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Buying and Selling models to/from Europe


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3 minutes ago, Cor-onGRT4 said:

Hope this will help a bit.

Jazeker. Bedankt. It looks like Hattons will be my go-to retailer unless there are any others that ship DDP. It's a shame they're not on good terms with Hornby at the moment but that is a different can of worms.

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1 minute ago, LimboBrit said:

Jazeker. Bedankt. It looks like Hattons will be my go-to retailer unless there are any others that ship DDP. It's a shame they're not on good terms with Hornby at the moment but that is a different can of worms.

As far I know Hattons is the only one till now thats Shipping DDP to, I believe 7 countries in the EU.

And for new Hornby items I go to Kernow now, before I did also , but only for their own released limited editions, and some bargains.

I ordered some bargain coaches a few weeks ago and they deduct the UK VAT, so only pay the dutch BTW [vat] and Post NL fees of €13,-.

It was still very cheap compared to other shops [€ 100,- cheaper for 4 coaches], only new items ar sligthly expensiver, a new SR Merchant will be arround including all extra cost, about €230,- compared with Hattons it would had be including all € 201,- , it is the higher shipping cost and handlingfees that makes it costlier when shipping from Kernow, not the dutch BTW.

But there are not many shops anymore that ship to EU  because all the fuss about documents. 

Hattons, Kernow and Rails of Sheffield I rely on from now, many shops I ordered from before don't ship anymore.

 

Hopefully Hattons may sell new Hornby items a few months after the release, they still get older items on stock, so

not totally banned from Hornby.

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14 minutes ago, Cor-onGRT4 said:

it is the higher shipping cost and handlingfees that makes it costlier when shipping from Kernow, not the dutch BTW.

Yesterday I took delivery of a new Hornby Class 31 from Kernow but they put the wrong code on the customs form so I ended up paying 4.7% import duty when a 0% tariff should have been applied. I needed to shift a Hornby pre-order from Hattons to Kernow which is still pending. Hopefully they won't make the same mistake again.

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2 hours ago, LimboBrit said:

Yesterday I took delivery of a new Hornby Class 31 from Kernow

I needed to shift a Hornby pre-order from Hattons to Kernow which is still pending. 

Why not order Hornby direct from their site? They have an EU warehouse they can ship from (I don't know if the UK model range are there). Then you don't need to pay the VAT & service fee of PostNL and soon you don't have issues with the CE.

 

Ed

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20 hours ago, etendam said:

Why not order Hornby direct from their site? They have an EU warehouse they can ship from (I don't know if the UK model range are there). Then you don't need to pay the VAT & service fee of PostNL and soon you don't have issues with the CE.

 

Ed

It is not advisable to order direct from Hornby, on their site it still says outside UK to Europe  7-10 days delivery time, so obvios they are still shipping from the UK. 

Beside this you pay full RRP and shipping cost of 14,95 pound if you order less than 150,00 pound , above this amount shipping to the Netherlands is free, but you don't know iff they deduct UK VAT, so overall till it is clear they official EU based, I should not order directly from Hornby.

A few months ago in the Guardian news paper was an article , Hornby was mentioned to settle an EU base, but till now nothing has confirmed, neither Hornby has anything on their site about shipping from the EU to EU customers.

So as long there is no official statement from Hornby about this. I would not speculate about this.

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39 minutes ago, Cor-onGRT4 said:

It is not advisable to order direct from Hornby, on their site it still says outside UK to Europe  7-10 days delivery time, so obvios they are still shipping from the UK. 

Beside this you pay full RRP and shipping cost of 14,95 pound if you order less than 150,00 pound , above this amount shipping to the Netherlands is free, but you don't know iff they deduct UK VAT, so overall till it is clear they official EU based, I should not order directly from Hornby.

A few months ago in the Guardian news paper was an article , Hornby was mentioned to settle an EU base, but till now nothing has confirmed, neither Hornby has anything on their site about shipping from the EU to EU customers.

So as long there is no official statement from Hornby about this. I would not speculate about this.

