RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 2, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 2, 2021 (edited) With the Bachmann model in the shops why should anybody want to build one from a kit? I have the LMS version Bachmann produce but wanted a Belpaire one. Not wishing to butcher a Bachmann BR condensing one, a kit was the way to go especially as a fellow modeller on here was offering one for sale, at very reasonable cost, complete with all the bits and bobs. The chassis was started first and by the end of the first day I got this far. The kit was originally intended for a Hornby X04 motor and had I read ALL the instructions I needn't have reinforced the frames where the motor front would have been mounted but they don't get in the way of anything, so only a little time lost. The large frame spacer has a slot for the original gear wheel which would foul the High Level gearbox so it had to be cut in two. Next up will be getting the gearbox in and hopefully running smoothly if I can get the quartering right as the wheels are Alan Gibson when I am used to Romfords/Markits. Edited January 29, 2021 by Rowsley17D 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Blandford1969 Posted January 2, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 2, 2021 Looking good so far, building your own means it is totally yours and not just another off the shelf. I'd gone one further and designed my own etched version of it. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 I've built several of these lovely kits already, and there's one untouched kit and one eBay 'rescue' in the roundtuit cupboard. Enjoy the build. High Level is definitely the way to go, motor/gearbox wise. Yes, you could fit an XO4 or equivalent, but these days it's not worth the aggravation of getting the weight balance right and, of course, having to hide the motor from view. Unless, of course, you have an XO4 and want to save money... Mark 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 2, 2021 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 2, 2021 No Mark, the motor came as part of the deal except the vendor forgot to put it in. It's on its way as the motor I have in store has a large diameter shaft whereas the gearbox with the kit is for the narrower motor shaft .The bogie is a bit crude so I am hoping one day Brassmasters might produce one of their detailing kits. I hope to replicate Bachmann's fixing of the bogie too with a slot in the bogie body so it can slide on a sprung fixing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold ROSSPOP Posted January 2, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 2, 2021 One of my old 4mm time favourite kits.................................. 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted January 2, 2021 Share Posted January 2, 2021 16 minutes ago, Rowsley17D said: No Mark, the motor came as part of the deal except the vendor forgot to put it in. It's on its way as the motor I have in store has a large diameter shaft whereas the gearbox with the kit is for the narrower motor shaft .The bogie is a bit crude so I am hoping one day Brassmasters might produce one of their detailing kits. I hope to replicate Bachmann's fixing of the bogie too with a slot in the bogie body so it can slide on a sprung fixing. Oops! Yes, XO4s are 2mm shaft; most small modern motors are 1.5mm. For what it's worth, I built mine as per the kit, with a light spring to put a small load on the bogie, more to help with keeping it on the track than weight transfer. (I did the same with a Jidenco/Falcon Brass Kirtley 0-4-4WT). Filling the boiler with plenty of lead helped too. All my 0-4-4Ts (I've built assorted G5s and a G6 too) have benefitted from plenty of extra weight over the drivers. Mark 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N15class Posted January 3, 2021 Share Posted January 3, 2021 5 hours ago, MarkC said: Yes, XO4s are 2mm shaft; most small modern motors are 1.5mm. I think you will find the X04 is an imperial size shaft, 3/32" I think. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 3, 2021 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2021 14 hours ago, ROSSPOP said: One of my old 4mm time favourite kits.................................. I only hope mine runs that smoothly when finished - a lovely job. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted January 3, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 3, 2021 I built one many years ago and modified the frames to give a better weight distribution. I rested the weight on the front axle and the bogie pivot and gave the rear driving axle a small amount of up and down play. It was held down to the track by the weight of the motor and gearbox. It wasn't very scientific and many people would frown at such an arrangement but I was very young and it did work! I am not usually a fan of compensation/springing in 4mm scale EM gauge but for a 4-4-0 or 0-4-4 wheel arrangement, I do find that something like that helps, rather than having all the weight at one end and a long overhang. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 3, 2021 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2021 A slotted mount was made for the bogie pivot out of 30 thou Plastikard and was superglued to the frame. For the time being I'm leaving the swinging arm off although it's still on in the photo. A light spring was put in between the slotted mount and the top of the bogie. This is as far as the chassis is going until the motor arrives. A start was made on the body and here are the end of play for today photos. 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 4, 2021 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 4, 2021 (edited) As I wait for the motor to arrive, more body work has been done. There are no half-etched lines as on some kits to guide you where the various sections should go so progress is slow in order to get things right. By the close of today's play most of the soldering work has been finished and here the white metal parts are just put into position and await cleaning up. I'm trying to work out how to attach beading to the bunker and tank tops without making a mess. The cab roof is not fixed as I want to fit a back-head. The hole is where the Hornby motor would have been. Anybody got a back-head going spare? I let a fellow modeller have one I had before the kit offer came along, Typical! Edited January 4, 2021 by Rowsley17D 6 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted January 4, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 4, 2021 I take it a Hornby rebuilt Patriot/Scot one be of no use? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 4, 2021 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 4, 2021 6 minutes ago, farren said: I take it a Hornby rebuilt Patriot/Scot one be of no use? Any chance of a photo, Farren? Thanks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jub45565 Posted January 4, 2021 Share Posted January 4, 2021 Looking good! I have one at the primer stage (in P4, on the test bed Rumney chassis) which has a bit of coverage on the scalefour forum. I've covered a few bits of detailing I did there, but the Craftsman kit is certainly a good basis! