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The end of max £1 selling fees?


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1 hour ago, John M Upton said:

This is what has annoyed a lot regarding this Managed Payments business, the delay of between two and eight days between sale, payment made by the purchaser and the money actually being in the sellers hand.

 

No other business would send items immediately in the hope that the buyer is honest and the payment may turn up later.

 

In this day and age of almost instant payments and money transfers across the world, it is a huge backward step, its taking us back to the mid 1980's when cheques were king and took two weeks to clear, assuming they didn't have that certain rubbery feel to them...

My recent experience of the new system is that it works fine without the PayPal % cut.

The three items I've sold recently started with an immediate notification that the buyer had paid and that the item could therefore be despatched.

No one in the right mind would post out before payment is secured.

eBay quite rightly hold the money until after despatch. 

It took two days for the sale money to be transferred into my nominated account.

Not bad going in my opinion !

 

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On 14/06/2021 at 19:14, Michael Hodgson said:

Indeed, but I suppose it means some sellers will take the view that Possession is 9/10 of the Law and wait until ebay has put the money into their sticky little mitts before mailing the goods.  

Not if they want to keep a decent level of feedback or cancelled transactions they wont.  Don't try that stunt with me gents or you will find yourself out of pocket.   I pay ASAP after the sale is confirmed by Paypal and expect the item within 5 days   Quite often the item or elements of it are re listed before I receive it.    It is a nuisance that payments have to be into a bank account , previously all my eBay stuff went through Paypal, I buy and sell and increase my collection financed by buying and re selling items completely separate to my other finances.  The change messed up my non existing accounting system and I had to resurrect a dormant bank account and keep a paper record of what  money comes in to that bank account and goes out of our joint account to which the Paypal account is linked. Big danger her indoors could skim off some of my railway money, but there's nowhere else you can buy on Sunday for £10 + £4 p+p and sell it again the next Sunday for £40 while sitting in your armchair watching TV.

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9 hours ago, John M Upton said:

cheques were king and took two weeks to clear, assuming they didn't have that certain rubbery feel to them...

 

Sorry for drifting off topic but that's not true. An example is given below based on 25 years working for the Black Horse from 1972 to 1997 so right through the period you quoted.

 

Monday - Pay a NatWest cheque into your account at Lloyds. Added to your balance but noted as 'uncleared'. Sent by overnight courier to Lloyds Clearing Centre - keep to a railway theme this was above Cannon Street Station.

 

Tuesday - Lloyds Clearing Centre collect together all the NatWest cheques paid into Lloyds branches from all over the country and pass them on to the NatWest Clearing Centre. Payments of several millions of pounds are made to transfer the cash value from one bank to another. NatWest then send the cheque by overnight courier to the local branch where the account is held - this could of course be the same town as the original Lloyds branch but the cheque would still go via London.

 

Wednesday - The cheque you paid in arrives at NatWest and is checked manually by staff who ensure that it has been correctly written - within date, contains a payee's name, words and figures agree, it has been signed, and that it hadn't been cancelled for any reason. The cheque is then processed and charged to the account. However the bank will hold a list of customers who may not have funds and so their balances are checked in more detail. At this stage the cheque could be returned unpaid and posted back to the bank that paid it in - Lloyds in this case.

 

Thursday - Unpaid cheque arrives at Lloyds who deduct the funds from customer's account and return the cheque to you unpaid. Also on this forth day the NatWest might realise that the cheque had created an overdraft and so they can advise Lloyds of a 'Late Return' by phoning and telling them that the cheque is being returned and in this case it would be delivered by post to arrive on Friday.

 

Friday - unless any of the above applies, the cheque is cleared.

 

We were also able to get cheques cleared quicker by cutting out the trip to London and back by posting it direct to the drawer's bank and phoning next day to get confirmation that it had been paid. There was an additional charge for this but it could give confirmation the next day. If it had been drawn on a bank in the same town we could walk the cheque around the corner and get payment the same day.

 

Of course this was all a very long time ago and things have changed dramatically with the introduction of technology and now from what I understand you don't even have to pay the cheque in - a photo will do. Goodness knows how fraud can be prevented as what's to stop the same photo being paid in at more than one bank. Even in my day, Lloyds stopped a lot of the manual checks we did as checking the clearing took five staff at a small branch most of the day to ensure that every cheque was correct - it was then decided to only look at those cheques over £100 and then I think it went to £500. The argument was that it was cheaper to refund a mistake than it was to pay staff to look for that mistake - especially in January when a lot of cheques had the previous year on and so were technically out of date.

