Jump to content
 

Locomotion dispute


PenrithBeacon
 Share

Recommended Posts

4 minutes ago, sir douglas said:

if the NRM owns it then they can do what they want with it

 

It had been in it's current position for 163 years.

How would you feel if your family had looked after something for that long, to

get told that because it's important to the nation, it's ownership has been given

to a national museum?

  • Like 1
  • Agree 2
  • Informative/Useful 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Darlington Council has an interesting concept of looking after the towns heritage. Only when it suits and when there is money to be made.

 

Locomotion has not been in the same spot for163 years. It was plinthed outside North Road in the 19th century, then with Derwent plinthed at Bank Top for most of the 20th. It was moved to Stanhope for safe keeping during the Second world war, before returning to Bank Top. It has been in at least 2 different locations inside North Road since 1975, the last time it was moved the councils contractors managed to drop it! As for the "Head of Steam", the former North Road station. It was badly neglected after 1975 and was in a poor state of repair for many years until refurbishment became an unavoidable embarrassment.

 

Mike

 

A born and bred Darlingtonian, and former volunteer at North Road museum.

  • Like 1
  • Agree 4
  • Informative/Useful 9
  • Round of applause 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

As this is a newspaper they can often bend the truth.

 

Without knowing what the NRM are thinking I bet that they are looking to have a few few exhibits together for a themed display.  If this is the scenario then they may have asked to move it to Shildon for a certain period of time.

 

Many of are involved with museums housing loaned exhibits and can expect a recall at some time.  However there seems to be a 25 year rule of thumb where ownership of items get transferred to the location where they are residing.

  • Like 1
  • Agree 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Quite honestly, Shildon "museum" is more of a large shed for keeping things in. There's no ambience, and precious little by way of interpretation.

 

I've not been in the museum at North Road (I am rather ashamed to say), but I am sure it does a far better job at explaining the importance of Locomotion and the Stockton and Darlington railway than Shildon does of explaining anything. Furthermore, Locomotion appears to have pride of place there, whereas it risks gettting (literally) dwarfed at Shildon. It might be nice seeing it alongside Sans Pareil (both the originsl and the replica), but that's really the only advantage in having it at Shildon that I can see.

 

You never know, perahps part of the 200 years celebration could be to encourage travel on the Stockton and Darlington Railway, as far as one is able to these days at any rate. People could be encouraged to visit both Shildon and North Road, and travel between them by train.

  • Like 2
  • Agree 5
Link to post
Share on other sites

On 15/02/2021 at 18:53, jcm@gwr said:

 

It had been in it's current position for 163 years.

How would you feel if your family had looked after something for that long, to

get told that because it's important to the nation, it's ownership has been given

to a national museum?


I mean, that is the founding principles of the British Museum.

 

It's a storm in a teacup being invented by Darlington as far as I can see. This isn't a permanent removal but a celebration of a birthplace of steam. 

Edited by 60B
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, AMJ said:

As this is a newspaper they can often bend the truth.

 

Without knowing what the NRM are thinking I bet that they are looking to have a few few exhibits together for a themed display.  If this is the scenario then they may have asked to move it to Shildon for a certain period of time.

 

Many of are involved with museums housing loaned exhibits and can expect a recall at some time.  However there seems to be a 25 year rule of thumb where ownership of items get transferred to the location where they are residing.


There is apparently an agreement which is renegotiated / renewed every 5 years. That is not the action of someone / an institution which is giving up ownership, but instead suggests they have a strong attachment to their property, the disposition of which they wish to keep under control. 
 

An actively managed loan, no matter how long it is for or how many times it is renewed, does not give ownership rights to the person to whom it is entrusted. 
 

Just as pertinent: who in their right minds from this time on will ever again loan anything to the North Road Museum or Darlington Council?

 

Paul

Link to post
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Jeremy C said:

Quite honestly, Shildon "museum" is more of a large shed for keeping things in. There's no ambience, and precious little by way of interpretation.

 

I've not been in the museum at North Road (I am rather ashamed to say), but I am sure it does a far better job at explaining the importance of Locomotion and the Stockton and Darlington railway than Shildon does of explaining anything. Furthermore, Locomotion appears to have pride of place there, whereas it risks gettting (literally) dwarfed at Shildon. It might be nice seeing it alongside Sans Pareil (both the originsl and the replica), but that's really the only advantage in having it at Shildon that I can see.

 

You never know, perahps part of the 200 years celebration could be to encourage travel on the Stockton and Darlington Railway, as far as one is able to these days at any rate. People could be encouraged to visit both Shildon and North Road, and travel between them by train.


So you’ve never been to North Road but you somehow know...?

 

North Road Museum has the ambience of a cluttered junk shop. They’ve got some great stuff, and personally I love poking around in there, but even a cursory glance around will show Darlington Council has not opened the flood gates of funding (I know that because I’ve been there...).

 

Locomotion, on the other hand, has a rather wonderful collection in a light and spacious building, on which care and money is obviously spent (never enough, of course, but what UK museum has as much money as it wants?).

