My layout has setrack curves in the fiddle yard and uses tension lock couplings, so the vac/steam heating bags must be left off, sadly.

 

Happy bunny in Cardiff today!

For chalk board positions see Tony Wright's photo further up this page.

 

John

[The Johnster]

Already done, John, and boards fixed in correct locations with a spot of superglue.

[Wickham Green too]

On 08/09/2021 at 15:25, The Johnster said:

....... notiiceable light bleed ....... is worth noting if you intend internal lighting in the van. ......

It would have been very rare for these to run with the lights on ........ possibly if the guard has to sort something for the next stop - but don't forget he's got his own van to travel in and prioritise mailbags or whatever. Most likely the lights would only be used when loading / unloading.

 

Incidentally, I guess that little pipe below one of the windows is a conduit for the lighting cable !!?!

[The Johnster]

What often happened on NPCCS was that station or postal staff went into the vehicle to unload parcels or mailbags at the end of it's usually overnight journey, and turned the lights on if they weren't already on.  Then, distracted by other work, they forgot left them on, especially if this was in the half-light of early morning and the lights, already probably pretty dim, were not obvious.  The van then spends the rest of the day in sidings somewhere with the batteries being drained. 

 

When the van is used the following night, the lights are not working at all initially as the short journey from the sidings has not charged the batteries enough, so the light flickers into dim half-life after about 20 miles or so, dimming as soon as the train slows, and the performance is repeated night after night.  Not all staff, especially postal staff, had carriage keys which were used to switch the lights on and off. 

 

Typical lighting for a train of NPCCS will be a brightish light in the guard's compartment, with the rest of the train fairly poorly lit (the incandescent lighting of passenger stock was not what you would call dazzling) to varying degrees and some vehicles in darkness.  In some cases, the loading of mailbags or parcels will obscure the windows so that you cannot see whether the lights are on or off.  TPO vehicles are always well lit, of course.  Reproducing an element of this in night work on models will enhance the overall effect.

[Dunsignalling]

Whilst only a small minority of us will portray such traffic on our layouts, many of these vans spent much of their working lifespan incorporated in newspaper train circuits out of SR London termini. 

 

As such they were staffed by employees of the news distribution agencies who would put off bales of sorted papers under the canopies at intermediate stations, many of which were unmanned at the hour of their passing.

 

They therefore had a personal interest in the lights working properly on the next trip and there was almost certainly a laid-down procedure for switching the lights off to ensure the batteries received a good charge during the return working to the capital. 

 

John

Edited September 11, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[The Johnster]

I would agree with this in the case of vans on newspaper sorting circuit work, and can remember the Siphon G's used on the WR for this, which were always well lit and kept clean inside, including the white or light cream painted inside of the roofs which diffused the light.  My GLV will appear on random workings, not circuit, however (rule 1 um, rules), and dim lighting will be as probably in this as any other NPCCS that penetrates to the mountain fastnesses of Cwmdimbath in the 50s.

[GWR-fan]

For Aussie customers,  all Hornby stock 20% off until 26th.  Of interest to me were the SR bogie luggage vans, including the funeral van.   Pity I purchased some a few weeks ago.

 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/324689198573?hash=item4b98fbfded:g:79cAAOSwPTlg0o0l

 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/324690642930?hash=item4b991207f2:g:J~UAAOSwczpg0ePp

 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/224537722037?hash=item34477dbcb5:g:hRAAAOSwHu5g8jaZ

 

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/224508842592?hash=item3445c51260:g:OcgAAOSwhflg0ePr

 

[GWR-fan]

Refer post above,  I just purchased two off Churchill vans costing me a total of $100.78 Aud and because the order was over $99.00,  postage was free.   Hattons want GBP40.00 each for these.

[gwrrob]

These models seem to had a boost and a surge in sales after being featured on the Hornby program on the Yesterday channel. The price has risen with some traders from what I've seen at recent shows.

 

Here's mine after visiting the weathering works of @toboldlygo

 

 

 

[Nova Scotian]

On 01/11/2021 at 16:43, gwrrob said:

These models seem to had a boost and a surge in sales after being featured on the Hornby program on the Yesterday channel. The price has risen with some traders from what I've seen at recent shows.

 

Here's mine after visiting the weathering works of @toboldlygo

 

 

 

 

My father ordered the Winston Churchill funeral one after watching it (he has the NRM BoB Class and the right pullman coaches already) - was very disappointed that the retailer he purchased from (well known) took the order, then said they couldn't fulfill and cancelled the order. By the time they did this it was out of stock at Hornby, but he managed to get one from another retailer. The model looks excellent (as does the weathering!)