 

Hornby will, of course, be set up to provide all the necessary documentation/permit holders etc for CE marking. They need to do it for the Hornby International range. They should also already be set up as VAT registered in a lot of countries in the EU - again because they already need to be, as they operate there

 

This is one case where the manufacturer will certainly already be able to ship into the EU. Better even than Hattons

 

Yes, you will pay full RRP if you buy from the Hornby website but otherwise I cannot see any reason not to order from them.

 

Bachmann should be a similar situation, though I don't think they sell direct in the same way

 

Bachmann and I think Hornby already have the relevant "not intended for children under 14 years old" statement printed on all packaging, and have done for years

 

As already noted , scale models and parts for scale models are explicitly exempted in the Regulation  from the "toy " requirements, so etendam's warnings seem rather over the top

 

France apparently bans sending of books to its territory from outside the EU by post/courier, to protect the Republic from subversive literature. So if you order a Middleton Press line history - French Customs will sieze it to neutralise the threat it poses to the Republic.... 

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It's unlikely that Hornby will ever make their UK range readily accessible to EU customers. There will be less demand for it than there is for the International range in the UK, and that has been hard to obtain. Harder than most of the other "continental" brands. Some if not all Hornby items are available from Amazon.co.uk.

 

Bachmann do not supply direct — they only supply through "bricks and mortar" model shops.

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4 hours ago, Ravenser said:

As already noted , scale models and parts for scale models are explicitly exempted in the Regulation  from the "toy " requirements, so etendam's warnings seem rather over the top

 

Whilst they may seem over the top, @etendam has experience selling across continents/countries etc, and so I'm sure he is speaking from a degree of experience.

As I have stated before, I am not 100% confident that the couriers will handle these deliveries correctly, even though the paperwork side may well be perfect, once they decide to go down a route, it's one hell of a job to divert them, or return them to the correct application, once they've got your goods/money then they have the upper hand.

 

Mike.

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13 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

Whilst they may seem over the top, @etendam has experience selling across continents/countries etc, and so I'm sure he is speaking from a degree of experience.

As I have stated before, I am not 100% confident that the couriers will handle these deliveries correctly, even though the paperwork side may well be perfect, once they decide to go down a route, it's one hell of a job to divert them, or return them to the correct application, once they've got your goods/money then they have the upper hand.

 

Mike.

It is exactly what mike described, Parts are exempted from CE Markings AND the customs will not check every delivery as well. So in 9 out of 10 cases the missing CE markings and the details of the authorized representative will not be an issue.....unless the correct paperwork needs to be uploaded. The same situation will happen on EU - UK shipments in the future when the UKCA mark becomes mandatory. Carriers will have to changes their policies (and check if the correct paperwork has been uploaded) for the customs as they work on behalf of the customs when it comes to importing items.

 

As expected this year we will have the first frustrating posts about the customs or carriers that will hold shipments. I see this already what is going wrong with the VAT on several posts. This just frustrates buyers and a non happy buyer will not continue shopping from that supplier if things are going wrong a few times.

 

The rules on Amazon (very strict when listing a item in a toy category) or eBay (less strict) will prevent us from listing items on other selling places or ship items to other countries.

 

My wife's company has more than 3000 parcel shipments a year, so we are also affected now and then by changing regulations we have to deal with. To keep updated about changes we are informed by the bookkeeper / financial advisor and make use of an advisor that works at the EU. What I notice is that some companies are poorly advised. If you have to get the news from a forum you are always to late to take the correct actions.

 

A good adviser costs a lot money but in the long term you win as you are a few steps ahead of the competition. (I see that Hornby is also making use of advisers as they are also usually the first one that act to changes in a changing market)

 

Ed

Edited by etendam
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A further warning for my Spanish colleagues.

Do not under any circumstances use a delivery method from the UK which involves SEUR in any part of the progress.

I have previously mentioned on here about the general uselessness of them, but they have now excelled themselves with a parcel of my own eBay/small manufacturer goodies being sent by my daughter in the UK.

Despite having charged and taken the IVA and handling fee, entering my shipment number in their tracker shows that they have no record of my package.

