GreenGiraffe22 Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 5 hours ago, BMacdermott said: Hello everyone Readers might like to be aware that Trains Illustrated June 1954 carries an article entitled Bananas Galore - which gives an outline of how banana transit was arranged at that time. There are no photos nor mention of specific vans, though At that time, four to six banana boats were coming in every week - roughly one to each of Avonmouth, Garston, Liverpool, London (PLA), Preston and Southampton. The article states that the biggest of these ships required 700 vans to accommodate the cargo. Brian That is a LOT of bananas. Starts frying my brain when I start thinking about how many banana plants (trees?) That required and the land space for them and the amount of workers require to pick them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iltman Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 With regards to banana van working D W Winkworth has a section on banana trains in Southern Special Traffic. He gives an example of a block train from Avonmouth up the GW main line to Reading then via the Southern to Redhill where the train was broken up and individual vans were forwarded to various destinations by ordinary train. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulG Posted February 1, 2021 Share Posted February 1, 2021 (edited) Peter Paye in his book The Bishop's Stortford, Dunmow & Braintree Branch states that Geest took over the stores at Easton Lodge for a banana ripening factory which opened March 1962 and closed when freight services were withdrawn on 17th February 1972. Edited February 3, 2021 by PaulG 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted February 1, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 1, 2021 If people want justification for running banana vans in small numbers, when I was train spotting at Cambridge in the late 1960s we used to see 2 or 3 banana vans turn up every so often and be shunted into Pordage's fruit & vegetable warehouse on the corner of Hills Road and Brooklands Avenue (which had been the LMS goods depot). By then they were BR standard Banana Vans though of course. 1 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinTrucks Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 If anyone really wants to become a banana dribbler, I recommend 'Fyffes and the Banana: Musa Sapientum: A Century History 1888-1988' by Peter N.Davies. https://www.bookfinder.com/search/?full=on&ac=sl&st=sl&ref=bf_s2_a1_t1_1&qi=wMivhTOvhv5y8301SyBFtN9xpn4_1497963026_1:29:57 Enjoy! Martin 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinTrucks Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 On 31/01/2021 at 21:05, The Johnster said: No, they are not quite the same as fruit vans. Banana vans have steam heating and no ventilation, as the bendy things were cropped green and ripened aboard the ships and on the trains to be palatable at sale, whereas fruit is usually picked ripe and needs to be kept cool and unheated, but well ventilated, to stop it going overripe in transit. Both had internal drop down shelves that boxes could be put on. One, not the only but one, of the reasons for the building of the GW's Badminton cut off was to access the then new port of Avonmouth for fast banana traffic. I have no knowledge of the GER's banana traffic, but would be surprised if some of it didn't come in via London or Tilbury; Tilbury is more LT&S I know. Didn't GWR and LMS banana vans have adjustable ventilators on the ends? Best regards, Martin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold BMacdermott Posted February 2, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 2, 2021 Hello everyone Slightly off topic for LNER Banana Vans per se, but below is an extract from a late 1959 Special Traffic Notice (STN). Brian 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted February 2, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 2, 2021 23 hours ago, russ p said: Anyone know when the last were withdrawn? They were still being used in the early 70s as fitted heads on trains of iron ore hoppers, I believe loaded with sandbags. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottishsteam Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 Does anyone know how far north these vans would have gotten - I.e. north of Hadrian’s wall? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
64F Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 (edited) 11 hours ago, scottishsteam said: Does anyone know how far north these vans would have gotten - I.e. north of Hadrian’s wall? Certainly there were banana ripening facilities in Scotland - Geest used to have one at Plains which was rail served. My guess (it is no more than that) would be that the vans worked north in ordinary express goods trains rather than unit trains. I'd also assume that by BR days the different types of banana van were so mixed that any type could show up. Edited February 2, 2021 by 64F typo 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 4 hours ago, The Johnster said: They were still being used in the early 70s as fitted heads on trains of iron ore hoppers, I believe loaded with sandbags. Not GER/LNER ones! Paul 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 3 hours ago, scottishsteam said: Does anyone know how far north these vans would have gotten - I.e. north of Hadrian’s wall? How could you deep fry them if there wasn't a way of getting them to Glasgow? Bananas were incredibly important as fruit (well before mango and kiwi were dreamt of us). Look at the fuss in war starved UK when, there was film of a ship launch (from USA IIRC) that used bananas as lubricant. They had, of course, lost their European market. As has been explained fruit finishing sheds were to be found in many smaller yards all over the country. Admittedly world production was only 21 million tons in 1961 (its 115 million around now). Each plant produces only a single hand of bananas and then dies, a new plant breaks from the root stock and a new one grows, taking 2 but usually 3 years to fruit again. Most of the commercial production in the world is a single cultivar called Cavendish (those large bananas) so a disease epidemic is spreading internationally. Paul 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 28 minutes ago, hmrspaul said: Bananas were incredibly important as fruit (well before mango and kiwi were dreamt of us). Look at the fuss in war starved UK when, there was film of a ship launch (from USA IIRC) that used bananas as lubricant. Surely they only needed the skins for that? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
