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Not Good at Llangollen


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27 minutes ago, PenrithBeacon said:

Many did, spoilt by those who didn't and, in truth, the aggressive posture of too many volunteers who had an attitude of entitlement to say whatever they thought appropriate to photographers. I hardly ever go to a steam railway now, just no pleasure in it.

To be sure though, this attitude was never seen at the LR.

I commend you for your honesty and generosity Sir.  I have heard of enthusiasts who wanted to photograph locos on shed at Isfield (Lavender Line); when spotted trespassing in the adjacent farmer's field, they were asked if they wanted to come in and visit the shed for a small donation at the cafe.  They scoffed and left (after admitting they had come from Leeds that day).

 

Whenever we were preparing the AC Electrics for special event weekends at Barrow Hill, it was remarkable the number of enthusiasts who "just happened to be passing" on the Friday afternoon, when entry to the site was free....

Edited by Northmoor
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Posted (edited)

I don't think a railway needs to be exclusively steam.

ELR has had a regular diesel diagram since day 1.


indeed in the early days, the 3 morning turns were all diesel, so the steam crowd didn't have to get out of bed too early.

 

I think having a mixed diagram works well, as long as part of a day out has steam, and chance for pictures I don't think most really care.

 

Don’t think its ever really hurt them.

 

The most disappointing trip I ever did was the Scary covid service  last summer.. on one line that I will leave nameless, you werent allowed to wait on the station, the locos hidden from view at runround, purposely to prevent picture taking, you were held off platform, railroaded to your seat, and directed immediately off premise at the other end... everyone was acting terrified.. Although on an ordinary day it was an exceptionally good railway, on this occasion it scared the customers, everyone was more than willing to exit without delay!

 

To me ambiance is the day out, its about appearance, it is much more important than if it has a chimney or an exhaust, having a choice on a day out is just as good as having an exclusive steam service...indeed it encourages passengers to deboard, hang around for a while.

 

 

 

Edited by adb968008
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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I don't think a railway needs to be exclusively steam.

ELR has had a regular diesel diagram since day 1.

I often use the mixed steam / diesel service on my visits to the ELR. Park in Bury. Steam up hill and a few pics of it at Rawtenstall. Take refreshment there then down hill to Ramsbottom on the diesel, especially if DMU. Possibly pics of the steam coming uphill and more refreshments then back to Bury. Try to fit in a call to Bury Market to pick up some Black Pudding and Lancashire cheeses.

Edited by TheSignalEngineer
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13 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I don't think a railway needs to be exclusively steam.

ELR has had a regular diesel diagram since day 1.


...

Fair enough, but the last time I visited the ELR they were advertising two steam, one diesel but when I got there it was three diesel. Haven't been again, it's a long way to go if I can't trust their website.

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13 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I don't think a railway needs to be exclusively steam.

ELR has had a regular diesel diagram since day 1.


indeed in the early days, the 3 morning turns were all diesel, so the steam crowd didn't have to get out of bed too early.

 

I think having a mixed diagram works well, as long as part of a day out has steam, and chance for pictures I don't think most really care.

 

Don’t think its ever really hurt them.

 

The most disappointing trip I ever did was the Scary covid service  last summer.. on one line that I will leave nameless, you werent allowed to wait on the station, the locos hidden from view at runround, purposely to prevent picture taking, you were held off platform, railroaded to your seat, and directed immediately off premise at the other end... everyone was acting terrified.. Although on an ordinary day it was an exceptionally good railway, on this occasion it scared the customers, everyone was more than willing to exit without delay!

 

To me ambiance is the day out, its about appearance, it is much more important than if it has a chimney or an exhaust, having a choice on a day out is just as good as having an exclusive steam service...indeed it encourages passengers to deboard, hang around for a while.

 

 

 

 

Saw that as a description on a line my wife and I might have gone to last year, in the between lockdowns period - needless to say we didn't go. That said, it was arguably the right approach due to COVID. It is one of those no win situations, make it safe, kill the experience. The line I support I am giving a monthly donation to in lieu of what I would have spent there. Unlikely to ride a train or local bus until masks are not required.

 

With regard to Llangollen did manage to fit it in a couple of years back, off peak and a limited train service and we had just missed one! However, the cafe was welcoming and was used 

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24 minutes ago, PenrithBeacon said:

Fair enough, but the last time I visited the ELR they were advertising two steam, one diesel but when I got there it was three diesel. Haven't been again, it's a long way to go if I can't trust their website.

I suffered the same many years ago at the Nene Valley. I phoned them up at 4pm to confirm that the service the following day was one steam and one diesel. Took the children by car from Basildon only to find that they had two diesels running as they were celebrating the last day one of them was available for service. I asked why I had not been told about that when I had phoned and was told the decision had only been made during the evening. I asked if there was a problem with the steam loco and was told that there was nothing wrong with it. The children were very unhappy and spent the whole day wanting to go home. I have never been back. 

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I have seen survey results and quite a lot of general embers of the public do not know what the motive power is.  One question other than date and time of travel was your loco steam or diesel.  Based upon the date there were many who said steam even though the rostored loco was diesel.

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33 minutes ago, AMJ said:

a lot of general embers of the public

 

Just what are they using for fuel these days as coal supplies are at risk?