 

A trivial example: after more than a century, the wooden buffer beam on NER’s electric shunter, ES1, had shrunk and split with age so badly that the buffers were drooping. Locomotion invested time and money in carefully crafting a replacement, to restore what (to most visitors) I imagine would be an exhibit of marginal importance — but one that is historically important to telling the story of early electrification. They used that as an excuse to tell the story of the craftsmanship that went into the original build, the new beam crafted and finished in public next to the loco. 
 

I think you are selling Locomotion short. 
 

Paul

  • Like 6
  • Agree 7
  • Informative/Useful 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Jeremy C said:

Quite honestly, Shildon "museum" is more of a large shed for keeping things in. There's no ambience, and precious little by way of interpretation.

 

I've not been in the museum at North Road (I am rather ashamed to say), but I am sure it does a far better job at explaining the importance of Locomotion and the Stockton and Darlington railway than Shildon does of explaining anything. Furthermore, Locomotion appears to have pride of place there, whereas it risks gettting (literally) dwarfed at Shildon. It might be nice seeing it alongside Sans Pareil (both the originsl and the replica), but that's really the only advantage in having it at Shildon that I can see.

 

You never know, perahps part of the 200 years celebration could be to encourage travel on the Stockton and Darlington Railway, as far as one is able to these days at any rate. People could be encouraged to visit both Shildon and North Road, and travel between them by train.

I'm afraid that I have to agree with the first paragraph. The exhibits at Shilden seem to be oppressed by the low roof of the building.

I had intended, during the summer of 2020, to take a room in a B&B that was reasonably local to Darlington and make a visit to the museum, but it was not to be.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I've posted about this On another thread.

 

I write from the perspective of being a volunteer at the 'Locomotion' museum in Shildon.

Yes, Locomotion No.1 has been on display in Darlington since 1857 (North Road/Bank Top/'Head of Steam').

However, Shildon was the engineering centre of the original 1825 railway.

There is a lot of educational and cultural benefit that could be brought out from the current level of interest

 

The public debate on this issue has, as seems to have become regrettably normal in 'Brexit Britain' been extremely politicised, ill-informed, and abusive.

 

It has reached the level of rape threats being made.

 

However, whatever your loyalties or interests in this matter, please do all you can to reduce the horrific language currently being used against my colleagues in SMG/Railway Museum/Locomotion.

 

(Also,if ever  we reach post-Covid times, may I suggest a visit to Locomotion? We try to be friendly to all our visitors,  and are happy to encourage interest in the exhibits at all levels of detail.) 

Edited by drmditch
  • Like 8
  • Friendly/supportive 8
Link to post
Share on other sites

Pity the NRM / Shildon didn't build a working replica of locomotion for the anniversary. They could have run it up and down their track at Shildon. 

The museum in Darlington is very good and so is Shildon. My only complaint about Shildon was that the cafe only took cash not cards, and there was no cash machine so I had to go hungry.

Link to post
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, drmditch said:

...

 

The public debate on this issue has, as seems to have become regrettably normal in 'Brexit Britain' been extremely politicised, ill-informed, and abusive.

 

It has reached the level of rape threats being made.

 

...

That hasn't happened here, so why mention it here?

  • Agree 5
Link to post
Share on other sites

There is a working replica of Locomotion No 1 at Beamish Museum, though I believe that the boiler needs attention which can surely be done for 2025? Darlington Council has neglected the town's history for so long, the museum at North Road (also it should be noted home to the team that built Tornado and where the P2 is being assembled - access only on Open Days) is more akin to a shed full of interesting stuff but not really presented to tell a story and quite old fashioned.

 

I agree that Locomotion at Shildon is a very nice modern museum and far removed from a "low roofed shed" and has hosted some rather wonderful events...

 

spacer.png

...one short, she was otherwise busy for the family shot...

spacer.png

 

Seriously, if you are visiting the Frozen Wastelands of the Northern England do not miss Locomotion!

 

(Or Beamish, the Tanfield Railway, NYMR, Wensleydale Railway, etc.)

This message brought to you by the Frozen Wastelands Tourist Board.

  • Like 5
  • Funny 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold
On 18/02/2021 at 11:26, friscopete said:

Cut in down the middle and display   at  various sites .Have half racing the other half .The possibilties are endless.cant think why it hasnt been done before .

 

I think that's a good idea. If you take the wheels off, you can have 4 prime exhibits. One for Darlington,  Locomotion, York  & the Science Museum. 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

The Germans cut a Bavarian class B VI in half so it must be the right thing to do .

Come to think of it they also cut an NSU Wankel Spyder in half and gave it to the Science Museum .I owned one for my sins and fancied nicking some parts I needed off it .NSU spares support was non existent even just 6 years after they were made .

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

I suppose it depends what Shildon are going to do with No.1?

 

If they are going to do something really good then it should make the trip, if they are just going to stick it in the corner with a sign saying "200th birthday" then leave it at North Road, particularly if Darlington are going to do something better.

 

The fact that Beamish has a replica is a very good point, perhaps it would be better at Shildon than the real thing if it can haul trains on the demonstration line?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...