Novice Lane Stabling Sidings, late 90's diesel depot construction

[Joner]

First attempt this afternoon. 

The fiddle yard being 2 tracks top left. The right one a headshunt, the left one is on/off the depot leading down the back of the depot building. I've got it into my head engines wouldn't just arrive directly into the shed which is why I keep putting a kick back on arrival. I suppose it would depend on what you imagine comes beyond the fiddle yard really? Any way...

Service shed is now at the bottom with fuel point on the same roads outside the building. Another kick back to access the 4 stabling sidings next to the fiddle yard. I'm trying to get a lot of sidings in. I could drop to 3 to make it more spacious but when I look at these types of sidings they seem to be closer together. True or wishful thinking?

 

Please let me know what you think.

 

I'll be back with another after I've got the kids from school. 

 

Paul 

Edited March 9, 2021 by Joner

[Joner]

Second up

 

This one I feel more relaxed about.

Single fiddle road top left leads directly to the shed and fuelling roads (shown with sanding  blocks). To the right is a kick back for access to the 4 stabling roads, again this can be reduced to 3.

 

Paul 

[Mol_PMB]

These are all looking good. 

In a model we normally want an excuse for lots of shunting and reversals, whereas in the real thing its a pain in the backside and the smallest number of moves is a bonus. So there’s a bit of a trade-off between realism and operational interest. 

 

In a depot like this, most locos are going to be stabled in the open and they will only go to the shed for exams and repairs. Many will need fuelling though. So there should be a relatively easy route from the fiddle yard to the stabling sidings via the fuel road, and ideally two such routes so that an incoming loco taking fuel doesn’t block all outgoing locos. 

 

I am wondering if there is a role for a diamond or slip in the middle of the layout to achieve this. 

 

You shouldn’t need to use the shed as a headshunt to anywhere - it would disrupt the guys working there. 

[Andrew P]

1 hour ago, Joner said:

Second up

 

This one I feel more relaxed about.

Single fiddle road top left leads directly to the shed and fuelling roads (shown with sanding  blocks). To the right is a kick back for access to the 4 stabling roads, again this can be reduced to 3.

 

Paul 

That last one does  it for me Paul, makes sense having the two out side Tracks together and the Shed to one side.

[Mol_PMB]

12 minutes ago, Andrew P said:

That last one does  it for me Paul, makes sense having the two out side Tracks together and the Shed to one side.

Yes, I agree, Andrew.

 

I think there should be fuelling facilities there and both roads should both be capable of feeding some of the stabling sidings directly. They needn’t each feed all of them, but at least some options would be good. 

 

Normally a loco will come on shed and the first port of call is the fuel point. It will tale a while to fill, and the staff will review the fault book and any need for an exam or repair. If it’s OK or something that can be fixed with minimal equipment outdoors, then it will go to the sidings. If it’s a bigger job to fix then it will go in the shed. 

 

While this is occurring on the fuel point you don’t want to be blocking all the rest of the stabled locos in. That would be dull operationally as well as unrealistic. So flexibility of routing around the depot is a good thing. 

[Andrew P]

1 minute ago, Mol_PMB said:

Yes, I agree, Andrew.

 

I think there should be fuelling facilities there and both roads should both be capable of feeding some of the stabling sidings directly. They needn’t each feed all of them, but at least some options would be good. 

 

Normally a loco will come on shed and the first port of call is the fuel point. It will tale a while to fill, and the staff will review the fault book and any need for an exam or repair. If it’s OK or something that can be fixed with minimal equipment outdoors, then it will go to the sidings. If it’s a bigger job to fix then it will go in the shed. 

 

While this is occurring on the fuel point you don’t want to be blocking all the rest of the stabled locos in. That would be dull operationally as well as unrealistic. So flexibility of routing around the depot is a good thing. 

Excellent points.

This was my Kingsmill TMD in OO from last year.

 

[Mol_PMB]

This is all done with normal points but a double slip in the middle would save space. 

I’ve drawn it crudely, I’m sure it could be made to look much nicer with some more flowing curves. 

 

In this layout the front fuel road can feed all four stabling sidings, the rear one can only feed two of them. 

[Andrew P]

26 minutes ago, Mol_PMB said:

This is all done with normal points but a double slip in the middle would save space. 