 

All of the above only applied to the major clearing banks and not building societies as at that time they were not part of the clearing system and so all their cheques had to go into a bank which added a day to each end of the cycle - so perhaps seven working days.

 

Apologies again for going off topic - I hope some of you found that interesting . . . . . . . ! !

.

 

 

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34 minutes ago, Colin_McLeod said:

Why would a cheque written in December be 'technically out of date' the next month (January)?

 

I didn't say they were written in December - they were written in January but showed the previous year. You would be surprised how many customers forgot to change the year - as we were talking about the 1980s, then in January 1981 they would still automatically write 1980 as that is what they had been writing for the last 12 months. Even big companies with early computer written cheques were known to have forgotten to move on to the next year on Jan 1st so as I say, they were 'out of date' but we paid them as we realised it was a genuine mistake by looking at the sequence of cheque numbers.

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21 minutes ago, Mike Bellamy said:

 

I didn't say they were written in December - they were written in January but showed the previous year. You would be surprised how many customers forgot to change the year - as we were talking about the 1980s, then in January 1981 they would still automatically write 1980 as that is what they had been writing for the last 12 months. Even big companies with early computer written cheques were known to have forgotten to move on to the next year on Jan 1st so as I say, they were 'out of date' but we paid them as we realised it was a genuine mistake by looking at the sequence of cheque numbers.

I worked for Lloyds in 1972 and for the first fortnight every year we turned a blind eye to the date being apparently 12 months old. 

In any case the cheque was still technically valid within the meaning of the Bills of Exchange Acts and the payee could sue on it.  It was merely "stale", so the bank would be negligent in paying it without making enquiry, so the custom was to dishonour it.  More often than not it was a bureaucratic inconvenience to all concerned as the money was owed to the payee.  So what usually happened was the customer altered and initialled the cheque which was represented a few days later or he wrote out a replacement.  Cashiers were supposed to notice the error when the cheque was paid in - but that was usually an unrealistic assumption when dealing with businesses paying in the day's takings.  Of course had a cheque really been written in January 1971, it would still be in £sd and had to have two (old) pence stamp duty paid.  (Stamp duty ended 1st Feb 1971 and decimalisation occurred a fortnight later)

 

Cheques over a certain sum (£5,000 if memory serves) drawn on certain branches in central London paid in through other bank/branches in the same area were cleared faster as a matter of course, through the "Large Town Clearing".  The branches in question had the letter T printed after the sort code.  The Scottish banks also had a clearing system of their own, and that too was faster, using a timed security van running between Edinburgh & Glasgow.  But if you want to see a slow clearing system, you had to look at our friends across the Atlantic.  Checks (as they called them) could take up to about 6 weeks to bounce. 

 

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Posted (edited)
On 03/07/2021 at 11:57, DavidCBroad said:

I pay ASAP after the sale is confirmed by Paypal and expect the item within 5 days  

 

What many buyers seem to forget is that not every individual is operating an automated warehouse system.  For a private seller who let's say - for the sake of argument - might sell five items in one week, but all on different days - what are you saying, that said seller should make five individual trips to the post office that week, just to keep up with eBay's algorithms?  Many people work long hours and have families and this kind of practise isn't always viable, even for some businesses, let alone an individual.  Often I feel that many buyers are under the impression that every seller across the nation has little else to do but sit poised by their screens just waiting for the next eBay sale, followed by a mad dash to the post office each day clutching just one parcel.  Bonkers!   :rolleyes:

 

Edited by YesTor
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6 hours ago, YesTor said:

 

What many buyers seem to forget is that not every individual is operating an automated warehouse system.  For a private seller who let's say - for the sake of argument - might sell five items in one week, but all on different days - what are you saying, that said seller should make five individual trips to the post office that week just to keep up with eBay's algorithms?  Many people work long hours and have families and this kind of practise isn't always viable, even for some businesses.  Often I feel that many buyers are under the impression that every seller across the nation has little else to do but sit poised by their screens just waiting for the next eBay sale, followed by a mad dash to the post office each day clutching just one parcel.  Bonkers!   :rolleyes:

 

As a seller for 17/18 years I have wherever possible posted the item the next working day after payment, even though I was working 5+ days a week, its just called being organised and not biting off more that you can do, its just showing respect to the buyer, the vast majority of sellers manage to do this quite easily.  Lets face it if its listed for 7 days and time is limited why not pre-pack as much as possible prior to the sale ?

