RMweb Gold MikeParkin65 Posted March 19, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 19, 2021 To be fair I haven't had a bad experience with any model railway trader, big or small. I've had excellent service from Hattons over the years (including exchanging without question a loco that had been in store for more than 2 years then found to be faulty) and similarly excellent service from other retailers. I really feel for those on here who had expected a preorder that Hattons, for whatever reason, have found themselves unable to deliver. I think Hattons have become a victim of their own success and I do feel some of the more bitter comments being made earlier on in this thread are grossly unfair. I dont think anyone (apart from maybe Hornby's owners) are in model railways to make a fortune. 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium HillsideDepot Posted March 19, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 19, 2021 There was an interesting piece in the news email from Derails today: Quote FINALLY! It only took three years, but the BR Blue Merchant Navy has finally arrived into stock....! Originally pre-sold out, now testing is complete (and we have had zero mechanical failures) we're able to release some of the spare models. We've put just 8 into stock now at £161.99 each! Free-postage and you'll earn 161 Derails points with the purchase! Usual disclaimer - no connection with Derails other than as a happy pre-order customer 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black 5 Bear Posted March 19, 2021 Share Posted March 19, 2021 1 minute ago, HillsideDepot said: There was an interesting piece in the news email from Derails today: Usual disclaimer - no connection with Derails other than as a happy pre-order customer Customer service at it's best and second to none ! 2 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard.h Posted March 20, 2021 Share Posted March 20, 2021 Living out here you tend to be a bit isolated so I've generally used the larger suppliers assuming that they would offer the best prices and service. But, due my recent experience with the cancelled order from Hattons and after listening to the excellent advice offered here I have been shopping around and find that there are many smaller dealers who match the big companies on price, give good service and stock both the big brands of Hornby and Bachmann. So once again thank you everyone for your help, it is really good to have sites like this available where you can benefit from other peoples experience. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted March 20, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 20, 2021 23 hours ago, cbrooks122000 said: As I said before, I am sure it is Hornby that are lowering the number of items they send to Hattons. Hattons obviously have a limit, as you will see the words "sold out on preorder". I suspect Hattons pays less for each model, than your average Model Shop because previously they sold the numbers. So Hornby supply more to the small Model Shops as they get more money. The issue arises when they create a "lemon", everyone does it eventually, when they need someone like Hattons to shift their stock. This sort of story has reared its head umpteen times over the years and has been flatly denied every single time. It was claimed some years back - posisbly accurately - that Hattons received some Hornby models buy the pallet load with the inference that was hw they had arrived from the factory and all that had been done for 'distribution' was to move the pallet from one lorry to another. That might perhaps have led to a discount but as ever that was alwaysdenied by Hornby to other retailers who made such accusations. What Hattons did do however was sell at extremely tight margins making far less per individual loco sale than was normal - they made their money from selling large numbers of models. i know of other retailers who when short of a particular items bought new models from Hattons and sold at their own usual level of discount and still made a profit. But all that does is show that Hattons retail model was based on very small individual margins and a return based on selling large numbers of models (and that approach worked for them). I am pretty sure from what I have heard around the trade in more recent years, especially since Hornby have slashed their trade discounts and last altered their payment terms that every retailer buying direct from Hornby is paying the same price for any particular item. Until the most recent change in Hornby's payment terms it was possible for retailers to take advantage of the early payment discount and no doubt Hattons did exactly that - but it was a discount open to all retailers, until Hornby did away with it. So any idea that Hattons pays less per item than other retailers is, from what I have heard within the trade, pure supposition and there is no real evidence to support that supposition (unless you are now able to provide it for us all to see). Like all Hornby retailers Hattons have exactly the same initial cap on the amount of discount they can offer to retail customers and, again like other retailers, the level of discount they offer after that period will relate to far more things than the price they paid for an item. And don't forget there is still stuff around from the fire sales which preceded the arrival Lyndon Davies at Hornby 2 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted March 20, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 20, 2021 (edited) 15 hours ago, HillsideDepot said: There was an interesting piece in the news email from Derails today: Usual disclaimer - no connection with Derails other than as a happy pre-order customer But I think this demonstrates the point very well Derails did not sell all their allocation on preorder but held some back as contingency . It is possible therefor they could absorb some small under delivery or defective models from Hornby In this case no defects , so they can release models for sale Seems a great way to deal with possible uncertain deliveries /quality to me . Well done Derails That’s what derails do . I wonder what Hattons do........... Edited March 20, 2021 by Legend 6 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black 5 Bear Posted March 20, 2021 Share Posted March 20, 2021 (edited) 9 hours ago, cbrooks122000 said: In that case I have no idea why Hattons allocation seems to be always short at present. My Sun Castle was ordered the day they announced them, so my name was probably a reasonable way up the list, so there must have been a lot of other peoples orders that were cancelled as well. I have two Hornby preorders with them left, so I will see how those go. All the new ones are with other Model Shops. Personally, If you really want a particular model I wouldn't chance leaving the pre-order in place at Hattons. You can always order direct with Hornby, this should ensure that you are more or less certain of getting your desired item. Edited March 20, 2021 by Black 5 Bear 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free At Last Posted March 20, 2021 Share Posted March 20, 2021 (edited) After having my order for a P2 cancelled I decided to cancel the rest of my pre-orders as I realised I didn't really need any of them, they were all just 'nice to