Jump to content
 

Help required on North British railway 474 class 2-2-2 from cir 1876


Londontram
 Share

Recommended Posts

As the title says I'm after any information and photo's of the above named locomotives. There was two built to a Dugauld Drummond design and built by Neilson and Co given the NBR numbers 474 and 475

 Any information, photo's or drawings would be a help and am particularly interested on what type of brakes they had towards the end of there lives and even when the end of there lives was.

   I believe they were Air braked but where was the air pump?

  Thanks for any help you can give.

 

20210226_144400.jpg

Edited by Londontram
Spelling correction
Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, presumably it's on the offside somewhere. Just stick it on the side of the smokebox and you've got probably a 50-50 chance of being right, and noone else will know anyway :jester:.

 

Seriously, though, that's a very handsome loco. I assume you're intending to build one. Do keep us posted, as I have a soft spot for singles, especially the lesser known ones. Lovely though they are, the works of Stirling and Johnson do tend to hog the limelight somewhat.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
3 hours ago, Londontram said:

As the title says I'm after any information and photo's of the above named locomotives. There was two built to a Dugauld Drummond design and built by Neilson and Co given the NBR numbers 474 and 475

 Any information, photo's or drawings would be a help and am particularly interested on what type of brakes they had towards the end of there lives and even when the end of there lives was.

   I believe they were Air braked but where was the air pump?

  Thanks for any help you can give.

 

20210226_144400.jpg

Plenty of photos of NBR locos showing them on the RHS here

 

475 BERWICK - Drummond NBR Class 474 2-2-2 - built 1876 by Neilson & Co. for Edinburgh-Glasgow expresses - 1910 withdrawn.

 

 

Including another photo of 474, but the same side.

Link to post
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Londontram said:

As the title says I'm after any information and photo's of the above named locomotives. There was two built to a Dugauld Drummond design and built by Neilson and Co given the NBR numbers 474 and 475

 Any information, photo's or drawings would be a help and am particularly interested on what type of brakes they had towards the end of there lives and even when the end of there lives was.

   I believe they were Air braked but where was the air pump?

  Thanks for any help you can give.

 

20210226_144400.jpg

There are drawings, sadly both of the same, left-hand, side as the photo, in the two books on NBR locos available from the NBR Study Group. 

The NBR was an active proponent of the Westinghouse air-brake, and from 1877 fitted all new passenger stock with this brake.  The singles, being built in 1876 were probably early on the conversion list.  Although William Stroudley had left Cowlairs in 1865, there seemed to be strong links between the him and his old friends there, Drummond having spent time at Brighton under Stroudley, so there were lots of similarities in the way of thinking at the two works, at opposite ends of Great Britain.  The positioning of the Westinghouse pumps was pure Stroudley - on tender locos it would be fixed to the side of the firebox, and on tanks it was on the front part of the cab side.

7 hours ago, kevinlms said:

Plenty of photos of NBR locos showing them on the RHS here

 

475 BERWICK - Drummond NBR Class 474 2-2-2 - built 1876 by Neilson & Co. for Edinburgh-Glasgow expresses - 1910 withdrawn.

 

 

Including another photo of 474, but the same side.

Nice picture, but is there a  link missing?

I cannot find any photos of the NBR singles on the correct side, but this is how it was done at Brighton

325-Abergavenny-f.jpg.26125cb4acda50879dcafcc702ed97a9.jpg

A pump on the smokebox - a ghastly twentieth-century concept!

8 hours ago, PatB said:

Well, presumably it's on the offside somewhere. Just stick it on the side of the smokebox and you've got probably a 50-50 chance of being right, and no-one else will know anyway :jester:.

 

Seriously, though, that's a very handsome loco. I assume you're intending to build one. Do keep us posted, as I have a soft spot for singles, especially the lesser known ones. Lovely though they are, the works of Stirling and Johnson do tend to hog the limelight somewhat.

Edited by Nick Holliday
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

More than likely on the right hand side of the firebox as in the picture of the Stroudley single above.   That is where the Westinghouse pumps were situated on tender locomotives on the Caledonian where Drummond moved to after his period at the North British.   Drummond seemed to be strongly influenced by Stroudley and a lot of Stroudley features appeared on his locomotives designed for the NB and the Caledonian.  In fact some of these features were still apparent on Caledonian designs by his successors on the Caledonian.

 

Jim.

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, PatB said:

Seriously, though, that's a very handsome loco. I assume you're intending to build one. Do keep us posted, as I have a soft spot for singles, especially the lesser known ones. 

Thankyou Nick I was yes as like you I have a passion for early Scottish locos by Drummond and others who followed the Stroudley school of thought and design.

 

 At this point I'm going to shatter all your excitement and expectations as it's going to be a slightly loose scale layout quality loco using one of these as a starting point.

 

20210228_081912.jpg

It's not so daft as it might first seem infact the Caley single was built only 9 years after the NB loco, there both Drummond inspired designs and both built by Neilson and Co 

 The idea is to take the Triang Model and reduce the smoke box by about 2mm and remove about 9 mm from the running plate infront of the smoke box.

 I've got a spare smoke box front from from an incomplete  Jameson Jumbo kit with the right wing profile, this kit will provide a chimney too.

 New hand rails to replace the moulded ones and using a spare rear wheel set convert the twin axle front bogie to a single axle one, it should be a full length chassis but this option will give some flexibility for curves and points ect.

 

 The tender tank is ok but new side frames with the underslung springs will be drawn and cut with my Silhouette cutter.

 I'm DC so nothing complex there but I will add pickups to the tender wheels to aid smoother running.

 

Now with all your help it seems the brake air pump is in the same place as the one on the Caley loco so the scope is there to leave that well alone.

 Apart from a few other details like a new dome and whistle that's going to be about it.

 

 The one down side that can't be changed easily is that the Caley Single has slightly larger wheels and thus main splashers but I'm thinking unless you knew you probably would never notice so am happy to live with that.

 

 This with some of the new Hattons/Hornby generic carriages should make a nice cir 1880 train.

 What do you all think

Edited by Londontram
Add content
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...