 

As a buyer I expect seller to adhere to the postal conditions they have advertised, especially if they are expecting/demanding prompt payment. If someone can only post on certain days, or take and extra day or so to pack the item up simply mention it when offering the item for sale. This saves a lot of needless worry, especially if using one of the unreliable carriers. 

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, hayfield said:

 

As a seller for 17/18 years I have wherever possible posted the item the next working day after payment, even though I was working 5+ days a week, its just called being organised and not biting off more that you can do

 

Then you are very lucky.  Was your closest mailing centre a six-mile round trip, by chance?  And if so, would you have managed this on a daily basis to perhaps mail one item by itself?  The cost of petrol alone would likely extinguish any profit from said sale...  And how do daily six-mile trips fit in with today's trend toward reducing everyone's 'carbon footprint'? 

 

I'm not sure about "being organised", but the above sounds remarkably inefficient to my ear.  I'm self-employed, so "being organised" is absolutely essential to my daily functioning, and this often means I work 10 to 12 hours per day at busy times, with barely time to stop for lunch, let alone a daily trip to the post office.  For myself, a trip to the post office is viable only once per week, and as such my listings display "Ships within 5 working days", however that doesn't seem to prevent buyers becoming aggravated after 48 hours because the postman hasn't knocked at the door.

 

I'm totally with 'showing respect for the buyer', however that same respect cuts both ways.

 

Edited by YesTor
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7 hours ago, YesTor said:

 

Then you are very lucky.  Was your closest mailing centre a six-mile round trip, by chance?  And if so, would you have managed this on a daily basis to perhaps mail one item by itself?  The cost of petrol alone would likely extinguish any profit from said sale...  And how do daily six-mile trips fit in with today's trend toward reducing everyone's 'carbon footprint'? 

 

I'm not sure about "being organised", but the above sounds remarkably inefficient to my ear.  I'm self-employed, so "being organised" is absolutely essential to my daily functioning, and this often means I work 10 to 12 hours per day at busy times, with barely time to stop for lunch, let alone a daily trip to the post office.  For myself, a trip to the post office is viable only once per week, and as such my listings display "Ships within 5 working days", however that doesn't seem to prevent buyers becoming aggravated after 48 hours because the postman hasn't knocked at the door.

 

I'm totally with 'showing respect for the buyer', however that same respect cuts both ways.

 

 

Not lucky at all, I too was self employed for a number of years, then worked for a company on shift work. I very quickly learnt to organise myself, in fact it was very much easier to get to the post office when I was self employed than an employee, I worked round the issue limiting my sales to the amount I could deal with. I treated all orders the same which included going twice in a day on the odd occasion. At my old address the local post office was 2 miles away (4 mile round trip) with limited parking. I also message every buyer after posting thanking them

 

You could say now I am lucky, as my local Post Office is not only a few mins walk away, but is open 7 days a week and for extended hours, This excellent service is copied all over the place though perhaps not so close as mine is. Post Office Counters has some excellent franchises far better that the old nationalised service. As I said for the exceptions where posting is an issue state it clearly 9possibly explaining why) and most customers will be accommodating and try using first class mail to soften the effect. 

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While it may seem strange, posting things sold on ebay isn't a priority for me.

 

For example, a couple of things sold yesterday afternoon (most low value, one at around £30).  I could have come home from work and packaged them ready to go but I played some computer games instead.  Today, I'll package them and then they'll actually depart on Wednesday when I go to the post office on the way home.  I'm not making a special trip out and it's only 2 days after the auctions ended.

 

While I appreciate fast postage as a buyer, I'm not that bothered if it takes a week to arrive.

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I may be misreading your reply and if so I apologise.  But your reply shows little consideration for the buyers, fine if you are not one of those who hassle buyers for immediate payment and clearly state your laid back approach in dispatching items.   

 

You have stated your appreciation of being treated well, but have a less than appreciative attitude towards those who have spent their hard earned cash with you. Like many I was bought up to treat others how I would like to be treated. 