An email to them has been totally ignored, (no surprise there then, a carbon copy of what happened last time), so my daughter has had to contact the original broker (EcoParcel) in the UK, luckily as UK customer service is leagues ahead of the FOSAMINI attitude prevalent in Spain they have been making efforts to solve the problem.

It left the UK with DPD, and after their enquiries it turns out that SEUR have managed to lose the parcel, and my daughter has had to give as much information on the appearance and contents of the package so a manual search can be done.

Seur have had the parcel in their possession for above two weeks, but obviously had no intention of telling me what was going on, so I repeat my warning;

AVOID SEUR AT ALL COSTS.

 

Mike.

 

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On 04/07/2021 at 08:14, Enterprisingwestern said:

AVOID SEUR AT ALL COSTS.

 

Mike.

 

The issue however is that you can't choose who your shipper uses as a partner for the local delivery. If you use DHL, UPS or Fedex or similar then you are sure that they will also deliver the parcel as they are in almost every country available. The costs for some countries however are 2 or 3 times higher than the rates when using DPD or the regular Postal service. With Postal services we had some difficulties in the past as they use company A this time and next week company B to deliver the shipment. Can I choose a favorite .........ehhhh No.

 

Can't you claim the insurance for your lost shipment or is that to early?

 

Ed

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2 minutes ago, etendam said:

Can't you claim the insurance for your lost shipment or is that to early?

 

Luckily, I declared the correct value so it would be well covered, however, thanks to EcoParcel's efforts from the UK, SEUR now seem to have located the package and it is now showing as in transit, but amazingly instead of SEUR notifying me of this fact, they have this afternoon sent me a refund of my taxes and admin fees, so anything could happen!

To avoid SEUR I think the only way is to only use Royal Mail/Correos, a bit pricier, but far safer.

 

Mike.

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On 04/07/2021 at 07:14, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

A further warning for my Spanish colleagues.

Do not under any circumstances use a delivery method from the UK which involves SEUR in any part of the progress.

...

It left the UK with DPD, and after their enquiries it turns out that SEUR have managed to lose the parcel, an

AVOID SEUR AT ALL COSTS.

 

Mike.

 

 

Agree. SEUR in Spain and Portugal is DPD elsewhere. Haven't seen a SEUR labelled van for yonks here in Portugal - they now seem to be putting DPD on them instead.

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23 hours ago, etendam said:

If u use DHL, UPS or Fedex or similar then you are sure that they will also deliver the parcel as they are in almost every country available.

Not true, at least in the case of DHL. Pre-Brexit, they did indeed deliver their own parcels in the UK. Whilst they are still present in the UK, without exception every parcel I've received post-Brexit that was despatched by DHL (from Germany) was delivered by Parcelforce.

 

So being present in the country doesn't mean they'll deliver the parcel.

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23 minutes ago, D9020 Nimbus said:

Not true, at least in the case of DHL. Pre-Brexit, they did indeed deliver their own parcels in the UK. Whilst they are still present in the UK, without exception every parcel I've received post-Brexit that was despatched by DHL (from Germany) was delivered by Parcelforce.

 

So being present in the country doesn't mean they'll deliver the parcel.

This is because you have DHL (or DHL Parcel) AND DHL Express. DHL express is a worldwide shipper that is present in almost every country, more expensive and deliver within a few days around the world. They deliver their own parcels. Our motors from China are usually supplied within 3 or 4 days. (They don't make a difference in the weekend!)

DHL parcel is a European service that also works together with other shippers as in your example and is more affordable. The Same as DPD / SEUR they always pick the most cost effective solution.

 

We just had several DPD - SEUR shipments and one is still out for delivery and 2 have been delivered.

 

Ed

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DHL seems to handle most parcels in Germany, then handing them to the domestic mail and parcel provider at the border, so I get things despatched from German by DHL, arriving here via La Poste.

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19 hours ago, D9020 Nimbus said:

Not true, at least in the case of DHL. Pre-Brexit, they did indeed deliver their own parcels in the UK. Whilst they are still present in the UK, without exception every parcel I've received post-Brexit that was despatched by DHL (from Germany) was delivered by Parcelforce.

 

So being present in the country doesn't mean they'll deliver the parcel.

