LNERJP Posted April 24, 2021 Share Posted April 24, 2021 I have a few questions with regards to Fort William - Mallaig workings in the mid 80's. To start when there was an inspection saloon attached in the 1983/84? season, was it always on the rear of the train? and at Mallaig was it detached and shunted onto the rear of the train, or just left in the set as it arrived? Cheers JP 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallaig1983 Posted April 27, 2021 Share Posted April 27, 2021 Hi JP. Only just noticed your question and as I’m modelling Mallaig in this period I have the inspection saloon. However this was an evolving situation. During the 1960s the ex LNER Beaver tail observation cars were used on the extension and were turned on the Mallaig table for the return. 1981 saw the return of an observation car. This was a former Eastern region inspection saloon that had been much modified from its original build and as it had only one observation end was not shunted, giving passengers a great view of the class 37 on the return journey. The same format followed for 1982. For the 1983 season a second vehicle was added to the consist at the other end and both were painted in the LNER style mock teak livery. I’ve seen evidence that this train often contained a full buffet car which by 83 was a rarity. The 1984 obs car was indeed the inspection saloon that you refer to. As this had observation windows at both ends it was shunted at Mallaig. Quite a protracted movement as it was uncoupled from the rear and then backed into the loop. The rest of the set was then drawn forward before being reversed into the loop and coupled up to the observation car. The ensemble was then drawn out onto the main line and reversed into the platform. This coach was in blue/grey livery. There was a similar vehicle on the Oban line and this was painted in LMS livery. I don’t know if this was on from Queen Street or attached at Crianlarich however. I hope this helps. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium keefer Posted April 27, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 27, 2021 Sc1999 Lochaber was the saloon in b/g: https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/137637-coach-id-reqd-sc1999/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallaig1983 Posted April 27, 2021 Share Posted April 27, 2021 Do you know much more about the vehicle? I’ve been trying to find out a bit more about it and 1998. Just wondered if there were suitable kits to bash to get both of those vehicles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckymucklebackit Posted April 27, 2021 Share Posted April 27, 2021 The coach certainly still exists, it became part of the Royal Scotsman Pullman set but was replaced in 2012. Currently in the Carnforth Stockpile but reported to be in good condition. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallaig1983 Posted April 27, 2021 Share Posted April 27, 2021 Ah that’s good. Thanks for the information. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERJP Posted April 27, 2021 Author Share Posted April 27, 2021 Thank you all for your replies, I suspected the run round manoeuvre would be something like you said Andy and you have confirmed it for me. I didn't realise it wasn't an LMS inspection Saloon and modelling in n-gauge I thought I had it nailed with one of the N gauge society commissions. Think Sc 1999 might be a bit too difficult and will stick with the LMS saloon. JP 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERJP Posted April 27, 2021 Author Share Posted April 27, 2021 Next question. In Nick Meskell's excellent Scottish Class 37's volume 1 he has the 1983/1984 Eastfeild loco diagrams. Loco 7 starts at Mallaig at 07:00 and returns at 20:55 with a round trip of around 330 miles, when was the loco serviced? On arrival at Queen Street? If so how many days of this diagram would it work before being swapped out? Cheers JP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallaig1983 Posted April 27, 2021 Share Posted April 27, 2021 I’m afraid I can’t help with this one JP and I’m interested to read the responses too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallaig1983 Posted April 27, 2021 Share Posted April 27, 2021 3 hours ago, LNERJP said: 3 hours ago, LNERJP said: didn't realise it wasn't an LMS inspection Saloon and modelling in n-gauge I thought I had it nailed with one of the N gauge society commissions. Think Sc 1999 might be a bit too difficult and will stick with the LMS saloon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallaig1983 Posted April 27, 2021 Share Posted April 27, 2021 Just now, mallaig1983 said: I’m modelling predominantly 1983 but I’m using the inspection saloon from 84 as my obs car. 1998 and 1999 are just a bridge to far at the moment. Maybe one day if my skills progress to those required for the task but I’m happy to make the compromise. To be fair the Bachmann model isn’t actually correct for the vehicle used. Close but no cigar. I don’t think I’ll lose to much sleep over it though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB-AU