The Spare Bedroom Layout

[Lacathedrale]

1. My garden is looking good, but as I said I really need to build/have built a few live steam locos of a given gauge (either G1 or G3) - which is something I'm working towards alongside this thread - before I make any commitment for large scale designs.

 

2. Technically I could have a hinge-down section, but it would then block the door completely from opening so is a no-go. I know I could re-hang the door in theory, but in practice it's not feasible. A vertical traverser, maybe? @Zomboid that's what I mean about a 30" x 5" thin section behind the door - I'm not really prepared  to block it, but I might be tempted if there is a strong case for a taper rather than 'leg' off the end of the main layout.

 

Here's HV 1874 perfectly depicted (and almost dead to scale). Arrivals/departures are via cassettes stored vertically below the arrival/departure tracks (shown in dotted lines).

 

Holborn Viaduct Circa 1874 almost verbatim

 

The bottom/nearest platform is arrival only, two centre roads are bidirectional - one hosting an end loading dock, and the topmost platform is departure only. (More details hidden away in this thread:

Scenically, the station is on a viaduct, with the metropolitan extension on a steep gradient down at the front. Behind, the Belle Sauvage inn and yard. A ground-level road crosses under the throat and a taxi ramp/cart road comes up to platform level front-left, blocking the end of the M.E. tracks from view.

 

It is fairly straight-forward to superimpose the feel of HV into Minories, by adding the signature features - the carriage dock, the engine shed + water tower, the wooden platform over the M.E. Lines, which sink down into the stygian depths of Snow Hill at the front of the layout, and the end of the layout scenically terminated with the signal box over the same lines. Staging isn't actually too bad as long as train lengths are reasonable - two trains per road with a double slip to provide space for six trains total - more than enough IMO!

 

Holborn Viaduct circa 1899 (themed Minories)

 

ps. I note that after drawing this, the signal box should be well to the left, adjacent the mouth of the station throat - where it is currently situated in the plan is the start of Ludgate Hill station - an overall roof at this point would be a wonderful view block!

 

I'm going to investigate moving the period forward to NSE/etc. as well as what I might be able to do in 4mm in this space - stay tuned...

Edited April 30, 2021 by Lacathedrale

[Lacathedrale]

What I've found a little unexpected is that the HV-themed Minories is very close the 1951 plan of the layout flipped horizontally - and the plan of post-72 is almost identical to the 'real' Minories plan - save a loco spur.

 

As per my previously linked thread, I think I vastly prefer the LCDR era of 1874-1896 but I just can't think of a way I'd be able to come up with appropriate rolling stock. Annoyingly, it would be much more straight forward in 4mm with the Hattons Genesis coaches and all of the SECR-liveried stock...

 

As something of a wildcard, my new house is back on LBSCR territory - my grandparents, my first house all backed onto the brighton mainline and here I am again - albeit 50 mi south! Here's a lovely picture of the local station, the arrow points to where today my desk is situated!

 

 

Maybe even MORE out of scope though

[Zomboid]

19 hours ago, Lacathedrale said:

I could re-hang the door in theory, but in practice it's not feasible.

How have you looked at that? If you can't hang it to open into the hall, might it work if you put the hinges on the other side but still open into the room?

[Lacathedrale]

43 minutes ago, Zomboid said:

How have you looked at that? If you can't hang it to open into the hall, might it work if you put the hinges on the other side but still open into the room?

 

If there is a really solid layout that would leverage the extra 2'6" I might consider it - for example, a jump from 2mm to 4mm for an equivalent plan - but I'd rather try to work within the existing parameters if possible. After all, this as mentioned is an office first, (future) bedroom second and space-for-a-layout third!

[Titanius Anglesmith]

59 minutes ago, Zomboid said:

How have you looked at that? If you can't hang it to open into the hall, might it work if you put the hinges on the other side but still open into the room?

 

Light switches are normally installed near the doorframe on the opposite side to where the door is hung. By rehanging the door on the opposite side it will probably obstruct access to the switch 

[TJ52]

Hi William,

 

A lovely photo of Haywards Heath station.

 

I have a suggestion. You have spent a lot of time thinking and planning along the lines of a HV/Minories concept. You have also said that a purpose built shed for the railway could follow in the fullness of time. As 4mm is the more viable option for the LCDR era how about building at least part of your terminus (or another segment of a larger layout) in the spare bedroom while building and accumulating the relevant stock? When you are in a position to move outdoors you would then have a head start on a full layout. I get the impression that the building of a model gives you at least as much pleasure of operation.