I’ve drawn it crudely, I’m sure it could be made to look much nicer with some more flowing curves. 

 

In this layout the front fuel road can feed all four stabling sidings, the rear one can only feed two of them. 

I like that. Simple but more realistic.

[D6775]

Another very crude suggestion thrown together in Any Rail. I find it useful for playing about with ideas, but nothing beats laying track on a board with some stock to work out clearances etc.

 

 

I've flipped the shed to the other end allowing direct access to the fiddle yard from the stabling roads. Key points would be to make sure you could get a loco on the blue fuel road in clear both ends and in the neck/headshunt to the left. I think it is going to be tight and as others have said a double slip might be of use. This would mean you cold bring a loco in on to the fuel point, get fuelled then either onto the stabling point on into the maintenance shed depend on requirements for exams.  

[Joner]

1 hour ago, Mol_PMB said:

 

You shouldn’t need to use the shed as a headshunt to anywhere - it would disrupt the guys working there. 

Sorry if this was implied.

I just meant loco's coming straight into a shed from the fiddle yard ie without having to traverse a point or 2, not to be used as a headshunt. 

 

I think all the plans I've done so far have included 2 lines for refuelling, usually 1 on the depot approach and the other a long Siding next to it to help service double headers ie class 20's and 31's without the need for uncoupling or fouling points. This also leaves a line free to access the sidings .

 

Some of the plans can imply a run round on the fiddle yard entrance/exit.

 

 

[Rivercider]

It is a good idea to lay out the track like that, to get a feel for it.

Mrs Rivercider had to put up with sheets of hardboard with old Hornby track

laid out on our living room floor for a couple of weeks.

Each day I would add or move a siding or two, but it did work, in the end.

 

I agree with previous comments to try and leave a little space for it to breathe,

but you are right that your fan of stabling sidings can be closer together to give room elsewhere.

I remember trainspotting visits of the 1970s walking between close packed rows of locos at weekends.

Edit - the stabling sidings at the back of Bath Road are quite snug.

17/5/82.

As has been mentioned, ease of access to the fuel point is important for efficient working. 

 

cheers 

Edited March 9, 2021 by Rivercider
Additional photo

[Joner]

55 minutes ago, D6775 said:

Another very crude suggestion thrown together in Any Rail. I find it useful for playing about with ideas, but nothing beats laying track on a board with some stock to work out clearances etc.

 

 

This is very similar to a previous plan I had albeit with less sidings by the shed. The fuel point moved to outside the shed to give more accessibility to both sidings and larger or doubled engines for fuelling. 

 

Paul

Edited March 9, 2021 by Joner
Mistake

[Joner]

51 minutes ago, Rivercider said:

It is a good idea to lay out the track like that, to get a feel for it.

Mrs Rivercider had to put up with sheets of hardboard with old Hornby track

laid out on our living room floor for a couple of weeks.

Each day I would add or move a siding or two, but it did work, in the end.

 

I agree with previous comments to try and leave a little space for it to breathe,

but you are right that your fan of stabling sidings can be closer together to give room elsewhere.

I remember trainspotting visits of the 1970s walking between close packed rows of locos at weekends.

Edit - the stabling sidings at the back of Bath Road are quite snug.

17/5/82.

As has been mentioned, ease of access to the fuel point is important for efficient working. 

 

cheers 

This picture was what was in my head when planning the sidings. I spent many years at the end of that platform in the early 90's. 

 

Paul

[47606odin]

5 hours ago, D6775 said:

Another very crude suggestion thrown together in Any Rail. I find it useful for playing about with ideas, but nothing beats laying track on a board with some stock to work out clearances etc.

 

 

I've flipped the shed to the other end allowing direct access to the fiddle yard from the stabling roads. Key points would be to make sure you could get a loco on the blue fuel road in clear both ends and in the neck/headshunt to the left. I think it is going to be tight and as others have said a double slip might be of use. This would mean you cold bring a loco in on to the fuel point, get fuelled then either onto the stabling point on into the maintenance shed depend on requirements for exams.  

i like this version, but I would put the fuel bowser outside the shed door like at Tinsley and leave open space in the middle to allow photos

Edited March 10, 2021 by 47606odin

[woodyfox]

The headshunt to the shed would be much longer in reality as many shunts involved 2 or 3 locos with one working and others failures. 