 

Anyway each to their own, I have a worse issue waiting for a delivery by Hermes, from someone equally as laid back as yourself on the dispatch front. Still if it fails to arrive I have buyer protection and it will be up to the seller to deal with Hermes, and I wish him the best of luck

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5 hours ago, Sir TophamHatt said:

While it may seem strange, posting things sold on ebay isn't a priority for me.

 

For example, a couple of things sold yesterday afternoon (most low value, one at around £30).  I could have come home from work and packaged them ready to go but I played some computer games instead.  Today, I'll package them and then they'll actually depart on Wednesday when I go to the post office on the way home.  I'm not making a special trip out and it's only 2 days after the auctions ended.

 

While I appreciate fast postage as a buyer, I'm not that bothered if it takes a week to arrive.

If your postage terms say 3 days that is fine, but if they are less let us know your ebay name so we can choose to block you.

 

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I had a message from eBay they sent me my money this morning for Sunday's sales, with a note that it may take 0-4 days to arrive. 3 hours later not in the account, at the moment not an issue, a bit later it might be

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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, hayfield said:

I had a message from eBay they sent me my money this morning for Sunday's sales, with a note that it may take 0-4 days to arrive. 3 hours later not in the account, at the moment not an issue, a bit later it might be

Sometimes arrives the same day its sent, normally by the Wednesday morning. I had one sent at 5.18 this morning and it just arrived now.

 

Edited by G-DIMB
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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, hayfield said:

I had a message from eBay they sent me my money this morning for Sunday's sales, with a note that it may take 0-4 days to arrive. 3 hours later not in the account, at the moment not an issue, a bit later it might be

It very much depends on the clearing bank account that is linked to an individual's eBay account. 

The longest time I've waited for a transfer is 12hrs from the time of the eBay notification message.

I simply can't understand why you consider it an issue that eBay hold the money on account pending transfer ?

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Just now, Black 5 Bear said:

It very much depends on the clearing bank account that is linked to an individual's eBay account.

The longest time I've waited for a transfer is 12hrs from the time of the eBay notification message.

I simply can't understand why you consider it an issue that eBay hold the money on account pending transfer !

 

 

My comment was about not holding on to my money, but them sending it and me not receiving it. I have no issues with loosing instant transfers in the way PayPal works, 

 

Simply they should be able to send me money from their account to mine,  as quickly as they take it from mine into theirs

 

Pointless saying we have sent you money when it looks like it stays in their system for a few hours more.

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, hayfield said:

 

 

My comment was about not holding on to my money, but them sending it and me not receiving it. I have no issues with loosing instant transfers in the way PayPal works, 

 

Simply they should be able to send me money from their account to mine,  as quickly as they take it from mine into theirs

 

Pointless saying we have sent you money when it looks like it stays in their system for a few hours more.

Sorry, but eBay's terms and conditions clearly state 0-4 days.

As I've said before, some banks are obviously quicker than others. 

The main consideration I would have thought is that you've been paid and the money is secure !

 

Edited by Black 5 Bear
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3 hours ago, Black 5 Bear said:

Sorry, but eBay's terms and conditions clearly state 0-4 days.

As I've said before, some banks are obviously quicker than others. 

The main consideration I would have thought is that you've been paid and the money is secure !

 

 

 

We can agree to differ, I am going by the email which I said has 0-4 days. My point is, "I should expect the speed they pay me is the same as I pay them"

 

Still its in my bank account and I have moved it into my number 2 account (savings which does not attract interest) and I will have to keep a paper spread sheet, 

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On 06/07/2021 at 12:14, chris p bacon said:

If your postage terms say 3 days that is fine, but if they are less let us know your ebay name so we can choose to block you.


It says 3 days.  I've always put that so if it turn up sooner (IE, I can post the same day, which can happen), people are happier.

But if you want to block someone for slow posting, go ahead...  I'd rather have the item if I bid on it - even if it takes 3 weeks to arrive and they've put "postage within 2 days".

In fact, I only get edgy if someone puts they're posting next day delivery and they don't upload tracking.

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These days, if you post an item at a Post Office, and ask for proof of postage, you get a receipt with a code on it. That code can be used to check on delivery using the Post Office tracking system. It even works sometimes. 

 

 

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Emphasis on sometimes though.  No Postie has collected a signature off anyone for the thick end of eighteen months now and I can't see that changing anytime soon.

 

The RM is still miles better than all the other so called professional parcel delivery firms, all of which I would not touch with a twenty metre barge pole!

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