 

By the way, I'm just around the corner from you in Lindfield, so if you ever need another pair of hands to help move stuff feel free to ask.

 

Good luck,

 

Terry

[Lacathedrale]

I have thought about 4mm too - this is Minories in the HV 1874 guise - very 'early' railway so short wagons, 0-4-2 locomotives, etc. but it fits fairly well!

 

[Zomboid]

1 hour ago, Titanius Anglesmith said:

 

Light switches are normally installed near the doorframe on the opposite side to where the door is hung. By rehanging the door on the opposite side it will probably obstruct access to the switch 

I know, I've had a couple of rooms with that issue. It's not the end of the world though and can be dealt with pretty easily in most rooms.

 

It's definitely a downside to making that particular change though.

[Donw]

That could make a very nice layout.

 

Don

[Lacathedrale]

As per @Zomboid's thoughts I decided to explore what the 4mm version might look like going around the corner:

 

 

In my mind, having the layout behind the door and up against one wall reduces the incursion on 'daily life' greatly, which I think would mean it's less likely to end up being removed prematurely. As you can see however, by using a drop-leaf section to take it around a curve, a traditional FY is feasible (the details of which are just a sketch. With judicious measuring it might be possible to link up the FY and main layout in parallel for an 'exhibition' configuration, too.

 

In addition to the 'real' FY, the platforms can be lengthened slightly to take a larger loco and four 48' bogie coaches - quite enough to represent a boat train and long enough to 'realistically' swamp a train of four or six wheeled carriages.

 

This layout is of course somewhat predicated on the availability of early LCDR/LBSCR stock, kits, etc. (which is why I am suggesting 4mm as opposed to S-scale or 2mmFS).

 

[Lacathedrale]

Sketching in a few more details on the FY - by increasing the spacing between two tracks it could end up being a modelled 'shadow' station - like the aforementioned use of Ludgate Hill as a view block.  The increased width in this area could be used for a headshunt loco facility and carriage siding off the main station. A cheeky connection from the FY ladder to the TT makes it perform double duty:

 

 

Now, one can operate Minories solo and to a sequence timetable - there is room for two large trains and two short pre-loaded trains in the FY,  three in and four back.

There is a siding for empty stock movements (which were a non-trivial proportion of shunting work at an urban terminus) (like those over the river from Victoria)

There is also access to a turntable for loco turning and servicing (think, Cannon Street engine shed, on the 'wrong' side of the river to the station itself)

 

However, in the event there is another operator - one can 'run' both stations as interleaved layouts with bell codes, signalling, interlocking, etc.

 

 

[TJ52]

And of course, when CJF drew a later version with added modules a small turntable facility was included. If built in sections it could be expanded at a later date if required, as well as for exhibitions.

 

Terry

[Zomboid]

20 hours ago, Lacathedrale said:

As per @Zomboid's thoughts

Not sure what I said to give you that idea, but if you can use two walls then clearly the OO scope is much increased. How much I'd want to go down that road depends on when you foresee the room needing to be a bedroom. Though if it's a permanent bedroom then the train probably has to go completely; if it's just a guest room then if one or other of the stations was removable (perhaps only leaving batons on the wall) then it could switch between the two functions without too much pain.

 

The double terminus does give you a lot more operational scope. If you're so minded then you could do a LBSCR end and a BR-NSE end, though that would make it harder to suspend disbelief enough to operate as though both are fully fledged stations at the same time.

[Lacathedrale]

Well, your thoughts of leveraging the door space more directly if nothing else. You're right of course that a layout of that scope most definitely does impact the room. I guess if we pared back that part of the layout to a thin shelf of no more than about 6" wide then a sofa bed could easily fit underneath...

[woodenhead]

Is there a way you can build the bridge in front of the door so that the door is open when you are operating the railway.

 

Heaven forbid an accident should happen, but if the door is blocked by a railway no-one can entry or exit in an emergency.

[Zomboid]

16 hours ago, Lacathedrale said:

guess if we pared back that part of the layout to a thin shelf of no more than about 6" wide then a sofa bed could easily fit underneath...

Depends on the height as much as anything. If it's at typical waist height I think the sensible width would be less than if it were at chest height.