Posted April 28, 2021 Share Posted April 28, 2021 Sc1999 (named Lochaber) was introduced on the line in May 1980. It was joined by Sc1998 (named Loch Eil) in March 1983. Sc1999 at Fort William, c1980. Sc1998 at Arisaig, 21 August 1985. LMS inspection saloon 45030 ran for to Oban for the 1984 (or 85?) season but also turned up at Fort William a couple of times. Bill McAlpine's G.E. No.1 also ran attached to regular trains for a short time in 1985 in an effort to convince BR to run a regular steam service. It certainly got to Fort William but I'm unsure if it also got to Mallaig. Cheers David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallaig1983 Posted April 28, 2021 Share Posted April 28, 2021 7 hours ago, DavidB-AU said: Sc1999 (named Lochaber) was introduced on the line in May 1980. It was joined by Sc1998 (named Loch Eil) in March 1983. Sc1999 at Fort William, c1980. Sc1998 at Arisaig, 21 August 1985. LMS inspection saloon 45030 ran for to Oban for the 1984 (or 85?) season but also turned up at Fort William a couple of times. Bill McAlpine's G.E. No.1 also ran attached to regular trains for a short time in 1985 in an effort to convince BR to run a regular steam service. It certainly got to Fort William but I'm unsure if it also got to Mallaig. Cheers David Wow, thanks David. What a great couple of photos. 1999 leaving Fort William is an absolute gem. I’ve never seen a clear view of the end. I would really like a model of this coach but it’ll definitely have to be one for the future as currently I don’t have the time or skill to build it. Great photo to save for that future date though. Very much appreciated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold young37215 Posted April 28, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 28, 2021 2 hours ago, mallaig1983 said: Wow, thanks David. What a great couple of photos. 1999 leaving Fort William is an absolute gem. I’ve never seen a clear view of the end. I would really like a model of this coach but it’ll definitely have to be one for the future as currently I don’t have the time or skill to build it. Great photo to save for that future date though. Very much appreciated. Ditto Andy's comments on the pictures, I aspire to a model of 1999 but it is a long way off of my capabilities to scratch build a presentable version. I dont think that there is anything that gets close to it in 00 unless someone knows better? As for loco diagrams I would treat Nick Meskell's as being advisory rather than mandatory. The loco off of the 0700 ex Mallaig would have time for fuelling at Eastfield in between the 2 'booked' trains although in my practical experience the loco would just as likely be swapped as it would stick to diagram. Based upon my own observations, diagrammed operation on the WHL was pretty flexible in practice! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallaig1983 Posted April 28, 2021 Share Posted April 28, 2021 4 hours ago, young37215 said: Ditto Andy's comments on the pictures, I aspire to a model of 1999 but it is a long way off of my capabilities to scratch build a presentable version. I dont think that there is anything that gets close to it in 00 unless someone knows better? As for loco diagrams I would treat Nick Meskell's as being advisory rather than mandatory. The loco off of the 0700 ex Mallaig would have time for fuelling at Eastfield in between the 2 'booked' trains although in my practical experience the loco would just as likely be swapped as it would stick to diagram. Based upon my own observations, diagrammed operation on the WHL was pretty flexible in practice! A few of Nick Meskell’s captions are a bit inaccurate too. If I was using the information in the book to base something on I’d be double checking where possible. The loco diagramming is definitely of interest though and I’ll be basing my operations on it. Some through trains having loco changed at FW, some working through etc. Plenty to stimulate and entertain a simple fellow like me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB-AU Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 11 hours ago, young37215 said: Ditto Andy's comments on the pictures, I aspire to a model of 1999 but it is a long way off of my capabilities to scratch build a presentable version. I dont think that there is anything that gets close to it in 00 unless someone knows better? 1999 started out as a prototype Thompson 61'6" FK dia 334. If you didn't mind it being 6mm too long, you could possibly modify the Bachmann 63' Thompson FK (dia 332). 1999 still exists although was modified into a dining car for the Royal Scotsman. http://www.cs.rhrp.org.uk/se/CarriageInfo.asp?Ref=945 1998 also still exists, pretty much still in the form it ran in 1985. http://www.cs.rhrp.org.uk/se/CarriageInfo.asp?Ref=1052 Cheers David 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mallaig1983 Posted April 29, 2021 Share Posted April 29, 2021 This is great David, Thank You very much. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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