Looking Brighter at Llangollen

[96701]

3 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Suggest all you want. I'm not in charge of purchasing.   

 

I was just passing on information garnered from people I knew when I was a member, so that people are a bit more informed and not speculating. I haven't been a member for nearly twenty years so I'm certainly not speaking with any official voice.

 

I was told the priority is the coaches with disability access and the crane. With the strange function coach with BR Mark 3 parts being higher than the normal Mark Ones as it was used for things like weddings which was a big form of income.

 

 

 

 

BTW the RMB has already gone. Spotted going east. No idea of destination but I believe it's the Spa Valley. Not a railway I'm familiar with.

I wasn't speculating. The railway put a call out recently for assistance with the re-roping of the 12t Plasser and the repair to the Ekco Safe Load Indicator. Being as how I used to help look after these cranes (among others) for the Eastern Region when they were delivered, I volunteered my services. Although the lockdown prevented me from attending, the info that me and another chap helped them to get the crane going, and it along with the Atlas worked on the recent renewal of the River Dee bridge waybeams.

[5944]

Pannier 6430 has left to go to Buckfastleigh for the completion of repairs. Autocoach 167 has departed to Chinnor for at least the summer. 

[96701]

A light at the end of the tunnel:

 

https://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/llangollen-railway-targets-summer-opening-20482398

[rab]

Is it time to change the thread title to 'Looking good at Llangollen' ???

[steve W]

1 hour ago, rab said:

Is it time to change the thread title to 'Looking good at Llangollen' ???

Agreed.  There you go, title changed.

[MatthewCarty]

As a volunteer at LR, I can tell you that things have been feeling ‘brighter at Llangollen’ since the new board took over and gave some clear and frank updates as to what the financial situation was. Only way is up now!

 

The auction ends middle of next week, with the accessible adapted TSOs, 12 ton crane and road railer being the priorities for the trust to purchase. After this we will really be able to start to think about getting things ready for services to begin again. A lot of work has been taking place in the background but work should start to be more visible soon (particularly with the easing of COVID restrictions as well).

 

Thank you to anyone who has made a donation. If anyone feels able to make a donation no matter how big/small, they are appreciated. The appeal page can be found here https://llangollenrailway.enthuse.com/cf/rolling-stock-appeal

[Bucoops]

Did they get to keep the core items they wanted though?

[MatthewCarty]

59 minutes ago, Bucoops said:

Did they get to keep the core items they wanted though?

Those in charge will comment with exact details when everything is fully confirmed, but overall the outcome was probably about as good as could be hoped for given the very competitive nature of the auction. I believe some were slightly shocked that the bidding went as consistently high as it did. £38 000 for a MK1 certainly makes the 1:76.2 scale Bachmann models look cheap at roughly a thousandth of the price!

[Northmoor]

24 minutes ago, MatthewCarty said:

Those in charge will comment with exact details when everything is fully confirmed, but overall the outcome was probably about as good as could be hoped for given the very competitive nature of the auction. I believe some were slightly shocked that the bidding went as consistently high as it did. £38 000 for a MK1 certainly makes the 1:76.2 scale Bachmann models look cheap at roughly a thousandth of the price!

It shouldn't be a surprise really.  There has been many a Mark 1 taken out of preserved operation (so clearly not a complete basket case) for a rebuild which end up costing £20-30k.  Some embryonic preservation schemes still seem to believe you can buy a cheap coach in adequate condition to carry passengers straight away but I think those days passed a long time ago.

A busy heritage line won't see this as £38k of costs but £38k of revenue-earning asset (especially if this was the catering vehicle).  Consider a TSO: 64 seats which on a typical preserved line each will carry a passenger paying £10 for a return/day ticket.  It will do at least two round trips per day, so has the potential to earn £1280/day.  Therefore the new owner might earn back the purchase price in just over 30 operating days.

[Bomag]

As long as the underframe and ends of a Mk1 are structurally sound then the rest could be all but missing and still it would be worth buying if a railway wants a  'speciality' vehicle e.g. a proper multiple use disabled access coach. The Churnet Valley 35473 is late BSK built with melamine interiors and florescent lighting but has early model wooden panelling for the sections not used for the disabled.  So £38k for a decent asbestos free Mk1 would not surprise me.