haves' and paying for them by debit card isn't like spending money. I would never buy direct from Hornby as I like to think they are where the blame lies. Edited March 20, 2021 by Free At Last 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edge Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 (edited) Well, received an email from Hattons saying that my ‘British Enterprise’ pre-order has now vanished. So cheers, thanks for that - only had it for 18 months at this point and no chance whatsoever of getting another pre-order elsewhere. lesson learned - all pre orders with Hattons now cancelled and I will never ever trust them with pre-orders again. Whoever bears the true fault for this, such cancellations are doing nothing but hurting Hattons. My pre-orders added up to well over £1000 and now they are all with other companies. Not good at all Edited April 7, 2021 by Edge 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgar3 Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 Just had the same message for the two SR Luggage vans. Quick log on to Kernow and pre-ordered with them. Hopefully they’ll get enough stock, but this isn’t good for Hattons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CUCKOO LINE Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 Ditto Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium wrex Posted April 7, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 7, 2021 (edited) Another cancelled W1 pre-order here, placed 6th Jan 2020 so as soon as it was up! Chances of finding another shop with stock seems slim Very worried as the APT was also pre-ordered in the same transaction - if that goes I'll be even more disappointed! Surely Hornby can give retailers a figure of how many they will supply and Hattons can allocate accordingly? Edited April 7, 2021 by wrex 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted April 7, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 7, 2021 On 20/03/2021 at 11:17, Legend said: But I think this demonstrates the point very well Derails did not sell all their allocation on preorder but held some back as contingency . It is possible therefor they could absorb some small under delivery or defective models from Hornby In this case no defects , so they can release models for sale Seems a great way to deal with possible uncertain deliveries /quality to me . Well done Derails That’s what derails do . I wonder what Hattons do........... I got a 94xx from Derails through this policy. I hadn't pre ordered but decided to wait to see it. Got a message to say that they had two of the one I wanted left after fulfilling the pre- orders and dealing with any issues. Got in quick and bought it for the best price around at the time. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJennings Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 Just had my pre-order for the whole of the LNER Farewell HST cancelled. Not looking good for the rest of the circa £2,000 worth of pre-orders ... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyman7 Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 1 minute ago, RJennings said: Just had my pre-order for the whole of the LNER Farewell HST cancelled. Not looking good for the rest of the circa £2,000 worth of pre-orders ... Is this with Hattons? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJennings Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 1 minute ago, andyman7 said: Is this with Hattons? Yes - Ordered through Hattons around 24hrs after it was announced. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Trofimow Posted April 7, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 7, 2021 Yup, my luggage van pre order cancelled as well. This is just the latest in a string of my Hornby pre-orders that have been cancelled with Hattons. Sorry to say it, but there is just no point in giving Hattons any more of my Hornby orders any more. I am cancelling the rest and will try to re-order elsewhere. Wherever the fault lies, it does customer confidence no good at all, in either the retailer or the manufacturer. 1 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacol Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 Email arrived from Hatton's cancelling Merchant Navy "General Steam Navigation", stating they are not able to acquire the stock to allocate to my pre-order. Hopefully some of my other pre-orders make it through. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45568 Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 Here's mine!! We're sorry to inform you that we have had to cancel your pre-order(s) for: R3980 Rebuilt Class W1 Hush-Hush 4-6-4 60700 in BR green with late crest We are not able to acquire the stock to allocate to your pre-order. We always endeavour to honour all pre-orders but in this situation, we are unable to do so. We sincerely apologise for any inconvenience this may cause. This order will be cancelled automatically shortly, so no further action is required from you. Please do not hesitate to get in touch if we can help with anything else. So no Hornby items left on pre-order with Hattons..I don't think I'll bother again! From Oz, Peter C. 1 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted April 7, 2021 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted April 7, 2021 Lost my Churchill luggage van preorder too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Harbour Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 Just had my order for the Siphon H canned. Not thrilled. Been on pre-order for months. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesysmith Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 My dad just had his coronation coaches cancelled. I wonder how legal it is if they short supply hattons, but have some they sell direct at full RRP? Would that be classed as ripping off the customer? But with the trading standards just a shadow of what it was, we customers come a long way down the chain in any rights. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cor-onGRT4 Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 One of the two SR luggage van gone and SR 4 wheel bagage wagon gone from my pre orders hopefully the other pre orders for over 1900,- pound keep standing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pre Grouping fan Posted April 7, 2021 Share Posted April 7, 2021 5 minutes ago, cheesysmith said: My dad just had his coronation coaches cancelled. I wonder how legal it is if they short supply hattons, but have some they sell direct at full RRP? Would that be classed as ripping off the customer? But with the trading standards just a shadow of what it was, we customers come a long way down the chain in any rights. I don't think it's short supply that's the main issue, probably mentioned before but do hattons take too many preorders in the first place before their final allocation is confirmed. Other retailers short sell their allocation so there some leeway and can then offer the excess for sale. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted April 7, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 7, 2021 Is there a dummy-spitting contest going on like the previous Hattons/ Bachmann and Rails/Hornby ones? 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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