Buying and Selling models to/from Europe

[Andy Hayter]

Then it is just like a private seller.  VAT registration depends on VAT taxable turnover in the UK and above the set level of £85k you are required to register.

[henkholland]

It is no longer fun to buy a loco in England.
In the Netherlands we have to pay VAT and also customs clearance fees as well as processing fees to the carrier.
This applies to everything from outside the EU from 0 euro.
Example : bought a locomotive for 220 euros in England and had to pay a total of 53 euros for the above items.
Normally without corona I come to England every year but that is not so easy now.
So for the first time no new rail products from GB for me.
Build an English track in N, there is nothing for sale in the Netherlands for that, unfortunately.
So it's no fun on this side of the border either

[bbishop]

Henk, may I ask you some questions?

 

• did the British exporter remove the British VAT from the transaction?
• are you charged customs duty in the Netherlands for model railway equipment?

imports into Britain  receive a Commodity Code and the model railway code incurs zero customs duty.  I only paid British VAT and a processing fee of about £10-00 on the import detailed on this thread towards the end of 2021.

 

Bill

 

[Andy Hayter]

Looks like VAT.  Dutch VAT is 21% so on 220 Euros that is 46.2 plus a service fee from Dutch postal services.

[LimboBrit]

On 14/01/2022 at 23:09, SimonBoulton said:

 

They could only deduct the UK VAT if they are a business. Private sellers don’t charge VAT 

Exactly, which is why it is no longer as interesting for me to buy second hand stuff on EBay from the UK when Ebay automatically adds 21% Dutch VAT

[irishmail]

Has anyone had any orders or delivery's from Hatton's this year?   If so did you encounter any problems or delays?    Ordered an item on 5th January, posted 6th January, Royal Mail 3-5 day delivery, as yet 20th January nothing.   

 

Pity Hatton's don't use DPD to ship to Ireland. Ordered an item from Screwfix.ie on Monday, it being shipped from England and will be delivered today.  If DPD can deliver why can't Anpost?

[SimonBoulton]

8 minutes ago, irishmail said:

Has anyone had any orders or delivery's from Hatton's this year?   If so did you encounter any problems or delays?    Ordered an item on 5th January, posted 6th January, Royal Mail 3-5 day delivery, as yet 20th January nothing.   

 

Pity Hatton's don't use DPD to ship to Ireland. Ordered an item from Screwfix.ie on Monday, it being shipped from England and will be delivered today.  If DPD can deliver why can't Anpost?

Have you tried asking Hattons if using DPD could be a option? 

 

[irishmail]

11 minutes ago, SimonBoulton said:

Have you tried asking Hattons if using DPD could be a option? 

 

No not as yet,  however if its not delivered tomorrow I will email Hattons about the  order and will also ask if they would be able to use DPD for shipping.

[LimboBrit]

1 hour ago, irishmail said:

Ordered an item on 5th January, posted 6th January, Royal Mail 3-5 day delivery, as yet 20th January nothing.

I can beat that. Sound decoder ordered from YouChos on 16th December, shipped 18th. Arrived in Netherlands on 22nd and has been stuck with PostNL awaiting customs clearance ever since. I called PostNL yesterday and they told me it was with Dutch Customs which is a barefaced lie because that is not how it works. The website of Customs even states that couriers often claim it is with Customs when using track and trace when in fact it is held at the courier's warehouse. Customs only very rarely physically check a shipment when they have a suspicion that it could contain something illegal. PostNL even refuse to accept a complaint until 30 days have passed. Roll on Saturday!

[irishmail]

3 hours ago, LimboBrit said:

I can beat that. Sound decoder ordered from YouChos on 16th December, shipped 18th. Arrived in Netherlands on 22nd and has been stuck with PostNL awaiting customs clearance ever since. I called PostNL yesterday and they told me it was with Dutch Customs which is a barefaced lie because that is not how it works. The website of Customs even states that couriers often claim it is with Customs when using track and trace when in fact it is held at the courier's warehouse. Customs only very rarely physically check a shipment when they have a suspicion that it could contain something illegal. PostNL even refuse to accept a complaint until 30 days have passed. Roll on Saturday!

More or less the same here in Ireland  but is seems that Anpost (Irish postal system) are making aright meal of it.

[henkholland]

Hello, another comment from the Netherlands.  What I wrote earlier, I had to pay VAT, customs clearance and the carrier, for which I received an email to pay the stated amount, I did not do this, I wanted to see if the package was in good condition.  Ordered the J39 from Wickness at the beginning of November , Douglas posted it after a few days, Royal mail did the same and sent it to Holland and than, after a mont I contacted Douglas and he was very helpful and wrote that he would refund the money if the train was not delivered before X mas.

Wickness is a great shop. 

I phoned several times with Post.nl but no result. 

1 day before Christmas, the doorbell rang and the locomotive was delivered to me and, strangely enough, that happened without I had paid the VAT, etc.  Al ends well in the end.

Resume before Brexit a pakket was iat home within a week, now I waited 2 months. I don't buy online in England anymore and wait for the time that will come without Corona restrictions.

The J39 runs great on my Arduino wifi controlled through my phone.

Wicness did a great job.

[LimboBrit]

53 minutes ago, henkholland said:

I don't buy online in England anymore and wait for the time that will come without Corona restrictions.

