Hornby Announce L&MR 0-4-2 "Lion"?

[The Johnster]

'Let's press the button and get them into production, then', says SK on the tv show, signing off on projects with £ signs rolling in his eyes.  I assumed it to be a figurative start button for the production line machinery, but a keyboard button works just as well in the context; you never see him or the employee actually pressing a real, physical, button.

 

Good that you wot of the bones of Weyland the Wise, and which is the low in which they lie, Mike.  I've been there as well.

 

 

[RichardT]

3 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

little tale from a visit to the NRM a good many years ago when a member of the curating staff pointed out a certain rather well known A4 complete with a 'Flying Scotsman' LNER style headboard.  apparently a large number of visitors walked and went away telling each other how wonderful it was to see "flying Scotsman' in the museum.

As I was told it when I joined the NRM, that was a little touch from the late John Bellwood (former museum CME), because of the number of enquiries from visitors to the FOH staff asking “where’s the Flying Scotsman?” - what would now be called a teachable moment.

 

Richard T

[Hroth]

20 hours ago, The Johnster said:

Who knows what gutta-percha is? 

Dunno offhand, but golf balls used to be made from it....

[Ruffnut Thorston]

I believe that gutta-percha is a form of rubber. Not sure if manufactured or a natural product though…

Edited December 23, 2021 by Ruffnut Thorston
Auto correct! Typo…

[Michael Hodgson]

21 hours ago, The Johnster said:

 

Who knows what gutta-percha is?  Who wots now where Weyland's bones lie?  

I always thought gutta-percha was just another name for India rubber.  Hence the well known saying The rain in Calcutta falls mainly in the gutta,

 

I do remember when we walked one of the long distance paths - thr Ridgeway Path IIRC, we passed a prehistoric burial site called Wayland's Smithy, near the Uffington White Horse, so I think poor old Wayland must have passed away by now.

[Andy Kirkham]

On 23/12/2021 at 00:02, The Johnster said:

 

Who knows what gutta-percha is? 

 

Dentists.

[Obi-Jiff Kenobi]

I always thought a gutter percher was a certain type of bird - pigeon or gull, probably. There's always one on our roof.

[PhilJ W]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gutta-percha

[MikeOxon]

trans-1,4-polyisoprene - I thought everybody knew that

[boxbrownie]

1 hour ago, Obi-Jiff Kenobi said:

I always thought a gutter percher was a certain type of bird - pigeon or gull, probably. There's always one on our roof.

I thought it was a Cat Burglar……

[boxbrownie]

45 minutes ago, MikeOxon said:

trans-1,4-polyisoprene - I thought everybody knew that

We do….just didn’t want to seem boastful 

[The Johnster]

It was, apparently, the stuff the rats ate on Brunel's atmospheric railway, where it was used as a sealant.

 

18 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said:

I always thought gutta-percha was just another name for India rubber.  Hence the well known saying The rain in Calcutta falls mainly in the gutta,

 

I do remember when we walked one of the long distance paths - thr Ridgeway Path IIRC, we passed a prehistoric burial site called Wayland's Smithy, near the Uffington White Horse, so I think poor old Wayland must have passed away by now.

 

It would have been the Ridgeway Path. 

 

Poor old Wayland is long mouldered in his grave, or never had a grave being a Norse god and thus immortal; he was blacksmith to the Nordic pantheon.  Wayland's Smithy is an early neolithic tomb, and nobody had invented Norse gods in those days.  Perhaps a smith lived nearby in Saxon times and took the name.  Local folklore suggests that, if you need a horse shod, you could leave it at the Smithy with some money to pay for the service, and come back later to find the money gone (no sh*t, sherlock) and the horse freshly and expertly shod.

[Hroth]

2 hours ago, The Johnster said:

It was, apparently, the stuff the rats ate on Brunel's atmospheric railway, where it was used as a sealant.

 

 

It would have been the Ridgeway Path. 

 

Poor old Wayland is long mouldered in his grave, or never had a grave being a Norse god and thus immortal; he was blacksmith to the Nordic pantheon.  Wayland's Smithy is an early neolithic tomb, and nobody had invented Norse gods in those days.  Perhaps a smith lived nearby in Saxon times and took the name.  Local folklore suggests that, if you need a horse shod, you could leave it at the Smithy with some money to pay for the service, and come back later to find the money gone (no sh*t, sherlock) and the horse freshly and expertly shod.

In other "traditions", both the money and horse would have disappeared....

[The Johnster]

Sounds about right...

[Dana Ashdown]

Just thought I'd mention the new Lion model here, on its own thread rather than under films.

 

The model looks perfect, from what I can see of it. Its just too bad that Hornby couldn't release it either on its own or with the coal wagons. One things for sure: I will not be buying either of the movie themed sets. (Grumble over.)

 

[AY Mod]

50 minutes ago, Dana Ashdown said:

The model looks perfect, from what I can see of it.

 

That's computer artwork, not a model.

[Dana Ashdown]

On 13/01/2022 at 11:38, AY Mod said:

That's computer artwork, not a model.

No wonder it looked so good.