[martinT]

On 08/05/2021 at 09:30, MatthewCarty said:

Thank you to anyone who has made a donation. If anyone feels able to make a donation no matter how big/small, they are appreciated. The appeal page can be found here https://llangollenrailway.enthuse.com/cf/rolling-stock-appeal

You might also consider joining the Trust - & perhaps making a donation with it (without Enthuse admin fees). Here's the application form:

Llangollen_Mem_App_Form.pdf

[MatthewCarty]

Quote

The auction of Llangollen Railway PLC’s assets was duly completed on Wednesday 12th May. The bidding was fast and furious on the day for the coaching assets in particular, and the larger plant items. The prices paid were substantially in excess of our expectations which is good news for the PLC’s administrators and we are glad all the creditors, including those who are unsecured, will benefit accordingly.

We were delighted to secure our priority one assets, namely one accessible-adapted coach, road railer, 12t crane and Lowmac. This would not have been possible without the support and dedication of our members and numerous other donors, and we thank them all. Total donations including the Rolling Stock Appeal are approximately £140,000 including gift aid. We were similarly delighted to learn that friendly bidders have acquired 2 further coaches and a significant amount of machine tools which will remain on the Railway.

Pete Edwards, chairman, said: “It was very important to secure the principal assets which will enable us to continue preparations for reopening without further interruption. The support we have received from so many donors, without which we may well not be able to look forward to running again this year, and the friendly bidders, has been crucial and is very much appreciated.

Numerous coach and plant items will be leaving the Railway which is a great shame from our point of view but at least their future in preservation is secured.”

Preparations can now begin in earnest to complete the necessary works on Dee Bridge and in the tunnel. We also need to press ahead with the necessary safety and regulatory matters.

“We are on target to reopen in late July or early August,” Pete Edwards concluded.

Both appeals remain open and we would welcome further support to help fund the higher prices we had to pay for the priority items and to provide the necessary working capital to get us up and running again. Please donate if you can:
Online at https://llangollenrailway.enthuse.com and click the Donate button, or via our Facebook page. For taxpayers, the Railway can apply for 25% Gift Aid. Alternatively, supporters are invited to send cheques payable to Llangollen Railway Trust Ltd to The Station, Abbey Road, Llangollen LL20 8SN.  

Ends

Llangollen Railway Trust Board

Here is the official press release. For those who may be interested, the coach purchased by the trust is TSO 4858. The 2 coaches purchased by a supporter were the function coach and TSO 4472.

[Chris116]

12 minutes ago, MatthewCarty said:

Here is the official press release. For those who may be interested, the coach purchased by the trust is TSO 4858. The 2 coaches purchased by a supporter were the function coach and TSO 4472.

Press release appears to have gone AWOL!

[MatthewCarty]

31 minutes ago, Chris116 said:

Press release appears to have gone AWOL!

Not visible to you in the quote?

[Chris116]

20 minutes ago, MatthewCarty said:

Not visible to you in the quote?

Opps, sorry. If I opened my eyes I would have seen it! 

[RJS1977]

Some good news concerning the crane, which had been sold to a scrap merchant:

 

From Facebook: 

 

"Some great news about our Cowans Sheldon crane. Allister Boote from Sandbach Commercial Dismantlers Ltd has met with several LR representatives on site today. He has very kindly agreed to keep the crane in one piece and on the railway for the foreseeable future. The Railway also have the option to buy it back over an extended period, including offsetting the value raised from supplying day-to-day scrap materials to SCD. A great idea! Our urgent priority obviously remains on raising funds for the re-opening of the railway later this year (and both the Rolling Stock and Full Steam Ahead appeals are still open), but watch this space for details of specific fundraising to support the crane. Sincere thanks to Allister. His kind support is very much appreciated."

 

 

 

[RJS1977]

With regards to the Mark 1s that are leaving the railway, part of me can't help feeling a little disappointed that other heritage railways were apparently actively outbidding the LR for them. Whilst the situation is at least in part of the LR's own making, most heritage railways haven't had it too easy in the last 12 months, and we're perhaps fortunate that only the one railway has found itself in this position - would the other railways have wanted to be bid against, if the boot was on the other foot? 

[Zomboid]

The LR had to raise the money to sort out their debts. If no one else had bid for the the equipment which was for sale then that wouldn't have been as effective at cl achieving that.

 

If other heritage railways hadn't bid then there would be a lot of kit sold the the scrappers for lower prices than they achieved. Which wouldn't have helped anyone.

[Northmoor]

Like anything, railway preservation is survival of the fittest.  As @Zomboidsays, if another railway hadn't bought them, a scrappie would have.  It's not like they are lost to preservation.  Speaking of which, there are far more carriages lost to neglect than anything else (and I don't just mean the historic wooden bodies left under a tarpaulin).  Some railways focus on the glamour of running big engines, but are running Mark 1s around with holes in the floor/ends.  I dread the day when I read of a partial end-on collision/side-swipe at a preserved railway; it's won't make for pretty reading.

