Accurascale's First Steam Locomotive; GWR Collett 78xx Manor Class!

[9402 Fredrick]

2 hours ago, The Black Hat said:

 

I guess you missed the whole Bachmann vs Hattons issue over the class 66 then. Can you imagine being at Bachmann reading about Accurascale announcing the Deltic, then the GBRf wagons (I bet they were looking at them), then the class 37... I can imagine lots of sighs and frustration at the blue box company as another chunk is taken from their range. Yes Bachmann have themselves to blame over selections, how they managed to get their parent company to authorise production and from what I hear - how Bachmann went about choosing what model to make next, how much of them and in what livery. Interestingly some of those at Bachmann that made decisions in recent years (and the consequnces of them are still playing through the production and delivery chain) have now left and in some cases taken up roles with Accurascale on an advisory role. To be honest, I think Accurascale can benefit of their contacts and network they have, but need to stick to their ideas on productions, choices for models and standards - as they are already ahead of those giving them the advice on what to do next.   

Dude, that's cause Bachmann were making Class 66s, the Manors haven't been done by Bachmann for a long time, also Accurascale is a model railway manufacturer, Hattons is a shop who also decided to start making their own models, these situations are like comparing apples to oranges.

[TrevorP1]

17 minutes ago, Mel_H said:

Second run material? The 'famous' 7816 Frilsham Manor that survived well into BR days with smokebox numberplate, and its GWR lettered tender

 

With the overhead warnings on the boiler that photo is post 1961, judging by the state of the engine a bit past that. I believe the tender was a 'pet' which Reading swopped around so as to keep it. That would make an interesting model though.

 

My first thought was to go for Erlestoke Manor from this batch but my photo records from the late 1950's show it running with the engine lined and an unlined green tender. The planned version is much later from Cambrian days I think. The 'mismatch' of tender seemed to be quite common, another Cornish one was 2-6-0 6301, again lined engine and unlined tender. Obviously tenders were swopped around to keep the job going not to match liveries! 

 

The above is quite easy to sort with a little work but to keep things simple for the moment I'll happily go for Laira's Ilford Manor. 

 

Well done to Accurascale on this. I was hoping to be gentle on the wallet this year. No so it seems!

[No Decorum]

1 hour ago, Roy Langridge said:

Sadly that doesn’t stop the minority who do want to run at a scale top speed being very vocal when it isn’t achievable. 
 

Roy

The difficulty is that not all locomotives run at high speed and those which are able to, don’t run at full speed all the time. However, all locomotives are moving extremely slowly as they start and stop. Juddering and jerking isn’t realistic.

[Limpley Stoker]

YWill there be a hook on the bufferbeam for stowing the cosmetic front coupling, as DGM did on the 1361class.? 

I can’t see on on the CAD s available.

 

I remember the excitement when a photograph of the forthcoming Mainline version appeared in The Model Railway Costructor in 1982  that was well worth the wait. Here we go again!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 4, 2021 by Limpley Stoker

[The Stationmaster]

10 minutes ago, Limpley Stoker said:

Will there be a hook on the bufferbeam for stowing the cosmetic front coupling, as DGM did on the 1361class.? 

I can’t see on on the CAD s available.

 

I remember the excitement when a photograph of the forthcoming Mainline version appeared in The Model Railway Costructor in 1979: that was well worth the wait. Here we go again!!

It does show up on the livery images if you can enlarge them sufficiently

[McC]

21 minutes ago, Limpley Stoker said:

Will there be a hook on the bufferbeam for stowing the cosmetic front coupling, as DGM did on the 1361class.? 

 

Absolutely, as well as a replacement bufferbeam in the accessory bag should you prefer to not have the NEM coupler socket at the front.

[Phil Bullock]

1 hour ago, TrevorP1 said:

 

With the overhead warnings on the boiler that photo is post 1961, judging by the state of the engine a bit past that. I believe the tender was a 'pet' which Reading swopped around so as to keep it. That would make an interesting model though.

 

My first thought was to go for Erlestoke Manor from this batch but my photo records from the late 1950's show it running with the engine lined and an unlined green tender. The planned version is much later from Cambrian days I think. The 'mismatch' of tender seemed to be quite common, another Cornish one was 2-6-0 6301, again lined engine and unlined tender. Obviously tenders were swopped around to keep the job going not to match liveries! 

 

The above is quite easy to sort with a little work but to keep things simple for the moment I'll happily go for Laira's Ilford Manor. 

 

Well done to Accurascale on this. I was hoping to be gentle on the wallet this year. No so it seems!