 

Still, I would have expected more reaction about Lion's release, as opposed to Hornby's tie-in to old movie titles. Speaking for myself, I was hoping to see it released on its own or with a string of wagons — like the coal wagons — and not a fictionalised train based on a film.

[PaulRhB]

3 hours ago, Dana Ashdown said:

Speaking for myself, I was hoping to see it released on its own

Rapido do  

[neal]

Has this model quietly been shelved following recent unpleasantness?

 

N

[PhilJ W]

1 hour ago, neal said:

Has this model quietly been shelved following recent unpleasantness?

 

N

That will depend on how advanced the production of the model is. There's nothing to stop them producing a model of the locomotive as Lion as long as the Titfield Thunderbolt isn't mentioned. The problem for Hornby is that its something of a niche market so is producing a model of the same prototype as another manufacturer viable? The Lion was in fact a goods engine and Hornby has a few 1830's goods wagons in their catalogue so there must be a (however slight) greater possibility that they may continue with the Lion model. I'm afraid that we will have to just wait and see.

[Fireline]

24 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

That will depend on how advanced the production of the model is. There's nothing to stop them producing a model of the locomotive as Lion as long as the Titfield Thunderbolt isn't mentioned. The problem for Hornby is that its something of a niche market so is producing a model of the same prototype as another manufacturer viable? The Lion was in fact a goods engine and Hornby has a few 1830's goods wagons in their catalogue so there must be a (however slight) greater possibility that they may continue with the Lion model. I'm afraid that we will have to just wait and see.

 

I would have said that Rocket would also be something of a niche market. Just look how that sold. I know that there was no competition on that one, but Hornby is the name that most people know. I dare say Rapido's loco will be brilliant, but the Hornby name is the one that Grandad recognises when buying the "toy" for his grandchild. 

 

As far as Lion being a goods engine, how many people can remember that far back? All anyone has really ever seen it run with is some form of passenger "stock". Unless you are actually modelling the 1830's, Rule 1 would have to be applied whatever you did....

[Hroth]

2 hours ago, neal said:

Has this model quietly been shelved following recent unpleasantness?

They could do Lion, although that might involve talking to National Museums and Galleries Merseyside (or whatever they call themselves at the moment) if they want to use the name, as they own "Lion".  Or they could call it "Tiger", which was Lions shedmate.

 

If you want to call it Thunderbolt, there's nothing stopping you from buying a Hornby Lion (or Tiger) and putting a Thunderbolt nameplate on it. These are already available, as there was a Ks kit long ago, and more recently 3D printed bodies too.

 

33 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

The Lion was in fact a goods engine

 

5 minutes ago, Fireline said:

As far as Lion being a goods engine, how many people can remember that far back?

 

I believe the original description of Lion/Tiger was that they were Luggage Engines so I think that under Rule 1, we could call them "Mixed Traffic" and get away with it!

 

Especially if we restricted them to open 2nd/3rds...

 

[PhilJ W]

Luggage engine was the name used for a goods engine. The Rocket was most definitely a passenger engine with only a single driven axle. As Hornby have the period goods wagons in their catalogue but not at present a suitable locomotive to haul them tips the chances of Hornby producing a model of Lion ever so slightly in favour of them doing so.

[MarkSG]

5 hours ago, Fireline said:

 

I would have said that Rocket would also be something of a niche market. Just look how that sold. I know that there was no competition on that one, but Hornby is the name that most people know. I dare say Rapido's loco will be brilliant, but the Hornby name is the one that Grandad recognises when buying the "toy" for his grandchild. 

 

Rocket is sufficiently iconic to be well-known outside the railway community. So a Rocket train pack will appeal to people who aren't necessarily rail fans, but do fancy having a model of a slice of history.

 

Lion, on the other hand, is, at least in its real-life guise, far less well-known. Lion's greatest claim to fame is, probably, being the Titfield Thunderbolt. I think a model of Lion will sell, particularly to people who have already bought Rocket and like the idea of having a rudimentary era 1 layout. But it may not sell enough to justify the tooling costs unless it can also be sold as Thunderbolt.

 

That said, I think Hornby's Lion will, still, make an appearance. But if it can't be packaged as Thunderbolt, then the obvious alternative is to package it in a train pack that also includes suitable rolling stock and promote it as being a companion for Rocket, hoping to piggyback on Rocket's own popularity. It wouldn't surprise me if they weren't planning to do that anyway, but as part of next year's releases so as not to compete with their own Titfield version. In which case, they may just leave it at that and include it in the 2023 announcements. Or, if Titfield is out of the window, then bringing forward the Lion era 1 train pack as a standalone announcement would make sense. I suspect that a lot depends on how far advanced the development is.

[PhilJ W]

It looks as if the Titfield option is a no goer. Rapido pipped them to the post and got the necessary licence to produce the Titfield models. Their 'Trains on film' series seems to have been quietly dropped and that included a film, The lady with the lamp, that featured Lion and the three coaches as already produced by Hornby. The central feature of the series was intended to be the Titfield Thunderbolt set but they now are not able to include that.

Edited February 16, 2022 by PhilJ W