JeffP Posted December 30, 2020 Share Posted December 30, 2020 Is there a definitive source anywhere that details whether a specific tender on a specific date had spoked or disc wheels? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffP Posted December 31, 2020 Author Share Posted December 31, 2020 I've tried photos, but the tender wheels are too indistinct on most old black and white pics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted December 31, 2020 Share Posted December 31, 2020 (edited) Despite lots of reading I have not come across such a list and have worked on the premise that the GN tenders were spoked and the streamlined were disc. The RTCS green book confirms this but adds that, post war, some tenders were rebuilt with the other type of wheel. If you repost the question in the Prototype Questions section you might have more luck. Perhaps the Finney 7 modellers might be able to advise. The interesting thing is that the Hachette researchers did an apparently too good a job using the preserved FS resulting in the firebox blackhead ( plastic) being LHD. I would have assumed that the current tender has disc wheels so why did they commission spoked wheels for the kit? Edited December 31, 2020 by doilum Additional information Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted December 31, 2020 Share Posted December 31, 2020 (edited) This is more complicated than I thought. Although there are no lists, Yeadon's Registrar has photos of the corridor tender brand new on spoked wheels, or correct for the FS as modelled by Hachette. This is confirmed by the Finney 7 website which says that the swap to disc wheels was done when they were reallocated to the A4s. A Google search for Gresley tenders disc wheels led me to an RM thread from 2015 on Book Law. Seems that the disc wheels for the A4 swap were taken from the NT units which replaced them, making spoked wheels correct for the non corridor streamlined (NT) tenders. Just to complicate further, Finney 7 recommend disc wheels for their GN tender! Edited December 31, 2020 by doilum Additional information Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Bucoops Posted December 31, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 31, 2020 Were disc wheels used to reduce drag perhaps? Which might explain why they were used on A4 allocated tenders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted December 31, 2020 Share Posted December 31, 2020 This may help https://www.sirnigelgresley.org.uk/mob-tenders.shtml 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted December 31, 2020 Share Posted December 31, 2020 1 minute ago, micklner said: This may help https://www.sirnigelgresley.org.uk/mob-tenders.shtml A good read but not much help for A3 history. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Blandford1969 Posted December 31, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 31, 2020 19 hours ago, JeffP said: Is there a definitive source anywhere that details whether a specific tender on a specific date had spoked or disc wheels? Thanks. Have you tried Yealdon's as a starting point? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold sjp23480 Posted December 31, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 31, 2020 Or Mike Sharman's "Wheel specifications for the modeller"? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted December 31, 2020 Share Posted December 31, 2020 34 minutes ago, sjp23480 said: Or Mike Sharman's "Wheel specifications for the modeller"? Yes. Spoked for A1/A3s. 4'2" 12 spoke. The first two A1s definitely had spoked tender wheels. But I would dispute that applied to all as they may have started out with spoked, but I believe they all had disc by BR days. The streamlined tender versions definitely did from the mid 1930s. Don't forget by withdrawal those wheels would be getting on for being about 40 years old. So probably replaced years ago. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffP Posted December 31, 2020 Author Share Posted December 31, 2020 1 hour ago, Blandford1969 said: Have you tried Yealdon's as a starting point? Yes. Loads of tender info but the wheel type not mentioned. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffP Posted December 31, 2020 Author Share Posted December 31, 2020 1 hour ago, sjp23480 said: Or Mike Sharman's "Wheel specifications for the modeller"? Will have a look tomorrow. Thanks for the idea, but I don't hold out much hope for it being specific, just likely to tell me what two types, spoked and disc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Blandford1969 Posted December 31, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 31, 2020 Sorry, can't think of anything else, photos of your preferred locos would seem then the most likely avenue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokebox Posted December 31, 2020 Share Posted December 31, 2020 Were disc wheels used because they were/are stronger than spoked wheels. In fact, are disc wheels stronger? I would guess they are but heavier. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matti8 Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 The GNR type tenders were all spoked. The Gresley tenders started out with spoked as well but were soon substituted with disc. Hope that helps. Matti 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 What we need to know is which loco you intend to model and which period? You might then get lucky with a photo! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffP Posted January 1, 2021 Author Share Posted January 1, 2021 Ok, can do that. 60051, Blink Bonny, and 60066, Merry Hampton, both circa 1960 to withdrawal. 60051 had the later tender, 60066 the GNR coal rail tender. So probably disc and spoked in that order. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, JeffP said: Ok, can do that. 60051, Blink Bonny, and 60066, Merry Hampton, both circa 1960 to withdrawal. 60051 had the later tender, 60066 the GNR coal rail tender. So probably disc and spoked in that order. Is Merry Hampton nearly as obscure as St Frusquin? Good choice though. That will be two scratch built tenders or did you spot the NT on the bay of E last week? Trough deflectors? Fitted 1962 and 1961 respectively. Edited January 1, 2021 by doilum Additional information Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted January 1, 2021 Share Posted January 1, 2021 Loads of photos of 60066 Merry Hampton here. Not Mary as Google was telling me.... http://www.tracksthroughgrantham.uk/recording-the-railway/tales-of-grantham-locomotives/merry-hamptons-final-fling-oer-the-border/ https://www.national-preservation.com/threads/gresley-a3-pacifics-b-r-era-60064-60067-built-1924-by-nbl.1293476/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffP Posted January 2, 2021 Author Share Posted January 2, 2021 (edited) On 31/12/2020 at 19:00, sjp23480 said: Thanks for all replies. 60051 will undergo a tender swap with my Hachette 60029 Woodcock. Meanwhile, 60051 will be built from a Martin Finney kit and will have a tender from his GNR tender kit that I have in stock. Original Finney too! The Finney kit comes with the option to build with double Kylchap, and trough deflectors. Ragstone have already delivered the bits for the Hachette offering. Edited January 2, 2021 by JeffP Adding info Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, JeffP said: Thanks for all replies. 60051 will undergo a tender swap with my Hachette 60029 Woodcock. Meanwhile, 60051 will be built from a Martin Finney kit and will have a tender from his GNR tender kit that I have in stock. Original Finney too! The Finney kit comes with the option to build with double Kylchap, and trough deflectors. Ragstone have already delivered the bits for the Hachette offering. Sounds like a busy 2021. Should be good fun though. Don't forget that both tenders will need to be LHD! Edited January 2, 2021 by doilum Predictive text error Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffP Posted January 3, 2021 Author Share Posted January 3, 2021 Of course... I'd thought of the locos, but you've reminded me the tenders were handed too. Thanks. I'd do a build...except there are too many haters Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
doilum Posted January 4, 2021 Share Posted January 4, 2021 11 hours ago, JeffP said: Of course... I'd thought of the locos, but you've reminded me the tenders were handed too. Thanks. I'd do a build...except there are too many haters Pity. I found that most responders were positive and helpful. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffP Posted January 4, 2021 Author Share Posted January 4, 2021 They are. But I am not happy if even one hater appears, it makes me feel threatened. Thankfully, the guy on here who was quite nasty to me has migrated to another forum. But I still wouldn't feel confident with a build. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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