 

Still had that GWR tender in 1964 - and took it to the grave at Cashmores Newport in 1966

Edited February 3, 2021 by Phil Bullock

[gwrrob]

3 minutes ago, McC said:

 

Absolutely, as well as a replacement bufferbeam in the accessory bag should you prefer to not have the NEM coupler socket at the front.

 

 

 

You have to say that's magnificent.

[Accurascale Fran]

2 minutes ago, Phil Bullock said:

 

Still had that GWR tender in 1964 IIRC

 

Any idea what colour the tender was? Green or black? We havent found conclusive evidence at this point.

 

Cheers!

 

Fran

[TrevorP1]

5 minutes ago, McC said:

 

Absolutely, as well as a replacement bufferbeam in the accessory bag should you prefer to not have the NEM coupler socket at the front.

 

 

Excellent!!! 

 

Now, about the County, Grange and Castle you were going to announce...

 

And I really wouldn't mind a Bulldog either, even if it's out of period for me. (They kept one for years, hidden away in a shed somewhere up the Moorswater branch didn't you know...  )

 

 

[Phil Bullock]

@Accurascale FranRusty! I dont have access to any materials not on the open market am afraid.... There is a picture in Hugh Ballantyne's Western Steam in Colour P42 Sept 1964 coupled to 7816 in which the loco is clearly lined green but I am not convinced there is any lining on the tender.....

 

Suspect you will have seen that?
 

Kind regards

 

 

 

Edited February 3, 2021 by Phil Bullock

[Captain Kernow]

10 minutes ago, TrevorP1 said:

Now, about the County, Grange and Castle you were going to announce

 

And I really wouldn't mind a Bulldog either

Quite.

 

And just think how a 57XX pannier could turn out, in their hands?

 

Just saying!

 

[Accurascale Fran]

28 minutes ago, Phil Bullock said:

@Accurascale FranRusty! I dont have access to any materials not on the open market am afraid.... There is a picture in Hugh Ballantyne's Western Steam in Colour P42 Sept 1964 coupled to 7816 in which the loco is clearly lined green but I am not convinced there is any lining on the tender.....

 

Suspect you will have seen that?
 

Kind regards

 

 

 

Cheers Phil! Do you have access to millionaires shortbread though? That’s more important! 
 

Cheers!

 

Fran

[Phil Bullock]

5 minutes ago, Accurascale Fran said:

Cheers Phil! Do you have access to millionaires shortbread though? That’s more important! 
 

Cheers!

 

Fran

 

You might think that availability of Millionaires Shortbread from the catering dept. might be inversely proportional to the number of your wonderful products I buy... but suspect that given SWMBOs parents were from Cork and Dublin she might give me carte blanche and unlimited supplies... 

 

Now, about those CBAs.... 

 

 

[No Decorum]

1 hour ago, TrevorP1 said:

 

Now, about the County, Grange and Castle you were going to announce...

 

All have been done with varying degrees of success. There’s plenty to chose from which hasn’t been  done.

[Hilux5972]

12 hours ago, TrevorP1 said:

Now, about the County, Grange and Castle you were going to announce...

 

11 hours ago, No Decorum said:

All have been done with varying degrees of success. There’s plenty to chose from which hasn’t been  done.

Hornbys Castle is magnificent, the Grange yes it is now 15+ years old but still looks great. The County definitely needs seriously upgraded. 

[Miss Prism]

17 hours ago, Accurascale Fran said:

We are not sure what the final locomotive was but there is a photo of No. 7805 Broome Manor at Newport in April 1957 in Lawrence Waters's book and Peto's Register says this didn't receive its next heavy intermediate until September 1959 (with a picture of it afterwards gleaming in lined green as well). We've not found a picture of one later than that yet! 

 

A couple of fat chimneys in 'c 1959':  7802 and 7817.  Both very grubby, so impossible to determine the tender insignia.

 

[60800]

Is someone able to elaborate please on the tenders owned by the Erlestoke Manor fund?

 

I'm only asking as I'd like to get the models of both 7802 and 7812 and don't want them to erroneously have the 'same' tender if the fund only has one of each type.

 

Is the larger tender a Hall, King or Castle type? (My knowledge of GWR tenders is very little) 

 

Cheers,

  60800

[Miss Prism]

On 04/02/2021 at 09:31, 60800 said:

Is someone able to elaborate please on the tenders owned by the Erlestoke Manor fund?