[Joner]

3 hours ago, woodyfox said:

The headshunt to the shed would be much longer in reality as many shunts involved 2 or 3 locos with one working and others failures. 

All the sidings and headshunts are designed to take 2x class 60's. This being long enough for 2x 37's with an 08 pushing them around if need be.

 

Paul

[Joner]

8 hours ago, 47606odin said:

i like this version, but I would put the fuel bowser outside the shed door like at Tinsley and leave open space in the middle to allow photos

I would prefer that but I see a problem when fuelling 2 engines coupled together ie 20's and 31's. Would 1 engine be allowed to half enter the shed to allow the other to refuel? Its the reason I had a long siding next to the shed but also to store the TTA's.

 

Paul 

[37114]

Nice work Joner, look forward to seeing how this develops.

[Joner]

I finally glued the last supports on the other day and let it set for 24hrs. It seems to have straightened out the sides more than I was expecting. I was worried it was going to curve the roof but that's not happened. I let it set with weights on ie coke cans  to help it keep straight. 

Next up put all the sub assemblies together. 

 

Paul 

[Joner]

I've glued both side pieces to the rear section but not the roof yet. I didn't want to try and glue it all in one go as something is bound to misalign and I won't notice until its dry! Also one end support on the side was a fraction too high and putting the wall at the bottom too high not matching the corner. I anticipated this so only glued them enough so I knew I could get a blade in and snap the joint without too much fuss. I'll give this an hour and try the roof.

 

Paul

[David Bell]

I had the same trouble. I thought it might be because I left the kit on the floor for a couple of months before I opened it, we have underfloor heating.

I tried gluing 4 sections of wall together and got the same graceful curve at the lower edge as you did. I took that to bits and glued each piece separately to a  straight wooden batten. I am lucky because you can't see one side of my shed wall since it is effectively the backscene. I don't think that solution can work if you are building the shed conventionally.

 

Best of luck with it

Cheers

David

[Joner]

 

Hi people.

 

This weekend I managed to find some modelling time and fixed all the sub assemblies together and I now have a windowless shed!

It's actually straightened out better than I thought it would. I will add extra support inside where the joins are to reinforce and solidify the structure as it needs to be removable. I may even put in an MDF or ply floor with the track inset (with a pit) to keep the walls from bowing. 

 

I'll fit the glazing later this week. The poly didn't cloud the windows as I'd hoped, probably because I wanted it to! If I wanted clear windows I'm sure it would have worked. They will have to be painted and weathered accordingly.

 

I may change the doors on the front of the building. I don't think there very good. I'll look at doing roller shutters from top to bottom instead of side to side and have a look at getting them working 

 

Once the windows are in and the floor test fitted I'll fit the roof walkways, ladders, drain pipes etc then onto painting.

 

Even though measuring gives you an idea how big this is, it's bigger than I was expecting! 

 

Paul

[Joner]

22 hours ago, David Bell said:

I had the same trouble. I thought it might be because I left the kit on the floor for a couple of months before I opened it, we have underfloor heating.

I tried gluing 4 sections of wall together and got the same graceful curve at the lower edge as you did. I took that to bits and glued each piece separately to a  straight wooden batten. I am lucky because you can't see one side of my shed wall since it is effectively the backscene. I don't think that solution can work if you are building the shed conventionally.

 

Best of luck with it

Cheers

David

Hi David 

 

I've been following your build since I found I had a problem with the curvature. Very interesting building it inside out.  I do like the roof vent you put inside using the left over parts, I may nick that idea if that's okay with you?

Yes I was surprised the walls straightened out aswell as they did without any need for a batten. I will add strength inside anyway as it will get moved around. 

 

Paul

[David Bell]

1 hour ago, Joner said:

Hi David 

 

I've been following your build since I found I had a problem with the curvature. Very interesting building it inside out.  I do like the roof vent you put inside using the left over parts, I may nick that idea if that's okay with you?

Yes I was surprised the walls straightened out aswell as they did without any need for a batten. I will add strength inside anyway as it will get moved around. 

 

Paul

You are very welcome to use that idea.

I have to make another nine or so!

I was pleased to see your walls straightened out. That is a worry off the list.

Cheers

David