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On 04/03/2021 at 21:43, God's Wonderful Railway 1835 said:

From the days Llangollen engineering could produce quality work. Taken on the preview day for Auto coach 92.   

15.jpg

26.jpg

DSCF7701.JPG

I rode in 92/93 at the gala it attended and had a wonderful time at two Steam, Steel and Stars events at the Llangollen. I personally think it belongs in the upper echelon of the preserved railways of the country and its actually pretty heartbreaking to see it in this position.

 

I know exactly nothing about the manner in which the railway was managed, so I shall hold my tongue on that issue, but I do hope that it can survive this intact and continue into the future. 

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54 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

Just what are they using for fuel these days as coal supplies are at risk?

 

Lineside photographers who don't buy a ticket?

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16 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Seems its true, photographers are now used as firebox fodder

 

Picture below shows GW locos in particular seem to steam quite well..
7EE1DEA6-FD67-478B-9801-FCA9BA0F541A.jpeg.ae82ab7a21d944c07e399999631a9a2b.jpeg

 

 

Is that Ropley during a gala by any chance?

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2 hours ago, Chris116 said:

Is that Ropley during a gala by any chance?

Yes, Nunney Castle’s last weekend in traffic.

 

I took its last ever service working from Alton to Ropley, chimney first, and recorded it from the front first window, it was going great style, so I was surprised to find it withdrawn from traffic the following week.

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On 07/03/2021 at 00:15, Bucoops said:

 

Lineside photographers who don't buy a ticket?

When I visited the UK from Australia in 2017 I went to a number of preserved railways including the Llangollen and although I only rode on one of the Llangollen trains I bought a full line day rover ticket. I did the same at the NYMR and the Severn Valley. The Bluebell was shut for a driver experience day so I couldn't buy a ticket. Maybe I'm not entitled in these modern times but it just seems very wrong to me to photograph or video a preserved railway from the line side on public land (as a line side pass for me isn't worth it) without contributing to the railways coughers. I did ride on the Severn Valley for I remember it well having ordered a cup of coffee on the train which was burning hot. I spilled some coffee and is burnt my hand and I swore loudly then apologised to the other passengers in the compartment for my Anglo Saxon.

Often I had to walk across private land but I always asked the owner usually a farmer if I could walk on his land. One farmer who's land borders the Llangollen almost died of shock when I asked him telling me that no railway enthusiasts ever ask him permission to walk on his land. But to walk on his land without his permission is trespassing. I suppose that's an old fashioned concept too these days.

If a preserved railway offers first class then I ride the train first class as they can always do with the extra money as I did on the Talyllyn and Severn Valley. I also bought a full line ticket on the Foxfield Railway even though I was only standing in a field videoing the locos climbing the 1 in 19 bank. I buy food from the railways. I wouldn't travel first class on the mainline railways for they don't need my money in my opinion and I will video them without buying a ticket as they get money from the taxpayer via the government and preserved railways don't. I can't give a donation to any preserved railway in the UK for they insist on a postcode, a British postcode and my Australian postcode (2777) doesn't fit the bill so I can only buy a ticket.        

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Something to be aware of is that you can give a donation of any amount you wish, what you cannot do is gift aid it as that requires being a British taxpayer, and is why they ask for a postcode.

The theory is that a taxpayer can only gift aid up to amount of tax that they have paid (cannot remember if income tax or national insurance) and if the total gift aid exceeds the amount of tax that an individual  has paid, HMRC could ask that taxpayer to pay them the excess.

 

(whether this has ever been enforced I am less certain...and many charities frontline staff don’t seem particularly well trained on the rules around it and simply encourage everyone to gift aid it all regardless.)

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On 06/03/2021 at 13:20, AY Mod said:

 

Just what are they using for fuel these days as coal supplies are at risk?

Could be an interesting alternative to cremation for deceased rail enthusiasts

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1 hour ago, LimboBrit said:

Could be an interesting alternative to cremation for deceased rail enthusiasts

I wonder how the calorific values compare!??

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46 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

GW boilers like a high pasty content, LMS boilers pie and the LNER boilers like grouse.

 

How about cheeseburgers? Asking for a friend.

 

We always buy 1st class when available. Not so much to give the railway more money, but because my wife has delusions of grandeur :D

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3 hours ago, rab said:

I wonder how the calorific values compare!??

I’m sure the firemen will need to adapt their stoking methods to allow for higher fat fuel

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1 hour ago, woodenhead said:

GW boilers like a high pasty content, LMS boilers pie and the LNER boilers like grouse.

There is an alternative power source. All those people in a tender could we capture all that hot air..........

 

Keith

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1 hour ago, KeithHC said:

There is an alternative power source. All those people in a tender could we capture all that hot air..........

 

Keith

i would have thought that all the froth would risk putting the fire out.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, LimboBrit said:

I’m sure the firemen will need to adapt their stoking methods to allow for higher fat fuel

I read somewhere that in WW2 they used waste cloths and spent uniforms from hospitals & frontlines in Egypt on the locos fire, leading to a phrase of “throw another pharaoh on the fire” by crews.

 

no idea if true.

Edited by adb968008
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Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, Bucoops said:

 

How about cheeseburgers? Asking for a friend.

 

I dont think any class 70’s have been preserved yet, but one was sent back because the waiter dropped it.

:D

Edited by adb968008
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