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Graham Farish Spring 2021 new announcements


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34 minutes ago, Roy L S said:

Plenty of updates on existing projects, deco samples and the like but no, nothing new. I took the opportunity to speak to a very pleasant and helpful young lady on the stand, and it is very clear that Bachmann UK are only too aware of the unhappy feedback/comments from N modellers. Problems with Chinese manufacturing/covid was mentioned, I was assured that there are "new" products in the pipeline, but no indication of course as to when there will be news. Personally as there was nothing at TINGS I do not expect anything on the 26th September either, rightly or wrongly (a matter of opinion) they appear to be sticking to the policy of quarterly announcements.  

I agree that there would appear to be little hope of seeing any announcement until the next quarter. If Bachmann are so aware of the unhappy and negative feedback and comments then they would do well to address it via some form of press release rather than adhoc comments to the public (not taking a pop at you here Roy). 

34 minutes ago, Roy L S said:

What concerned me more was the pace at which the things we do know about will apparently be coming through. I asked if there was any ETA for the sound upgraded 5MT, and the reply was that if at EP stage now, probably 18 months, so that would be Q1 2023, I must stress this was an estimate and I may have put her on the spot in asking, I am hopeful as it is only a partial retool it may be sooner, but N releases are already scheduled into the first I think 6 months of 2022 so reasonable to think none of the 4 "awaited" steam re-runs will be until after that.

It's quite telling that since 2019 when the 5mt was announced for an upgrade (not a new model) that it has only reached EP stage. 

 

34 minutes ago, Roy L S said:

I did ask why new tool OO models were in that case coming through quarterly, but didn't really expect an answer and it wouldn't have been fair to push, after all she was just the messenger!

I'm not surprised that you didn't get an answer. I suspect that OO models come through much faster as they are considered to be far more profitable so get the production slots with n gauge models getting repeatedly shunted out. Whilst this is understandable from a business point of view it does not help the modellers. If this is the case then some up front honesty could help Bachmann rather than letting messages leak out (by talking to retailers) suggesting that big things would be announced before nothing happening. 

 

34 minutes ago, Roy L S said:

Last point, as a Collectors' Club member myself, I haven't seen that much benefit for my membership apart from an annual PO wagon which is very pretty but not my chosen era, so I am happy that there is an exclusive opportunity for me to hopefully find a bargain or two - I guess I see this from a different perspective.

 

I'm amazed that any n gauge modellers would consider the collectors club to be good value.

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To be fair Farish have announced quite a bit over recent years. It's not just the 5mt having a sound upgrade but they announced a list of most of their steam and diesel locos a few years ago as scheduled for chassis retooling to accommodate sound. Then there's the announced new class 69, 319 and 450. Retooling for the Crewe cut 47 and 158. And the EFE range (of which the JIA is still awaited).

 

I just wonder if with their problems with factories, Chinese production, covid and worldwide distribution issues, they've bitten off too much in their announcements and need to be a little quiet on new ones until problems are resolved and the backlog cleared. But then other companies producing/commissioning N gauge railway models don't seem to be affected to the same extent.

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Kris said:

I'm amazed that any n gauge modellers would consider the collectors club to be good value.

 

I didn't think it was good value a few years back, even less so now.

 

I'm less concerned about the lack of new toolings/retooling to sound as I am concerned about the complete dearth of bread and butter models which could almost be considered as sundries. Having to scratch around for something as simple and fundamental to the average layout as a Mk1 SK/BSK/CK, or a Mk2 TSO in pretty much any livery is a desperate situation, let alone trying to purchase a whole short rake. Being facetious, I know, but we're very much into the realms of this level of satire...

 

'Buying a train set sir?'

'Yes please.'

'Would you like some matching coaches to expand that train sir?'

'Very much so. What have you got?'

'Well, sir...the matching coaches are these.'

'That's great, I'll have those two. How much?'

'That'll be 24 months sir, but you'll have to pre-order now and we can't guarantee stock, sir.'

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1 hour ago, grahame said:

I just wonder if with their problems with factories, Chinese production, covid and worldwide distribution issues, they've bitten off too much in their announcements and need to be a little quiet on new ones until problems are resolved and the backlog cleared. 

 

We were told they had over announced some years ago and that they were cutting back on new promises then (and they have done this). We were also told in January 2019 that they had moved their factories successfully. Problems with the previous factory had been blamed for delays since 2015 or before. 

 

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36 minutes ago, Kris said:

We were told they had over announced some years ago and that they were cutting back on new promises then (and they have done this). We were also told in January 2019 that they had moved their factories successfully. Problems with the previous factory had been blamed for delays since 2015 or before. 