If you know of a supplier of sound decoders with British sound files in the EU I would be very interested. Ordering online from the UK in my experience is not an issue providing you avoid using PostNL and the supplier deducts UK VAT

[Gordonwis]

Just received an N gauge SNCF loco from a French retailer selling on ebay. Cheaper than UK sources and has arrived here in the normal Royal Mail post through my letter box with no further questions asked... 

[SimonBoulton]

12 hours ago, Gordonwis said:

Just received an N gauge SNCF loco from a French retailer selling on ebay. Cheaper than UK sources and has arrived here in the normal Royal Mail post through my letter box with no further questions asked... 

 

Was it below £135 Gordon? 

[TTDB]

2 hours ago, SimonBoulton said:

 

Was it below £135 Gordon? 

I had to pay VAT and a £7 duty on my Liliputt HO 614 total with post was £190 I’m looking into getting the £7 duty back, everything else I have recently purchased has been below the  £135 so no duty was paid but I’ve some NME wagons and with post are a tad over £138 so will see if this attracts attention 

[Gordonwis]

12 hours ago, SimonBoulton said:

 

Was it below £135 Gordon? 

 

No, nearer  £150. I said cheaper than UK because UK price looks like it will be around £180 excluding any postage

 

I took a gamble on the basis that even if I ended up paying extra on arrival it would be the same as what looks like the UK price will be

 

 

 

Edited January 22, 2022 by Gordonwis

[etendam]

On 15/01/2022 at 14:50, Jol Wilkinson said:

What happens if a business is not VAT registered.

Then you should NOT be on Ebay as a business seller. 

 

As said VAT registration depends on VAT taxable turnover in the UK and above the set level of £85k you are required to register BUT you can always choose to be VAT registered. If you want to sell on Marketplaces (Ebay, Amazon and the rest) imported stuff, you can't get your paid VAT back and they will deduct the VAT on Payments. When you start a business and have to invest a lot in your stock/machinery you get more capital free to invest as you get the VAT back.  If your company grows and you are selling above the £85k you must register for the VAT but then you can't get the VAT back on the investments you once made. If your sales are above the treshold your earnings are then also about 17% (100/120*100%) less then before and then the questions rise if you can still make a profit. Your stock is also de-valuated if you are above the £85k with 17%.

 

I have seen growing UK companies in the past that reached the £85k and then raised the prices with 20% and then lost a lot of their buyers as the competition had better prices. In the EU the register requirements are MUCH less to avoid this. (In the Netherlands € 20K).

 

So you should always think twice if you start a growing business.

 

Ed 

[Jonboy]

46 minutes ago, etendam said:

  If your company grows and you are selling above the £85k you must register for the VAT but then you can't get the VAT back on the investments you once made…..

 

…..So you should always think twice if you start a growing business.

 

 

In the uk you can generally claim VAT on tools/equipment/stock etc still in the company’s possession at time of VAT registration if they were purchased in the last four years in such a situation:

 

 https://www.gov.uk/vat-registration/purchases-made-before-registration 

 

 

Agree completely with your final line

[etendam]

On 21/01/2022 at 16:02, TTDB said:

I had to pay VAT and a £7 duty on my Liliputt HO 614 total with post was £190 I’m looking into getting the £7 duty back, everything else I have recently purchased has been below the  £135 so no duty was paid but I’ve some NME wagons and with post are a tad over £138 so will see if this attracts attention 

 

The £7 duty must be the carrier fee and no duty.

 

Ed

[Andy Hayter]

Just been relieved of €50 for the delivery of my Rails LNWR 2-4-0. Modelling UK railways is becoming as expensive as modelling French railways.

[Enterprisingwestern]

2 hours ago, Andy Hayter said:

Just been relieved of €50 for the delivery of my Rails LNWR 2-4-0. Modelling UK railways is becoming as expensive as modelling French railways.

 

 
Don't knock it, at least in France you get deliveries of locomotives from Rails!

 

Mike.

[SimonBoulton]

Would like to ask a question to those of you located in Europe, I have just seen a locomotive listed on ebay for sale in the UK but with shipping available to the rest of the world. The seller has stated that for European buyers, if it sells for less than the equivalent of 150 euros, there will be no more tax to pay, is that true? I thought Ebay added the VAT and if you buy goods from the UK worth less than 150 euro, do you get charged for your local sales tax (VAT) before delivery? 

[LimboBrit]

2 hours ago, SimonBoulton said:

The seller has stated that for European buyers, if it sells for less than the equivalent of 150 euros, there will be no more tax to pay, is that true?

As I understand it, eBay is responsible for collecting VAT in the country of the purchaser. In principle the UK seller should deduct UK VAT from the selling price.

[Nick C]

24 minutes ago, LimboBrit said:

 In principle the UK seller should deduct UK VAT from the selling price.

But only if they're a VAT registered business seller - not if it's a secondhand item being sold by a private seller.

[LimboBrit]

1 hour ago, Nick C said:

But only if they're a VAT registered business seller - not if it's a secondhand item being sold by a private seller.

That's where the problem lies. eBay does not make a distinction between VAT registered vendors and private seller. For me, resident in the Netherlands, wanting to buy something second hand from a private seller, 21% Dutch VAT gets added by eBay which in may cases means it is no longer interesting. eBay's Global Shipping Program makes things even worse.