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Floor level baseboard design


whatsatender
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I'm trying to come up with a floor level layout but rather than having a solid board like a closed frame setup, use a base board more like one would do when building to an open frame design.

 

I'm trying to come up with a simple cost effective way of doing it and wondered if anyone has any thoughts on using laminate flooring, luxury vinyl tile, cable trunking, or perhaps has another idea.

 

 

 

 

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  • RMweb Gold

im not sure any of the materials you mention are that suitable. There are reasons they are not used commonly. For example, laminate flooring is very hard and almost impossible to nail or drill into satisfacorily.

However you are going to use it, at floor level or up on legs, you really cannot do better than ply. Cross members can be made by laminating three layers of 6mm together to make a really strong and lightweight beam, and outer edges with 9mm ply. Make everything 100mm deep for simplicity. Then you can put whatever tops on you like.

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58 minutes ago, ikcdab said:

However you are going to use it, at floor level or up on legs, you really cannot do better than ply.

 

Agreed. The questions about how/what the OP intends are important, though, because they will give clues as to what sort of plywood structure will best suit the application - "conventional baseboard type" structures might be over-elaborate for the need.

 

Laminate flooring is designed for two jobs: impact/scuff resistance; and, compressive strength, neither of which is needed for a model railway, and as ikcdab says, it is a nightmare to drill or pin into, because it is designed to resist that sort of thing.

 

 

Edited by Nearholmer
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1 hour ago, Nearholmer said:

You mean a layout which lays on the floor?

 

To be permanent, or something that is frequently packed away?

 

And, are we talking something 'scenically developed', or just plain track?

 

To sit on the floor yes, but ideally which would allow the possibility of raising it up onto an open frame type setup in the future.

 

A good portion of it would remain in place but some sections would need to be packed away when not in use. 

 

it would be scenically developed up to the cess area or possibly allowing enough width to allow for a small embankment with some fencing on either side. I was thinking about board widths of around 14cm for double track and 7cm for single track.

 

Idea being that at a later date the track bed sections could be raised off the floor and mounted onto an open frame to allow for a full scenic layout. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, ikcdab said:

im not sure any of the materials you mention are that suitable. There are reasons they are not used commonly. For example, laminate flooring is very hard and almost impossible to nail or drill into satisfacorily.

However you are going to use it, at floor level or up on legs, you really cannot do better than ply. Cross members can be made by laminating three layers of 6mm together to make a really strong and lightweight beam, and outer edges with 9mm ply. Make everything 100mm deep for simplicity. Then you can put whatever tops on you like.

 

19 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

 

Agreed. The questions about how/what the OP intends are important, though, because they will give clues as to what sort of plywood structure will best suit the application - "conventional baseboard type" structures might be over-elaborate for the need.

 

Laminate flooring is designed for two jobs: impact/scuff resistance; and, compressive strength, neither of which is needed for a model railway, and as ikcdab says, it is a nightmare to drill or pin into, because it is designed to resist that sort of thing.

 

 

 

Ply was my first thought, I was just trying to get creative. My only concern with ply was that I'm looking at relatively small thin sections, and was a little concerned about warping since it would just be laid out on the floor rather than fixed to an open frame for the foreseeable future. I'm thinking along the lines of boards that are 90cm x 15cm for double track runs and 90cm x 7 cm for single track runs. 

 

 

 

 

 

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So, a bit like this then? https://maldontrack.com/layouts.php

 

They are basically 9mm ply tiles, and the idea certainly works, but could be improved upon.

 

The tile-joining arrangement is a bit basic, and fiddly (involving 'fishplates'), and personally I think 9mm ply is a bit thin for the application, unless it is really high quality stuff.

 

I think that for what you intend, I would use 12mm or even 18mm Russian or Latvian birch-ply, which is a superb material, very stable and very robust, and would create an alignment system, probably using brass alignment dowels, and a board-joining system using table-leaf catches or over-centre latches.

 

18mm birch-ply would usually be regarded as "far too heavy" for a baseboard, but you are really trying to create not a baseboard, but a track-bed, and in the sections-widths you mention it won't be heavy in manageable (1200mm?) lengths*. Added advantage is that you can cut curved tiles.

 

I would lift it a bit off the floor, as in the Maldon method, to allow for wiring to be on the underside.

 

Later, a lightweight framework could support the same track-bed off the floor.

 

* Quick calculation says an 18x140x1220 tile would weigh 1.88kg, add feet, alignment dowels, and catches, probably c2kg.

 

 

Edited by Nearholmer
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11 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

So, a bit like this then? https://maldontrack.com/layouts.php

 

 

Yes that's the sort of thing. The only reason I was thinking around 90cm long sections was to match flexi track lengths. Seemed a bit silly to me to create extra/ unnecessary rail breaks - although some sections will have points.

 

I was thinking if going down the ply route I'd probably pay for someone to CNC cut the pieces for me to get them absolutely perfect, particularly the curved sections.  

 

Raising slightly off the floor like that does look like a good idea. 

 

I need to give the joining up a bit of thought. rather than having one solid piece underneath maybe something either side leaving a space for wiring connections to run down the middle would be better. 

 

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8 minutes ago, whatsatender said:

I was thinking if going down the ply route I'd probably pay for someone to CNC cut the pieces for me to get them absolutely perfect, particularly the curved sections.  

actually its pretty easy to cut things smoothly with a jigsaw. But if you are going down the cnc route, then you might as well get them to cut notches and pegs at each end, just like kids wooden railway track, scalelectrix or jigsaws.