[Michael Hodgson]

1 hour ago, Northmoor said:

Like anything, railway preservation is survival of the fittest.  As @Zomboidsays, if another railway hadn't bought them, a scrappie would have.  It's not like they are lost to preservation.  Speaking of which, there are far more carriages lost to neglect than anything else (and I don't just mean the historic wooden bodies left under a tarpaulin).  Some railways focus on the glamour of running big engines, but are running Mark 1s around with holes in the floor/ends.  I dread the day when I read of a partial end-on collision/side-swipe at a preserved railway; it's won't make for pretty reading.

It needn't be Mark 1s and collisions.  Maintenance to acceptable safety standards is essential for vehicles in service and there have been incidents

• Luckily nobody was injured when an axle snapped on the 15" gauge Bure Valley Railway and the broken wheelset came through a carriage seat. 
• A child had a narrow escape on the South Devon Railway when he tried to enter a Mk 1 toilet whose floor was missing
• A two-year old child fell out of a moving Danish carriage on the Nene Valley Railway which had inside handles on its doors (and signs in Danish French & German about not opening it when the train is moving) 

[Ed-farms]

15 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

With regards to the Mark 1s that are leaving the railway, part of me can't help feeling a little disappointed that other heritage railways were apparently actively outbidding the LR for them. Whilst the situation is at least in part of the LR's own making, most heritage railways haven't had it too easy in the last 12 months, and we're perhaps fortunate that only the one railway has found itself in this position - would the other railways have wanted to be bid against, if the boot was on the other foot? 

 

Did other railways pay way over the top for these coaches? Unless they paid a silly amount compared to the value of a mark 1 in the appropriate condition I cannot see a problem, to some railways buying coaches ready to go will be easier than repairing what needs repairing in the short term

[RJS1977]

6 hours ago, Northmoor said:

Like anything, railway preservation is survival of the fittest.  As @Zomboidsays, if another railway hadn't bought them, a scrappie would have.  It's not like they are lost to preservation.  

 

I didn't mean that the other railways shouldn't have bid on them at all, only that I didn't think they should be attempting to outbid the LR. If the LR didn't bid, or a scrappy pushed the bidding to a point where the LR had to withdraw, then I would have no objection to another railway jumping in at that point.

 

The other railways have apparently been managing without those coaches up to now, and had the LR Co not gone bust, they wouldn't have been available to them. Pretty much every railway has had held out the begging bowl over the last year or so- and I've contributed to quite a few. But I contributed on the understanding that the money would be spent top ensure that those railways were still with us on the other side of the pandemic - not so that they could poach coaches from the railway most in need.

 

[Bomag]

2 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

 

I didn't mean that the other railways shouldn't have bid on them at all, only that I didn't think they should be attempting to outbid the LR. If the LR didn't bid, or a scrappy pushed the bidding to a point where the LR had to withdraw, then I would have no objection to another railway jumping in at that point.

 

The other railways have apparently been managing without those coaches up to now, and had the LR Co not gone bust, they wouldn't have been available to them. Pretty much every railway has had held out the begging bowl over the last year or so- and I've contributed to quite a few. But I contributed on the understanding that the money would be spent top ensure that those railways were still with us on the other side of the pandemic - not so that they could poach coaches from the railway most in need.

 

 

If the society had the money to pay the going rate for the Mk1s I would have thought that they would purchased them from the company to stop it going bust. If they didn't have the money and expected others not to bid so they could win then they would not have cleared the debt.  In which case the debtors would have been more out pocket then they would have been. I don't see those out of pocket agreeing to your point.

 

There is a finite supply of serviceable / quality Mk1s. However, there are significant number of affordable unrestored Mk1's which have a structurally sound underframe which could be restored; its sounds like Llangollen need to use the skills from doing up some of the suburban Mk1s by getting some cheap/free cast off.

[pheaton]

Davy has been purchased by a 3rd party from the scarp merchant so is safe.

 

the crane was also safe as the scrap man is not able to dismantle on site so it is safe, and I believe the trust plan to try and buy it back.

[AMJ]

The possible over the top prices on decent Mk I stock by others will reflect the time and cost involved if they were purchasing a rough one.  I bet some of these have eased workload on C&W depts.

 

Seems to be quiet or no comments about Austin 1 and the other locos that were potentially for sale.