64F Posted February 2, 2021 Share Posted February 2, 2021 (edited) On 02/02/2021 at 10:54, scottishsteam said: Does anyone know how far north these vans would have gotten - I.e. north of Hadrian’s wall? On 02/02/2021 at 13:18, 64F said: Certainly there were banana ripening facilities in Scotland - Geest used to have one at Plains which was rail served. My guess (it is no more than that) would be that the vans worked north in ordinary express goods trains rather than unit trains. I'd also assume that by BR days the different types of banana van were so mixed that any type could show up. Further Googling reveals that bananas were being imported at Greenock (where there was a "banana discharge plant" at James Watt Dock until September 1964, seeing a brief final use during 1965 when Avonmouth dockers were on strike) and the rmweb topic "Banana/Fruit Traffic 40's/50's/60's" mentions Glasgow as one of the ports handling bananas, so maybe the Scottish banana traffic was more local in nature. The Geest ripery at Plains was served by the LNER so I imagine that the GER style vans would have been used. In addition to Geest, Fyffes had a big ripery at Garrion Bridge which opened c.1960s (not rail served, but presumably it replaced somewhere else that was). Edited February 3, 2021 by 64F 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Covkid Posted February 6, 2021 Share Posted February 6, 2021 On 02/02/2021 at 14:27, hmrspaul said: Bananas were incredibly important as fruit (well before mango and kiwi were dreamt of us). Look at the fuss in war starved UK when, there was film of a ship launch (from USA IIRC) that used bananas as lubricant. They had, of course, lost their European market. As has been explained fruit finishing sheds were to be found in many smaller yards all over the country. Admittedly world production was only 21 million tons in 1961 (its 115 million around now). Each plant produces only a single hand of bananas and then dies, a new plant breaks from the root stock and a new one grows, taking 2 but usually 3 years to fruit again. Most of the commercial production in the world is a single cultivar called Cavendish (those large bananas) so a disease epidemic is spreading internationally. Paul Fascinating stuff Paul. We like to go to the west side of Cyprus for holidays around Coral Bay, which is quite a banana growing area. The times we have been have seen the fruit hanging down below the leaves, mostly wrapped in blue bags. Presume they are to protect the fruit from damage. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 4 minutes ago, Covkid said: Fascinating stuff Paul. We like to go to the west side of Cyprus for holidays around Coral Bay, which is quite a banana growing area. The times we have been have seen the fruit hanging down below the leaves, mostly wrapped in blue bags. Presume they are to protect the fruit from damage. Yes Bananas are cutomarily bagged during growth in many countries to counter both fungal diseases and insects. Paul 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 On 02/02/2021 at 09:19, The Johnster said: They were still being used in the early 70s as fitted heads on trains of iron ore hoppers, I believe loaded with sandbags. The Southern ones I saw in your neck of the woods ( Barry Scrapyard ) had a foot or so of concrete on the floor. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HonestTom Posted April 9, 2021 Share Posted April 9, 2021 Bananas were also unloaded at the West India docks in London, at what's now Canary Wharf. I don't know the specifics of the rail traffic, but the Great Eastern had access to that dock via the London and Blackwall Railway. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmrspaul Posted April 9, 2021 Share Posted April 9, 2021 On 10/02/2021 at 10:19, Wickham Green too said: The Southern ones I saw in your neck of the woods ( Barry Scrapyard ) had a foot or so of concrete on the floor. The TADPOLE I photographed in Woodhams doesn't appear to have had the tare uprated. As there is damage to two lower planks it doesn't appear to have concrete on the floor. https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/srvan/e80cd3bd Paul 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted April 9, 2021 Share Posted April 9, 2021 The concrete MIGHT have been a later idea as my visits to Barry were between 1972 and 1988 ......... the 'nana vans I remember were the Maunsell-Lynes roofed dia.1479 ones : unfortunately I don't seem to have photographed any of them. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garethp8873 Posted April 10, 2021 Author Share Posted April 10, 2021 (edited) Banana van samples are on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/oxfordrail/posts/2863349290544036 Edited April 10, 2021 by Garethp8873 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted April 11, 2021 Share Posted April 11, 2021 Need to log in? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D9001 Posted April 11, 2021 Share Posted April 11, 2021 Okay, genuine question; were tarantulas unwelcome but common “cargo” in the banana bunches in these vans? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted April 11, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 11, 2021 (edited) On 11/04/2021 at 22:36, D9001 said: Okay, genuine question; were tarantulas unwelcome but common “cargo” in the banana bunches in these vans? Would they survive the voyage refrigerated? [But see later posts - what was then described as "refrigeration" was what we would call "temperature controlled"] Hum... See: https://www.derryjournal.com/news/environment/tarantula-found-bunch-bananas-donegal-3023147 https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/terrifying-4inch-tarantula-found-in-bunch-of-bananas-at-camden-hospital-a3407926.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2335950/Tarantula-bananas-sir-Shopper-reveals-terrifying-moment-discovered-spider-hanging-bunch-fruit-picked-supermarket.html Evidently sufficiently unusual to be newsworthy? Edited July 3, 2021 by Compound2632 Correction re. refrigeration. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted April 11, 2021 Share Posted April 11, 2021 4 minutes ago, D9001 said: Okay, genuine question; were tarantulas unwelcome but common “cargo” in the banana bunches in these vans? Probably would have died en route if any did manage to get on board. Never heard any tales of big spiders from any relatives working on the ships or docks. And most of those relatives were the type to scare the living daylights out of any kids. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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