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7 minutes ago, whatsatender said:

 

 The only reason I was thinking around 90cm long sections was to match flexi track lengths. Seemed a bit silly to me to create extra/ unnecessary rail breaks - although some sections will have points.

 

I thought that at first, but am now including a minimum of 2 pieces of track from 1 board edge to t'other, allowing a slight expansion gap between the 2.

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If you can get it machine-cut, brilliant, and the 900mm I now understand.

 

The detail of the whole idea needs thought and experiment, partly because the action of joining the tiles needs to work from above. Maybe screw "tongues" of aluminium L section to the sides to give alignment, unless you can dowel it really accurately into the ends, perhaps to mate with dowels set into the sides.

 

 

 

CED582E3-455F-4FCC-8F7D-E64A5CE44E86.jpeg

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10 minutes ago, ikcdab said:

actually its pretty easy to cut things smoothly with a jigsaw

 

Please can you come round and give a lesson.

 

I always have trouble with the blade flexing and giving a not-square cut when going round tight curves in thick material!

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6 minutes ago, ikcdab said:

actually its pretty easy to cut things smoothly with a jigsaw. But if you are going down the cnc route, then you might as well get them to cut notches and pegs at each end, just like kids wooden railway track, scalelectrix or jigsaws.

 

I don't have any woodworking tools to speak of, let alone a jigsaw so I was leaning towards the CNC route, but it kinda depends on what the quotes start looking like! My very first thoughts was a jigsaw type design. The initial concept was very much 'The ultimate E-Z track system'. The only thing with that is that it would make the ballasting much harder. The intent is to ballast the track have static grass on the edges etc. 

 

 

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The sort of cam-dowels that Ikea provide to hold wardrobes together might work in this application.

 

If you made-up a drilling guide/jig, you could probably get the precision needed for those, because they don't need the precision-fitting that brass alignment dowels do.

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11 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

The sort of cam-dowels that Ikea provide to hold wardrobes together might work in this application.

 

If you made-up a drilling guide/jig, you could probably get the precision needed for those, because they don't need the precision-fitting that brass alignment dowels do.

 

im wondering if going down the route of having each tile lifted slightly by having another bit of wood might then lend itself to using something like wago connectors in the end pieces instead of dowels. push them together and then it makes the electrical connection between the rail sections.

 

 

Edited by whatsatender
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  • RMweb Gold

Another one of those seemingly mad and off the wall threads which turns into a goldmine of excellent ideas and links to very interesting other work.  I just love RMWeb for this kind of thing.  Maybe I could do that   ........ ?

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This talk of permanent floor level layouts sounds painful, if you have a back like mine.  However floor or low level layouts as in up to 1ft to 18" off the floor make an awful lot of sense in modern truss filled lofts. 

 There are two diverging ways of tackling layout building, mine, invest on power saws, and obtain materials from skips and suck it and see, or the modern plan carefully, buy expensive lazer cut components and just assemble them.

A cheap table saw or bench saw, about £100 new with a 75mm cut which can cut 6ft plus long planks lengthways can rapidly turn a pile of scrap laminate flooring obtained free from "Freecycle" or a skip near you into a very adequate baseboard frame.  Its hard, plasticky but can be secured by drilling to take dowels and  glued or screwed with countersunk screws or  bolts as long as you don't thread into it.  It may even tap to a coarse UNC or Metric thread. Its a bit hard for baseboard surface but drill nicely with a power drill.   Its all to do with priorities and space.  I have wondered about a floor level loft layout operated from a seat within the loft hatch...  Good viewing angle, good access as long as you don't step on the trains...

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1 hour ago, DavidCBroad said:

There are two diverging ways of tackling layout building, mine, invest on power saws, and obtain materials from skips and suck it and see, or the modern plan carefully, buy expensive lazer cut components and just assemble them.

 

One of the factors in that is the sort of home a person lives in. I know a few older guys who live in retirement flats, and power saws and the contents of skips are very much frowned upon in such places, ditto a lot of the flats younger guys live in.

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On 28/02/2021 at 17:32, Nearholmer said:

 

One of the factors in that is the sort of home a person lives in.

 

Pretty much. The days of an average person on an average wage being able to afford a 2 up 2 down with a decent loft space is well and truly gone in most places. 

 

 

For a lot of us its either get creative, or forget about it - and stick to things that don't take up a lot of space and/or can easily be moved to the next overpriced rental property......... like a playstation.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

I have a floor based modular system as I live in a rented flat.

I use plywood raised on 10*30mm strips of softwood. The 30mm clearance allows for bolts between the sections (a hole on one side and a furniture nut in the other, M6). I use a 90 degree angle on a hex shank with a bolt turner bit (see photo, I can't find the right words to describe it.....)  to connect the sections (with electric screwdriver to screw in the bolts), but I also use the fishplates to align the rails. My modules are very small, based on setrack geometry. The track endings are always perpendicular to the board at standard (67mm) spacing to the boards can be connected in different order. The 30mm also allows for mounting point motors (both solenoid and SG90 servo)

If I did it again, I'd be a bit more precise with the hole location to do away with the fishplates and secure the rail ends with PCB to the board.

This is a temporary/play layout with little scenery; I used 6mm ply for economy plus it's lighter and quicker to cut. Most sections are supported every 30cm, I tried longer sections but they did sag and I have had some problems with warping.

 

PS I am in the "can't cut a straight line with a jigsaw" club, but discovered that a regular hand/garden saw works well for straight lines, I supported the board on upturned plastic boxes (being careful not to saw into them.....) The jigsaw was great for the curved sections, where wobbles are much less noticeable.

IMG_20210327_184329.jpg

IMG_20210327_184744.jpg

Edited by Playing trains with kids
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