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GWR Freight train timetable "Target No." And "Target Plates"


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Hi,

Attached below is a partial image of a GWR freight timetable for London from Tony Atkins Goods Train Working Vol2 pg 151.

The first column of the timetable lists a Target No.  The text does not refer to this timetable directly but several pages earlier refers to "Target Plates" which were carried on the front of "Control Engines" working from South Wales collieries to the docks, presumably it helped route the untimetabled traffic.  I have also seen a similar, but mostly empty, column in another timetable but cannot remember which.

 

I presume similar "Target Plates" must have been carried by engines in areas other than South Wales eg North London and if so does anybody have or can they point me towards a picture of one?  The target plate was carried on a headlamp bracket.  I cannot recollect seeing a picture of one.

 

I would like to thank Miss Prism for referring me to Tony Atkins excellent books on Goods Services and Goods Trains in an earlier thread.

Paul

20201217_150810.jpg.db8a6dbb60453bb5183252e11d414ccd.jpg

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Hi,

Thanks for the suggestion.  I have read the suggested thread and followed a couple of links from those posts.  The target plate is described as white with black writing and seem to be a letter over numerals - in South Wales- and there is a list.  Reference is also made to shapes other than round.

I have also looked through some books regarding South Wales and now found several of these targets in colour photos.  The targets look to be 12" to 14" diameter.  The dates are firmly BR days rather than GWR, this latter being my area of interest.  In several the discs are yellow although I presume this is a consequence of reproduction rather than reality.  One seems to be stencil painted and the other free hand.

I have also found several photos where a similar code ie letter plus two numerals is chalked onto the smoke box door and alot more with the large frame mounted on the smokebox with train reporting numbers.  These are in both the letter plus two numbers format and a three number format.  I am aware of the GWR using three number codes to identify Summer passenger trains mid thirties onwards.

 

The threads focus on South Wales.  The timetable above refers to London and does not mention letter plus numerals only one or two numerals or a pair of letters.  It seems a less sophisticated code than used in wales.  And I have not seen photos.

Paul

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The three figure codes carried by express trains gave way to the alphanumerical ones from June 1960, when the four character numbers that we still have were introduced.  At this time the South Wales targts were revised.  This soon became a trap for unwary caption writers!

 

The use of discs with numbers on them was quite widespread outside South Wales.  Examples that come to mind include Paddington pilot locos and the bankers used on Dainton and Rattery banks.

 

Chris  

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  • RMweb Gold
13 hours ago, GWR_Modeller said:

Hi,

I have browsed my books and the internet for freight trains in London.  Almost every Southern train seems to have a number but I have yet to find a GWR one.

P

Don't forget that virtually all, if not all, the trains listed in the TT extract shown in your OP were not worked by Western engines.  The STT (Section 1) from which that table was copied shows no details at all for Western worked trains running via the bank at Acton and Acton Wells but it does show Western worked freight trains to Smithfield and Hammersmith.

 

When i have a moment i'll check the West London Line section (which includes all sorts of stuff, not just WLL) and see if there is anything in there because the South Lambeth trips don't appear in Section 1 either

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  • RMweb Gold

Right July 1939 GWR STT to hand - because it was the easiest one to get out of the archive (box).  The trains up the bank and via Acton Wells all have target numbers except a light engine to Acton Corporation Sidings which is shown as 'GW' and an LMS trip to  Brent Sdgs which only runs as required and is shown as 'Mid'.

 

In the opposite direction - coming down the bank to Acton there two trips in shown as 'Mid' with no target number and the light engine back from acton Corporation Sidings is shown as 'GW'.

 

As with Section 1 there are various freight movements in teh genral area shown in this STT but there are no times shown at all for GW servivces via Acton in contrast with those to/from  Hammersmith, Smithfield, Hither Green and Norwood Junction nor are there any loads shown in the GW load tables for anywhere via Action Wells although they are shown for South Lambeth, Hither Green (57XX load given plus SR Classes C, N and W) and Norwood Jcn,  Equally while there were milk trains via Acton Wells there are no GW loads shown for them although there are Milk Train loads to South Lambeth and Clapham Jcn.

 

So while it is without sight of an engine workings I am reasonably sure that GW engines did not at that date work freight trains etc via Acton Wells.

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