 

 

Maybe it's a continuing problem they've not yet fixed. And is now compounded with things like covid and distribution issues (shortages of containers and drivers, escalating shipping costs, delays, etc).

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There certainly are big issues worldwide with containers, a colleague at work was saying recently that a container previously costing £2k can currently cost £18k, just a supply and demand thing with ships being laid up due to Covid, also leading to less predicable delivery. 

 

I also heard the "Boss" from Rails say that the Sonic 56xx locos were air-freighted in, and because N shipments are smaller in volume terms it was more viable to do this for N which was interesting. 

 

There may well still be manufacturing issues at Bachmann, it may be that OO is being prioritised for production slots (I personally think this may be the case - a commercial decision) however I very much doubt the reason will ever get into the public domain.

 

What saddens me most though, is that having built the Farish "brand" up since the takeover to make it the pre-eminent one in British N, they are now slipping backwards. I really think that in these circumstances if (big if) there are brand new models that are closer to arrival they should break with the rigid quarterly announcements and say something more substantive to keep their loyal customers on board.

 

Roy

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I despair that underneath posts filled with photographs of plenty of new models such as the 319, cut 47, sound locos and the hoppers, and with the 69 announced, plus several new models such as the 31 having reached the shops over past 12 months, this narrative that Farish have abandoned N gauge still persists, seemingly invading every mention of the manufacturer in every thread.

 

If it really is the case that ‘announcements’ are worth more to the hobby than actual models in our hands, then it is not Farish killing N gauge, but the modellers. 
 

Farish have a backlog and evident production slot issues, but there remains a steady stream of new models coming out, and until that is caught up no there won’t be anything else announced. 

 

Some people really do seem to live and breathe the old saying that every silver lining has a cloud…

 

David

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3 hours ago, Zunnan said:

 

I didn't think it was good value a few years back, even less so now.

 

I'm less concerned about the lack of new toolings/retooling to sound as I am concerned about the complete dearth of bread and butter models which could almost be considered as sundries. Having to scratch around for something as simple and fundamental to the average layout as a Mk1 SK/BSK/CK, or a Mk2 TSO in pretty much any livery is a desperate situation, let alone trying to purchase a whole short rake. Being facetious, I know, but we're very much into the realms of this level of satire...

 

'Buying a train set sir?'

'Yes please.'

'Would you like some matching coaches to expand that train sir?'

'Very much so. What have you got?'

'Well, sir...the matching coaches are these.'

'That's great, I'll have those two. How much?'

'That'll be 24 months sir, but you'll have to pre-order now and we can't guarantee stock, sir.'

 

This is what bothers me the most, it's not so much the delays on all new items, it's the fact that it's taking 2-3 years just to get items that are re-liveries of existing models into the shops. For example they announced a blue version of the former N Gauge Society Hawksworth BG in Jan 2019 and it still doesn't have an ETA which means that it will have taken them over three years to release it.

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Let’s be thankful that the object of all the negativity is only the marketing strategy and manufacturing process of a model train manufacturer and not something really important. :scratchhead:

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I'm looking forward to the 319 and there is some useful class37s due next mar/apr so it was good to see them.  They seemed to have missed an opportunity with the 50th anniversary as they could of released a ltd edition or an old classic in retro packaging that appeals to the collector and/or fans of the brand or something to help  promote the brand.

 

Theres a whole bunch of useful stuff they could re-release that would sell well, such as various mk1/mk2 TSO, the 20ft and 40ft container packs, blue GUVs etc.  Theres 1 more announcement for q4 to look forward to and a growing trend with them is tagging some extra releases on already announced reruns (maybe IC swallow and Rfd 47s to go with the colas/res and VT already in the catalogue?).

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1 hour ago, bmthtrains - David said:

I despair that underneath posts filled with photographs of plenty of new models such as the 319, cut 47, sound locos and the hoppers, and with the 69 announced, plus several new models such as the 31 having reached the shops over past 12 months, this narrative that Farish have abandoned N gauge still persists, seemingly invading every mention of the manufacturer in every thread.

 

If it really is the case that ‘announcements’ are worth more to the hobby than actual models in our hands, then it is not Farish killing N gauge, but the modellers. 
 

Farish have a backlog and evident production slot issues, but there remains a steady stream of new models coming out, and until that is caught up no there won’t be anything else announced. 