 

As far as I know (which isn't very much), the Erlestoke Manor Fund seems to have a Collett 4000g, for 7802, and a vanilla snap-head riveted Churchward 3500g, for 7812.

 

In its day, 7812 also ran with a Collett 3500g 3000g, but,  edit, when in preservation mode (over 40 years ago!) :

 

 

Edited July 17, 2022 by Miss Prism
clarifying photo was not in BR service era

[The Stationmaster]

15 hours ago, Phil Bullock said:

 

Still had that GWR tender in 1964 - and took it to the grave at Cashmores Newport in 1966

Yes - it was the last engine at Reading to get it and I think it only went when Reading finally had nothing else to hang it behind.  The letters first showed through the worn away paint when it was behind one of Reading's 43XX and it was behind at least one other engine before it was attached to 7816.  Incidentally when the lettering first began to appear the mogul it was behind was a regular on the Down PIlot which spent a lot of time in Platform 7 and the presence of many 'spotters' might well have had some influence on the gradual emergence of the letters as Reading had very few Cleaners and they were concentrated on a couple of engines (6924 and 5038 being examples at one time) which worked on particular turns.

 

As far as the colour is concerned it was impossible to determine by then.  The fact that it had originally (in Reading terms) been behind a mogul might or might not have some bearing but the key thing is that when it was behind 7816 in everyday traffic it was so filthy you couldn't tell what colour the 'GWR' lettering was on and you couldn't tell which colour(s) had worn/been rubbed through to get to it because of both the grime and the ageing of the paint.  In my photo below 7816 is very definitely in lined green, not that it was easy to tell unless you were close up!

 

Here it is on the Up Pilot at Reading -

 

 

[jjnewitt]

28 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

In its day, 7812 also ran with a Collett 3500g

 

 

Are you sure that's a 3500 gallon tender? It doesn't look high enough. It looks like a 3000 gallon tender from a 2251 to me. I wonder if it actually ran in service like this?

 

Justin

 

[Miss Prism]

3 minutes ago, jjnewitt said:

Are you sure that's a 3500 gallon tender?

 

My mistake!  It is a Collett 3000g. Post now corrected.

 

Quote

 I wonder if it actually ran in service like this?

 

I assume so. Although it is a bit odd, and I guess why I jumped to the initial observation that it was a 3500g.

 

[jjnewitt]

2 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

I assume so. Although it is a bit odd, and I guess why I jumped to the initial observation that it was a 3500g.

 

Yes, it is a bit odd isn't it. The loco looks very clean so perhaps this was taken at Swindon post overhaul and the tender temporarily borrowed for one reason or another? I haven't seen another picture of Earstoke in service with that tender.

 

Justin

[MattA]

There's a few unique liveries for the Manor, as well as 7816 having a GWR-lettered tender well into the 60s as already mentioned.

Of course, there is the Great Western lined green that 7827 has carried in preservation.

I also understand that 7804 received unlined green with no emblem on the tender in 1948 for pilot duties over the south Devon banks. This was replaced by unlined black at some point between 1952 and 1954, possibly at the same time that it recieved the blastpipe modifications. This picture from 1952 appears to show it without a crest, but with smokebox shed and number plates: https://thetransportlibrary.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=129324

Edited February 4, 2021 by MattA

[Phil Bullock]

41 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

Yes - it was the last engine at Reading to get it and I think it only went when Reading finally had nothing else to hang it behind.  The letters first showed through the worn away paint when it was behind one of Reading's 43XX and it was behind at least one other engine before it was attached to 7816.  Incidentally when the lettering first began to appear the mogul it was behind was a regular on the Down PIlot which spent a lot of time in Platform 7 and the presence of many 'spotters' might well have had some influence on the gradual emergence of the letters as Reading had very few Cleaners and they were concentrated on a couple of engines (6924 and 5038 being examples at one time) which worked on particular turns.

 

As far as the colour is concerned it was impossible to determine by then.  The fact that it had originally (in Reading terms) been behind a mogul might or might not have some bearing but the key thing is that when it was behind 7816 in everyday traffic it was so filthy you couldn't tell what colour the 'GWR' lettering was on and you couldn't tell which colour(s) had worn/been rubbed through to get to it because of both the grime and the ageing of the paint.  In my photo below 7816 is very definitely in lined green, not that it was easy to tell unless you were close up!

 

Here it is on the Up Pilot at Reading -

 

 

Great gen Mike. Have put out a shout on local Facebook group to see if anyone has further gen as she finished at Horton Road but think it’s going to end up like the famous snooker commentary... for those in black and white the green is next to the red!