enginelane Posted February 14, 2021 Share Posted February 14, 2021 Hi, if on a shed Lay-out how often would an steam engine be stopped for routine maintenance or periodic maintenance. Was wondering how many extra locos would have be on shed to cover this aspect of steam haulage. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 14, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 14, 2021 Part of the answer depends on the local water because that affected boiler washout intervals and washouts were in many respects the thing which would have a predicted frequency. Engines would be stopped on a (high) mileage basis for boiler exams although again that often related to local water conditions. In many other respects work was largely down to repairs and covered a wide range of things although there were some consumables to be dealt with, particularky firebars which gradually burnt away so needed to be replaced. As far as repairs were concerned things were really as long as a piece of string and might even be influenced by the availability of spare parts meaninga an engine would have to e stopped for much longer than the work would take. and it deoends too on the sort of loco fleet you will have - older engines and certain types of work meant more frequent need for attention. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginelane Posted February 14, 2021 Author Share Posted February 14, 2021 Thanks. So there was not the same regime as in Diesel locos of A exam B exam etc? Lots of modellers end up with more locos than needed to run the supposed trains was wondering if a shed needed a third or twice as many spare locos to cover for ones repairing. I know it’s often quoted that a diesel Loco could do the work of three steam engines. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caley739 Posted February 14, 2021 Share Posted February 14, 2021 Examination and repairs could be on a mileage basis or time basis, from a daily examination by an examining fitter for engines working passenger trains to a valve and piston examination at about 36,000 miles or so. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Padre Posted February 14, 2021 Share Posted February 14, 2021 This is enlightening - be warned - it will end any romantic notions of steam operation - well it did for me ! 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold rodent279 Posted February 14, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 14, 2021 Tubes also need cleaning regularly, though how often I don't know. Maybe it depends to some extent on the quality of coal? My dad used to say that the tube cleaner/s were the most important shed staff. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginelane Posted February 14, 2021 Author Share Posted February 14, 2021 32 minutes ago, Irish Padre said: This is enlightening - be warned - it will end any romantic notions of steam operation - well it did for me ! A lot more people than I imagined being involved. No wonder BR found it difficult to retain staff for some of the jobs shown 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold rodent279 Posted February 14, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 14, 2021 A little anecdote I heard from an ex-L&Y fireman, was that they had a new tube cleaner start who was very thorough. After a while, they started getting reports of leaking tubes. It was traced to a combination of tubes being cleaned more thoroughly than for a long time, and infrequent boiler washouts. The washouts caused scale which was clogged up around the lower tubes to be dislodged, in turn causing newly cleaned tubes to leak, where previously they'd been blocked with scale. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Buckner Posted February 14, 2021 Share Posted February 14, 2021 1 hour ago, rodent279 said: A little anecdote I heard from an ex-L&Y fireman, was that they had a new tube cleaner start who was very thorough. After a while, they started getting reports of leaking tubes. It was traced to a combination of tubes being cleaned more thoroughly than for a long time, and infrequent boiler washouts. The washouts caused scale which was clogged up around the lower tubes to be dislodged, in turn causing newly cleaned tubes to leak, where previously they'd been blocked with scale. The soil round Aylesbury is clay. When some road works necessitated replacing a stretch of ancient gas pipes, it was discovered that the pipework had rotted, but there had been no leaks because the shaped clay conduit was impermeable to gas. 2 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted February 14, 2021 Share Posted February 14, 2021 Yep, I've seen a gas man come to a gas main that had been unearthed by a builder's digger, and stop the leak by bunging a large lump of clay in the end of the pipe. Lighted fag in his mouth. Health & Safety would probably object these days on the grounds he might catch lung cancer. A small gang came along a bit later to replace the damaged bit and reconnect the house downstream of it. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted February 14, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 14, 2021 (edited) A boiler washout takes place at regular intervals; the loco in the film has one every 10 working days, and as Stationmaster Mike says the interval varied from shed to shed and according to the local work and of course the water. For the Tondu locos on Cwmdimbath, according to the Hodges/Davies books on the subject, this was every 21-23 days, though it does not state if this means consequetive or working days (there was no revenue work on Sundays and the mineral operations wrapped up at Saturday lunchtime). I take this for simplicity to mean that any given loco must dissappear for 2 timetable days every 3 timetable weeks: takes me about 4 operating sessions to work through a day's timetable. So the locos having boiler washout are unavailable for a week to 8 or 9 days of real time. There are several advantages to this. Firstly, it is an excellent excuse to have more locos than you actually need to run your timetable, as if one was needed. Secondly, it is following prototype practice and desireable on that count alone. Thirdly, like in real life, it is a good opportunity to strip down, deep clean, examine, re-lube, and generally fettle locos, thus staying (mostly!) on top of maintenance and giving you a better idea of each individual locos strengths and weaknesses, again prototypical practice. Following Tondu's actual practice, the locos are roughly divided into links; 4144 and 8497 being passenger locos, 5555 and 5524 being the auto link locos, though each link may do each other's work (photos show that non auto locos pulled auto stock as normal trains, and vice versa). 4218 is purely for mineral work, 5633, 6624, an 6672 are the 'heavy mixed traffic' link capable of any work on the layout, and 5707, 5756, and 9649 are the 'lighter MT' link, backed up by 2761. This leaves 6762, for the 'pickup link' although the pickup can be and is hauled by the other panniers, 4557, which is a spare to the passenger and pickup links, and 82001, a Barry interloper for a Rule 1 NPCCS job and an occasional excursion. This is the only loco that does not have a spare or alternative, though there is always the chance that I'll one day complete the NuCast Taff A I started more than 30 years ago... I have to keep track of 'Cwmdimbath Days, and Weeks' to ensure the boiler washout needs are met. If I run out of locos, well, the real shedmaster at Tondu probably did sometimes as well! I have not as yet devised a system allowing for withdrawals from service for repairs, or for visits to main depot (Ebbw Jc in this case) or main workshops. Main workshop overhauls took about 21 working days, effectively the loss of a loco for a month. You can't have too many 57xx, 8750s, or 56xx. Apart from 82001 and the colliery Peckett, all the locos are correctly numbered Tondu prototypes of the correct period, though I am not certain of the liveries actually carried by some of the 56xx. This is relevant because the time period is 1948-58 and some representation of late GW and early BR changeover liveries is needed. I am certain, from photographic evidence or build dates, of 2761, 5707, 5756, 6762, 9649, 4218, 4144, 8497, 5524, 5555, and the cuckoo, 82001. 4557 and the 56xx are awaiting better information and are 'best guess' liveries. Because of the way Tondu worked it's Valley passenger services, with trains splitting and joining to and from the Garw and Ogmore branches and multiple occuaption of the Valleys platform at Bridgend involving locos coupling to and working the train in front so that only one of them had to block the up main by having to run around, each loco hauled train needs 2 or 3 locos to haul it during a working 'Cwmdimbath Time' day, and it is surprising how quickly you run out of locos if you don't keep on top of the roster. I swap at lunchtime with the mineral loco of the day as well, as many of the diagrams involved the locos working in different valleys or to different pits in the afternoon after crew relief around lunchtime. Edited February 14, 2021 by The Johnster 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginelane Posted February 14, 2021 Author Share Posted February 14, 2021 Thanks, really informative how you have taken the prototype and applied it to your model layout shed. Really grateful for all the information this query has produced. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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