 

Some people really do seem to live and breathe the old saying that every silver lining has a cloud…

 

David

Hi David

 

I have certainly not said Farish has abandoned N Gauge, what I have said is that priorities seem to be elsewhere at the moment. I have already acknowledged that at TINGS we were shown where various projects were at, but that is not the whole story is it? Even those at deco sample stage are mostly many months away, and much of what was shown was diesel/electric which is also all you have spoken of above. The 69 is a niche model, a small class and not relevant to any but modellers of the most recent era, I hope it does well for them but it doesn't appeal to me in the slightest.

 

If you are a steam/diesel transition modeller like me, then take a look at what re-runs of steam locos are listed . For a start of Fairsh's huge steam model portfolio there are just 20 models shown in total, that's not different classes that is the whole lot, and of those: - 

  • Fowler 4F, 3 x livery variants "Awaiting"
  •  J39, 3 x livery variants "Awaiting".
  • Fairburn Tank, 2 x livery variants "Awaiting"
  • Standard 5MT (Partial retool), 3x livery variants "Awaiting" ( I was told probably 18 months away).

So of the 20, only 9 in stock (some the slower sellers like LNER 8F) and eleven as yet do not even have a delivery date.

 

The above may explain why I take a different view to you, and I would really love to know on what authority you are saying "until that is caught up no there won’t be anything else announced" you do not know that for a fact any more than I do, the Class 69 being a case in point. I have already acknowledged that info on newly tooled plans is unlikely to break from the quarterly announcements, but it just might..

 

Regards

 

Roy

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On 13/09/2021 at 18:19, Zunnan said:

 

I am concerned about the complete dearth of bread and butter models which could almost be considered as sundries. Having to scratch around for something as simple and fundamental to the average layout as a Mk1 SK/BSK/CK, or a Mk2 TSO in pretty much any livery is a desperate situation

I couldn't agree more. Imagine entering the N gauge hobby in the last four years and simply wanting a typical rake of blue/grey MK1s or MK2As.

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3 hours ago, 47475 said:

I couldn't agree more. Imagine entering the N gauge hobby in the last four years and simply wanting a typical rake of blue/grey MK1s or MK2As.

 

I suppose it depends where you're doing your shopping. 

 

Those entering the hobby may well start with their local hobby shops and I wandered into a shop a couple of weeks ago while visiting Barnstaple and there were a few Farish blue grey coaches (both Mk1 and 2 I think, but I didn't look closely) for sale.   

 

Certainly there are several in my local N gauge area group who don't use the internet to look for models; maybe shortages at online retailers create the slightly false impression that there is a scarcity.

 

cheers

 

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It is at this point in the availability cycle that I am extremely grateful that with one of my two exhibition roundy-roundies (Hawthorn Dene) sold, and the club roundy-roundy (Rise Park) that I supplied my remaining analogue locos to also sold I have quite a substantial overstock of N-gauge and don't really need to buy any more- do I still need 5 each of J39 and WD for instance?

 

I will replace a couple of Mark 1s or Gresleys with Thompsons when they finally appear in the appropriate livery (assuming I've not tired of Croft Spa by then and sold it on).  My 3 NGS Hunslets on order are too late for Hawthorn Dene but 2 will run as a light engines  plus brake pair on Croft Spa (the prototypes were delivered to NCB Springwell under their own power) while the third will be Werklok 5 on Bregenbach im Schwarzwald.  I have no more  UK N gauge stock planned, though I might just be tempted by a Sonic J50.

 

My next project is back to OO, provisionally an 8X2 Gumstump.  Maybe by the time that one is finished (2 more years) there may be some new N gauge to get sufficiently excited about to trigger another N gauge layout.....

 

 

Les

 

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13 hours ago, Revolution Ben said:

I suppose it depends where you're doing your shopping. 

 

Those entering the hobby may well start with their local hobby shops and I wandered into a shop a couple of weeks ago while visiting Barnstaple and there were a few Farish blue grey coaches (both Mk1 and 2 I think, but I didn't look closely) for sale. 

 

There's been a recent batch of Scotrail branded blue/grey Mk1s (weathered, BSK & SK I think), and you can find Mk2F reasonably easily if all you want are BSO and FO.

 

However look for Mk1 SK and SO in maroon or Crimson/Cream, or a Mk2a or Mk2F TSO and you'd be disappointed. The last Mk2a TSO in any livery was three years ago (Highland green/cream), with no blue/grey one since 2015.

 

It's interesting to look at the release dates of coaches at https://www.ngauge.org/. Up until around 2015 most of the Mk1 range was being re-run in most liveries just about every year. Since then there's barely been a trickle.

 

It's also quite telling that the "Buy it Now" prices on eBay have shot up - particularly for TSO where the price is £20-30 more than the equivalent FO.

