Hardies Hobbies Hudswell Clarke Italia: Hornby B2 or Electrotren chassis?

[carlwebus]

Hi All

 

I'm  quite taken by some of the Hardieshobbies loco body kits - especially the Hudswell Clarke Italia outside cylinder 0-6-0T and the Fox Walker 0-6-0T.

 

I see the former is intended to sit on the Hornby Peckett B2 chassis and the latter on the Electrotren 0-6-0  chassis.

 

In both cases you have  to buy the original Hornby or Electrotren  locos as the  chassis don't come up by themselves.

 

The B2 is generally   about  £90-£100 while  the Electrotren is generally in the £50s.

 

I  really want to do the Italia first as its very similar to the Hudswell Clark No.1604 that is being  restored at  the Mid-Suffolk Light Railway  where I  volunteer.

 

I'm  thinking  there aint much discernable difference in the  wheel  size/ spacing/cylinder layout between the two chassis.

 

So maybe I can put the Italia on the Electrotren  chassis?

 

I'm fairly confident that I can fettle either chassis into  either kit as I've used the Electrotren  chassis with a much modified Jinty body to form a presentable Plymouth & Devenport 757 class 0-6-2T. I've also put a Hornby J15 chassis under a Triang R1 body (detailed);  and a Dapol A1X  chassis under a much modified Triang Nellie body to get a presentable Caledonian 812.

 

I know people rubbish the Electrotren but,  with added  weight (ideally to total 185g +) my 757 runs very well on my Peco  streamline track and  electrofrog points despite its larger profile flanges.

 

Can anybody comment on the respective  sizes of the B2  and Electrotren  chassis: length, wheel spacing,  cylinders, motor size etc?

[The Johnster]

I’d suggest buying a donor Electrotren and try-fitting the chassis and mech under the Italia.  If it can be fitted, all well and good, you’ve saved £40-50.  Buy another one for the Fox Walker.  If it can’t, fit it under the FW when you acquire a round tuit, and buy a donor B2 for the Italia. 
 

[Butler Henderson]

B2 for £78.94 inc postage R3694 at Monk Bar 

[Poor Old Bruce]

16 hours ago, carlwebus said:

The B2 is generally   about  £90-£100 while  the Electrotren is generally in the £50s.

 

..... and a Dapol A1X  chassis under a much modified Triang Nellie body to get a presentable Caledonian 812.

 

Can I just point out that Kernow (no connection except as a customer) are offering their GWR 1361 0-6-0ST at £69.99 if that is any use for re-bodying.

 

The Caley 812 sound interesting. Any pics?

[Nile]

The basic problem with the Electrotren chassis is the way the motor sticks out over the centre wheels, making it much more suitable for side tank locos. You may be able to shoe-horn it into the 'Italia' but the front of the motor will be visible under the tank. I think these models were designed by Turbo Snail, he will be able to advise.

[TurboSnail]

Hi @carlwebus, I designed the Fox Walker, which was intended for the Electrotren chassis - however, Andy Hardy designed the Italia himself, so I can't really comment on the amount of space available in that. Nile is spot on - the width of the motor is the main problem with the Electrotren chassis, which limits its usefulness for saddle tank locos. In the case of the Fox Walker, the side tank extensions can just about cover it.

 

If you look at the rest of the Hardy's range, we tend to use the B2 for saddle tanks and the Electrotren for side tanks - otherwise the two chassis are very similar in terms of wheel size, wheelbase etc. For most of the 0-6-0s, both chassis were considered early in the development stage, the decision being made on the amount of space available in the body. The other point to take into account is the Electrotren flanges are bigger so can catch where the B2 ones wouldn't.

 

I don't want to say the Electrotren wouldn't fit the Italia, but it would certainly need modifications, probably to both the body and the chassis. I have successfully fitted a smaller motor to the chassis before so that's another option. All depends on the amount of work you want to do really! I've added a lot of weight to my S100, which really helped it run well on this chassis, so it can be a good thing.

 

Hope that helps!

 

@Poor Old Bruce I have seen the Kernow GWR 1361 on offer repeatedly, but I haven't been able to find any inspiration for locomotives that have the same wheel diameter and wheelbase to base on it - or if I have, there's a lack of information and suitable engineering drawings. Suggestions are welcome if you know any! Same goes for the Golden Valley Janus and the old-school Hornby/Dapol Terrier, there are plenty of good, cheap chassis available but not always the prototypes to go on them.