 

However wide you make it though, if there's a sofa bed to accommodate under part of the layout then you'll either end up leaning over it or kneeling on it to use whatever is above it. Which might get annoying unless you can achieve proper reliable hands free running.

[Donw]

Proper reliable hand free running should be hard. 100%reliable coupling and uncoupling may be harder especially if you have corridor coach conncctions. Worth the challenge though. Actually I seem to recall it was going to be a sofa bed so may not stick out so far.

 

Don

Edited May 6, 2021 by Donw

[Lacathedrale]

Gaueg III may prove a challenge....

 

 

Maybe an inglenook?

Edited May 7, 2021 by Lacathedrale

[Keith Addenbrooke]

1 hour ago, Lacathedrale said:

Gaueg III may prove a challenge....

 

 

Maybe an inglenook?

Stupid question for clarity - is the little van (the SR one on the right) a 4mm or 2mm scale wagon?

 

Gauge III is big either way!

Edited May 7, 2021 by Keith Addenbrooke

[Donw]

I have seen a Gauge 3 micro layout at the ALSRM show at Reading very simple but a lot of presense. Operation was rather limited. I have the feeling that you are quite operation orientated and a micro layout might not be sufficient.

 

 

 

Don

[Lacathedrale]

1 hour ago, Keith Addenbrooke said:

Stupid question for clarity - is the little van (the SR one on the right) a 4mm or 2mm scale wagon?

 

Gauge III is big either way!

 

The wagon is 2mm - A long term goal is a 5" Gauge loco whoever, whose stock would have the same relation to a 4mm wagon

 

I think realistically unless I'm going with a @Mikkel-style bitsa-layout, @Donw, this is purely for the outside line!

[Donw]

I thought perhaps you were thinking about having something G3 inside until you could build the garden line. The one I saw could make a nice feature and double as a test track for building stock. My garden stuff is 16mm so I could run it on a bit of 0 gauge track inside.

 

Don

[AndrueC]

Could you have the drop lift section further into the room? I've been playing with a design for a future layout of mine and I have the drop/lift section at 45* and clear of the door opening. It added a bit of complication because I am intending to continue with mostly settrack curves but I got it to work eventually.

 

Now all I need is to find my retirement bungalow

 

Edited May 10, 2021 by AndrueC

[Lacathedrale]

Having spent the christmas period stuffing my gob with minced pies while reading the Buckingham Branch Lines books by Wild Swan, I thought I would revisit the idea of a 4mm spare bedroom layout - and funnily enough, a tweaked Buckingham Mark 2 with the original smaller Leighton Buzzard plan fits in ... really well:

 

 

The middle box at the bottom represents the chimney breast, and the bay window (and my home office desk) is on the left. The door opening at the top right shows the right of way required for room entry, rather than the baseboard limits.

 

The spur off the mainline is fairly notional - I like the idea of a Gasworks or Lime kiln area.

 

I'm sure the fiddle yard could be improved but my brain's not yet firing on all cylinders. It does look a bit short but my time period is set to roughly 1899-1905 so realistically nothing longer than a 40' bogie coach and a five coach train of those and a Victorian 4-4-0 is about 3'6".

 

Overall the layout reminds me alot of the pre-doubling of Caterham, that station being mirrored along the long axis with carriage roads behind the station and the goods yard in front - and is probably worth a revisit also...

[Lacathedrale]

Shortly after the above post with all the confidence of a few glasses of champagne I closed templot and realised I hadn't ever saved it. D'oh!

 

However, the idea is rolling around my head still - I can blame that Buckingham book - though I don't quite have the space Mr. Denny does, I can just about squeeze a U-shape in. The major challenge is maintaining a 3' radius with a room with of only 9' . After some fiddling it looks like if I use 5' radius transitions to hold pointwork either side of a 3' radius curve, C8 turnouts on those transitions are also 3' radius.

 

I have drawn up Caterham as a bit of an exercise in dusting off the cobwebs of  this kind of plan in Templot and I am struck at just how close to a mirror of Buckingham it is - the only things it's missing are a separate goods yard headshunt and an extra siding off the platform runaround:

 

 

Though the kink in the curve looks a bit odd from a birds eye view, I think it would be fine at ground level.

 

Of course, Caterham itself is not a station with a great deal of operational interest, but I think it does prove the point that a modest terminus station can fit into one end of the L in an 11' x 9' room in EM.