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted January 4, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 4, 2021 This 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jub45565 Posted January 4, 2021 Share Posted January 4, 2021 I used an Alan Gibson backhead - though 247 developments also do one. There are various other fittings from Alan Gibson which could be used - smokebox door, whistle, chimney, buffers, push pull equipment if applicable - depending on the loco you're doing, and how far you wish to go. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Izzy Posted January 4, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 4, 2021 I built quite a few of these, to P4, back in the 1980's. The beading can be best added I think by tinning the underside of the fret and sweating into place aided by liquid flux. IIRC there is a half etch line to aid location - or am I thinking of different kits. The basic construction was common to all Craftsman kits, basic but well etched and produced a good basis on which detail could be added to taste. I like the slot design for the bogie you have made. I always fixed mine and used split-axle collection with hornblocks on the drivers. Could get around radius down to about 30" and stopped the bunker from throwing around. Mostly fitted round can motors drivng Gibson gearboxes on the front axle as the large splashers hid most of it. This was of course well before Mashima motors and High level boxes arrived. Much better choices now. Will you finish it in the red lined livery, suits them nicely. ( sorry for the cr***y old film shots) 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 5, 2021 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 5, 2021 11 hours ago, Jub45565 said: I used an Alan Gibson backhead - though 247 developments also do one. There are various other fittings from Alan Gibson which could be used - smokebox door, whistle, chimney, buffers, push pull equipment if applicable - depending on the loco you're doing, and how far you wish to go. 11 hours ago, Izzy said: I built quite a few of these, to P4, back in the 1980's. The beading can be best added I think by tinning the underside of the fret and sweating into place aided by liquid flux. IIRC there is a half etch line to aid location - or am I thinking of different kits. The basic construction was common to all Craftsman kits, basic but well etched and produced a good basis on which detail could be added to taste. I like the slot design for the bogie you have made. I always fixed mine and used split-axle collection with hornblocks on the drivers. Could get around radius down to about 30" and stopped the bunker from throwing around. Mostly fitted round can motors drivng Gibson gearboxes on the front axle as the large splashers hid most of it. This was of course well before Mashima motors and High level boxes arrived. Much better choices now. Will you finish it in the red lined livery, suits them nicely. ( sorry for the cr***y old film shots) I'll be going down the push-pull route so the extras will come in handy although I do have sprung buffers in stock. I will try and line it and also the Bachmann one I have. It's a pity they didn't produce an LMS lined one from the off. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold ianLMS Posted January 6, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 6, 2021 The Craftsman 0-4-4T kit was the first loco kit i ever attempted. Lovely little model. I know your effort will turn out a lot better than mine did though!! Ian 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 6, 2021 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 6, 2021 A couple of sessions to catch up on. The motor arrived yesterday and was fitted to the gearbox. Because of the position of the fixing holes it has to sit at an angle. Which meant removing some of the frame top where the old Hornby motor would have gone to make the motor sit horizontally in the body. The set-up ran smoothly enough with just the one driving wheel in place. The coupling rods were built up and the crank pin holes carefully opened out on the unpowered set until there was no binding. A current collector was made and superglued to the chassis. It ran okay on DC on a short length of track. Then the brake gear was attached. The brake cylinder seemed not to have an attachment so one side was filed flat, stuck to a small square of 30thou Plastikard and glued to the frame. Brass boiler fittings have been ordered so the white metal ones are just lodged on for the time being. Alan Gibson's push-pull gear is not available for some time and I cannot find anybody else who makes one so one will have to be scratch-built unless somebody has one spare? Two sisters. 11 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold ianLMS Posted January 8, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 8, 2021 Looking very nice Jonathan!! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 8, 2021 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 8, 2021 1 hour ago, ianLMS said: Looking very nice Jonathan!! Thanks, just waiting for the brass fitments to arrive. It will be sometime before I can paint it as I use my garage and it's far too cold in there until Spring, so it will stay in the "brass" for now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold ianLMS Posted January 8, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 8, 2021 3 hours ago, Rowsley17D said: Thanks, just waiting for the brass fitments to arrive. It will be sometime before I can paint it as I use my garage and it's far too cold in there until Spring, so it will stay in the "brass" for now. I have the same issue. I can only use aerosol cans in the shed so during the winter I keep my spray cans indoors then take them out when I need them. I then dry the primer coat using an old hair dryer, and bring them back inside to completely dry overnight. I use an airbrush for the top coat and i have a booth with the vent hose sticking out the window. I usually wait to do this when the wife has gone to work or out shopping mind! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jack Benson Posted January 8, 2021 Share Posted January 8, 2021 Jonathan, What motor/gearbox combination are you using, perchance a Mitsumi? Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Rowsley17D Posted January 8, 2021 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted January 8, 2021 1 hour ago, Jack Benson said: Jonathan, What motor/gearbox combination are you using, perchance a Mitsumi? Cheers Hi Jack, the motor is a Mitsumi with a High Level Road Runner 1:30 gearbox. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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