 

Based on my 3 arrivals from Germany, the 2 bigger boxes have come Parcelforce (one with a VAT demand one without), the one smaller one came Royal Mail. So I wonder if size of the box is a factor ?

 

Just a thought.

 

Neil

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3 hours ago, Oldddudders said:

DHL seems to handle most parcels in Germany, then handing them to the domestic mail and parcel provider at the border, so I get things despatched from German by DHL, arriving here via La Poste.

Seems different for every country, did received two shippings from Modellbahn Union last two months, send by DHL and received by DHL.

In just 3 days, got an email from DHL they were deliver between so and so late a timescale of three hours, very neat.

Get al my parcels from Hattons over a year now by DPD road, also about three days except if there's a weekend between it takes a day or two longer,DPD is in an one hour time scale for delivering time at your door even better than DHL.

But the only one time I received my DPD shipping by air [ no road option at that moment at Hattons first weeks after Brexit], I received it by DHL air,

Road option is as fast as by air, it don't go trough many Hubs.

My first order from Kernow this year, was shipped by Royal Mail and handeld over to Dutch post, in a week, so this one was fast .

But I am now waiting my Dapol D class from Rails of Sheffield shipped by them on 24 June and because I still have not received it,I ask Rails the trackingnumber, look at Parcelforce it was exported from the UK at international hub on 26 June and there it ends.

Not registrated in delivery country, phoned GLS the Dutch partner of Parcelforce, they have no other information other than the Parcelforce tracking.

So will this mean it is at Dutch customs but not registered as in the Netherlands.

I will wait a few days longer and than i will contact Parcelforce ,as advised by GLS.

So shipping with courier does not always it will go faster, because Kernows shipping with Royal Mail was here in a week time  including customs

clearing. 

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1 hour ago, Cor-onGRT4 said:

But I am now waiting my Dapol D class from Rails of Sheffield shipped by them on 24 June and because I still have not received it,I ask Rails the trackingnumber, look at Parcelforce it was exported from the UK at international hub on 26 June and there it ends.

A couple of weeks ago I took delivery of a Class 31. It was stuck at Dutch customs for two weeks. Eventually it cleared and was delivered but only after I had paid BTW but also import duties (4.7%) to PostNL because the wrong code had been used on the customs declaration.

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36 minutes ago, LimboBrit said:

A couple of weeks ago I took delivery of a Class 31. It was stuck at Dutch customs for two weeks. Eventually it cleared and was delivered but only after I had paid BTW but also import duties (4.7%) to PostNL because the wrong code had been used on the customs declaration.

Thanks, it's now eleven days, looks like I have to wait till the end of the week begining next week before clearance trough customs.

Does it means as long it is at the Dutch customs there is no tracking since leaving the UK ?

Can you only after clearance of the customs track the parcel again?

Hope Rails added the right custom documents, and no extra 4.7 % import duties are charged.

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8 minutes ago, Cor-onGRT4 said:

Does it means as long it is at the Dutch customs there is no tracking since leaving the UK ?

 

Can't speak for the Netherlands, but any parcel with a "standard" shall we say tracking number (2letters,numbers,country code) should be trackable through the sending and receiving country's national carrier, including to say being processed by customs. It works for me in the case for Portugal and Italy.

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31 minutes ago, Cor-onGRT4 said:

Does it means as long it is at the Dutch customs there is no tracking since leaving the UK ?

Can you only after clearance of the customs track the parcel again?

In my case tracking worked up to the point it arrived at Dutch customs. There were no further updates until the package was cleared and handed to PostNL.

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45 minutes ago, LimboBrit said:

In my case tracking worked up to the point it arrived at Dutch customs. There were no further updates until the package was cleared and handed to PostNL.

Well that's an coincidence , just take a look on Parcelforce tracking and it says arrived in destination country at 14:00 today 7 July at

 Den Haag inbound.

It must be just updated this last hour, because an hour ago it was not stated as this on the tracking.

So I think it will be here soon, after payment of customs duties and VAT.

Looking forward for this exclusive D class loco in SR livery

 

Thanks

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