 

No wonder Rails of Sheffield are commissioning more models from the likes of Revolution, Sonic and Cavalex. If they didn't they wouldn't have much to sell. Sadly the smaller shops can't afford to do so.

 

Steven B.

 

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52 minutes ago, Steven B said:

No wonder Rails of Sheffield are commissioning more models from the likes of Revolution, Sonic and Cavalex. If they didn't they wouldn't have much to sell. Sadly the smaller shops can't afford to do so.

 

Steven B.

 

 

I have often suggested to some of the smaller shops that they club together to commission something to give themselves a semi-exclusive model.  Weren't the Bachmann retailer specials an attempt to achieve this?  Not that they have done any in N, mind you.

 

cheers

 

Ben A.

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1 hour ago, Steven B said:

However look for Mk1 SK and SO in maroon or Crimson/Cream, or a Mk2a or Mk2F TSO and you'd be disappointed. 


I recently put a couple of Farish Mk2F Blue/Grey TSOs up for sale on the classifieds section here, hoping that a fellow RMWebber might be interested. I thought these coaches were in demand but after two weeks fewer than thirty people had had a look and they attracted exactly one (low-ish) bid. Therefore, I’ve taken them off and at least one of them will be offered up to the ravenous hordes on eBay.

Edited by Western Aviator
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4 minutes ago, Western Aviator said:


I recently put a couple of Farish Mk2F Blue/Grey TSOs up for sale on the classifieds section here, hoping that a fellow RMWebber might be interested. I thought these coaches were in demand but after two weeks fewer than thirty people had had a look and they attracted exactly one (low-ish) bid. Therefore, I’ve taken them off and at least one of them will be offered up to the ravenous hordes on eBay.

It may have been how they were put up on here, you went for sealed bidding rather than placed a price on them, people generally sell things at a fixed price, it may have put people off.

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17 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

It may have been how they were put up on here, you went for sealed bidding rather than placed a price on them, people generally sell things at a fixed price, it may have put people off.


You may be right. However, when the subject of outrageous prices appears on here someone invariably says something along the lines of “an item is worth whatever someone is prepared to pay for it.” Based on previous experiences, I can’t predict what price someone is prepared to pay. So the reason for selling them using “sealed bids” was to try to find a middle ground between offering them at too low a price and selling myself short, or appearing on an “eBay Madness” type thread. Anyway, it’s academic now; I’ve gone home and taken my football with me :)

Edited by Western Aviator
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19 hours ago, 47475 said:

I couldn't agree more. Imagine entering the N gauge hobby in the last four years and simply wanting a typical rake of blue/grey MK1s or MK2As.

I entered the hobby last November and I just bought stuff that I liked the look of. I can see that for someone seeking to recreate a particular scene or period there might be a problem but I just wanted 'some modern trains' and there was a very large selection available to me. I successfully bought six diesels (including a class 43) and a Queen Elizabeth (not modern but that's my Sunday Special as a nod to personal nostalgia). Okay so I'm having to wait to get a Super Voyager and I will probably never get an APT-E or a Princess Elizabeth but that's only very mildly annoying. I run what I can get and my next layout will have nearly twice as many sidings because there's still stuff out there that I just don't have room for at the moment.

 

The result is eclectic but I'm happy with it. It'd be interesting to know how many prospective (or even current) railway modellers are trying to be prototypical. Those who aren't - like me - are still very well served.

 

FYI: The diesels are two class 68s, two class 53s, one class 56 and a class 43. All different liveries. I was able to buy additional coaches for the HST to give it a rake of six (my next layout will let me add a seventh - don'cha just love N gauge?).

Edited by AndrueC
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26 minutes ago, AndrueC said:

It'd be interesting to know how many prospective (or even current) railway modellers are trying to be prototypical. 


That subject has been debated on here in multiple threads over the years. Whilst you might get an idea of how many active RMWeb posters are trying to be prototypical, that almost certainly isn’t indicative of what happens in the wider world.

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6 hours ago, Western Aviator said:


I recently put a couple of Farish Mk2F Blue/Grey TSOs up for sale on the classifieds section here, hoping that a fellow RMWebber might be interested. I thought these coaches were in demand but after two weeks fewer than thirty people had had a look and they attracted exactly one (low-ish) bid. Therefore, I’ve taken them off and at least one of them will be offered up to the ravenous hordes on eBay.

That's a shame, I need to get into the habit of looking at the classified section.  Not saying I'd have made you a reasonable offer (we may have wildly varying expectations) but we'll never know now...

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