[carlwebus]

Thanks guys.

 

Great  and very helpful  replies.

 

It looks like  the Electrotren for the Fox Walker but must be the Hornby B2 for the Italia.  Like most of us I seem to be building up a stock of "I must make that some time" locos and kits!  Currently in line are  the Q  from Golden Arrow and a generic saddle tank from Budget Model Railways (which  shall be fettled into a side tank).  That's aside from half a dozen Parkside and Dapol wagon kits and couple of 009 coaches/vans!

 

I  really  want to do the Italia   first as its close to the HC 1604 that is being fettled at the Mid-Suffolk Light Railway (Middy).

 

The B2 at Monk Bar may well prove irresistible!  (£74.99 in the   sale at present).

 

I'm afraid I had some brain freeze when mentioning the Caley conversion.  My comment  there can politely be classed as "tripe-a-graphical error". Sorry Poor Old Bruce.   Its  actually a Caley 782 that I'm using the Nellie body  and Dapol A1X chassis for.  It will be a "reasonable representation" rather than an accurate model - as the tanks are too short and there really nowhere to extend them  forward.  Out of interest I attach photo of  that "work in progress".

 

As indicated  I have got the Electrotren  chassis working  really well under my Plymouth & Devonport 757 - but only after getting the weight up to 185g.

 

[Poor Old Bruce]

On 01/01/2021 at 14:17, TurboSnail said:

 I have seen the Kernow GWR 1361 on offer repeatedly, but I haven't been able to find any inspiration for locomotives that have the same wheel diameter and wheelbase to base on it - or if I have, there's a lack of information and suitable engineering drawings. 

Sorry but that comment doesn't hold water. I haven't taken things to pieces to check the innards or done any measuring but, having offered a 1361 up to an Electrotren loco chassis, what differences there are in terms of wheelbase and wheel diameter look to be less than 1mm, if that. So, if the Electrotren chassis is 'near enough', the 1361 should be as well and, as already mentioned I think, the 1361s (Kernow or Heljan) have finer wheel profiles.

[TurboSnail]

46 minutes ago, Poor Old Bruce said:

Sorry but that comment doesn't hold water. I haven't taken things to pieces to check the innards or done any measuring but, having offered a 1361 up to an Electrotren loco chassis, what differences there are in terms of wheelbase and wheel diameter look to be less than 1mm, if that. So, if the Electrotren chassis is 'near enough', the 1361 should be as well and, as already mentioned I think, the 1361s (Kernow or Heljan) have finer wheel profiles.

 

Fair enough - I didn't want to buy one to measure up without knowing I could use it for something, so that's useful info. 

 

Maybe another option to add to the pile then! 

[Mark Dickerson]

On 01/01/2021 at 14:17, TurboSnail said:

I don't want to say the Electrotren wouldn't fit the Italia, but it would certainly need modifications, probably to both the body and the chassis. I have successfully fitted a smaller motor to the chassis before so that's another option. All depends on the amount of work you want to do really! I've added a lot of weight to my S100, which really helped it run well on this chassis, so it can be a good thing.

Interesting - what was the motor, and did you use the Electrotren worm? I mention as the worm and mounting bracket look like they're different on the latest model with the more open cab, e.g. E0044 and alternatives for spares are always useful.

[TurboSnail]

48 minutes ago, Mark Dickerson said:

Interesting - what was the motor, and did you use the Electrotren worm? I mention as the worm and mounting bracket look like they're different on the latest model with the more open cab, e.g. E0044 and alternatives for spares are always useful.

 

I reused the worm on a small motor from my spares box, possibly an N30. I didn't have a mounting bracket for it, just made up the right height with plasticard shims and glued it in.

[carlwebus]

Following Butler Henderson's  link to Monk Bar Models I bought the Hornby B2 at their sale price.  Ordered yesterday. Came  today! Fantastic  service.   Now got to get the Italia  body kit from Hardies. Looks good value for money - even including crew.

 

Like the comment I r ead on another string: "Wish he'd get a hobby   and stop spending all that time on model railways"!

 

(I've just been accused of being "obsessed" by the household authority).