bordercollie Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 Hi I have some old Betta bitz sides. The instructions are that they are designed to be used Hornby R122 or R123 clerestory coaches. I am wondering if latter versions/releases from Hornby can also be used if they are of the "long" type. Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium kevinlms Posted May 23, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 23, 2021 23 minutes ago, bordercollie said: Hi I have some old Betta bitz sides. The instructions are that they are designed to be used Hornby R122 or R123 clerestory coaches. I am wondering if latter versions/releases from Hornby can also be used if they are of the "long" type. Regards I doubt whether the coaches changed at all, except for the livery. You had me fooled with the R122 & R123 catalogue numbers, as for many years, they were the cat numbers for the Cattle Wagon & Horse Box, respectively. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted May 23, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 23, 2021 Hornby do two different GW clerestory types, and the one we are talking about here is the old Triang 'shorty' clerestory released originally in 1961 to go with Lord of the Isles. They are 8" long and have a generic separate moulded underframe and generic BR B1 bogies. They are still being produced, re-issued quite recently. The other type is a gangwayed coach with printed panelling and 10' Dean bogies dating from the late 70s or early 80s, 10" in length I believe. The corridor side windows are different and the coach has lavatories ,and gangway bellows connections on the neds, so is easily distinguishable. I have never heard of Betta Bitz sides, and would be interested to find out what they are! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 Bettabitz sides were designed to fit the longer (8'6" wide) Hornby corridor clerestories. 4 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeTrice Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 Agree. Unlike the earlier mouldings the longer Hornby Corridor Clerestories had no moulded panelling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bordercollie Posted May 23, 2021 Author Share Posted May 23, 2021 Hi Maybe I have got the code numbers wrong. I will check. However, if the Hornby clerestories didn't change in basic dimensions I suppose I could use any of their clerestory products that I can get hold of. Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lofty1966 Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 1 hour ago, bordercollie said: Hi Maybe I have got the code numbers wrong. I will check. However, if the Hornby clerestories didn't change in basic dimensions I suppose I could use any of their clerestory products that I can get hold of. Regards The "long" Clerestory coaches haven't changed dimensions since they were released, just the tampo printing. The donor coaches take a fair bit of sanding to get the width down to accept the brass overlays. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted May 24, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 24, 2021 10 hours ago, Miss Prism said: Bettabitz sides were designed to fit the longer (8'6" wide) Hornby corridor clerestories. My bad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 4 hours ago, bordercollie said: Maybe I have got the code numbers wrong. I will check. The original Triang clerestories were R332 and R333, but Hornby has used those numbers for other things subsequently. 4 hours ago, bordercollie said: However, if the Hornby clerestories didn't change in basic dimensions I suppose I could use any of their clerestory products that I can get hold of. There are two distinct types of clerestory, as noted above. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium kevinlms Posted May 24, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) 4 hours ago, bordercollie said: Hi Maybe I have got the code numbers wrong. I will check. However, if the Hornby clerestories didn't change in basic dimensions I suppose I could use any of their clerestory products that I can get hold of. Regards No need. The R122 & R123 are correct, they were used later for the GWR 'new' clerestory coaches and also other R numbers. Go here & search for 'clerestory', to understand the confusion. http://www.hornbyguide.com/search.asp Also type in R122 & R123 to see what else you could have! Edited May 24, 2021 by kevinlms More info Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bordercollie Posted May 24, 2021 Author Share Posted May 24, 2021 Hi I have finally had a good look at the instructions for Betta Bitz purchased pre-1985 and it appears that most of the mouldings on the R122 clerestories has to removed so I think I would be better off looking for the later types that did not have the mouldings in the first. Given that the dimensions have not changed does anyone disagree with this conclusion? Thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lofty1966 Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, bordercollie said: Hi I have finally had a good look at the instructions for Betta Bitz purchased pre-1985 and it appears that most of the mouldings on the R122 clerestories has to removed so I think I would be better off looking for the later types that did not have the mouldings in the first. Given that the dimensions have not changed does anyone disagree with this conclusion? Thanks By the time you've prepped a coach there's virtually nothing left. The body still needs sanding thinner by about 1mm. Also the window appatures need opening out top and bottom. They take a lot of work! Edited May 24, 2021 by lofty1966 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lofty1966 Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 18 minutes ago, lofty1966 said: By the time you've prepped a coach there's virtually nothing left. The body still needs sanding thinner by about 1mm. Also the window appatures need opening out top and bottom. They take a lot of work! I would use the etched sides and ends - braced with some strip brass on the inside - and dump the Hornby body moulding. The chassis / bogies and roof could be used. John Isherwood. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lofty1966 Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 12 hours ago, cctransuk said: I would use the etched sides and ends - braced with some strip brass on the inside - and dump the Hornby body moulding. The chassis / bogies and roof could be used. John Isherwood. I think you are probably right John. on a different betabitz kit the width of the kit was wider so wasn’t so much to shave off. i just used these as an example. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 They were available from 247 Developments until fairly recently. Then went to Stevenson Carriages when the previous 247 Development owner decided to stop selling coach parts. He also did the roofs and underframes. Brian at 247 still has the bogies in the range. Whether the sides and other parts will reappear under Squires is unknown. But they have reissued some of the kits such as the LNWR and Midland stock. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/384173813982?hash=item59728b30de:g:r5EAAOSw7khgpS5Y Jason 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lofty1966 Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 Here's another example Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darwinian Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 Not all Bettabitz clerestory etches included ends. The D40 brake third I built for example is body and clerestory sides only. This makes things a bit easier as getting the width down isn't quite so critical. I did make the mistake of carefully cutting out openings in the Hornby clerestory sides to clear the window openings in the overlays only to realise that by the 1920s these would have been painted or paneled over so i could have just blanked them off. Also be aware that some of the Bettabitz range did not carry the 10' Dean bogies fitted to the Hornby models. I have the "Falmouth Coupe" to build and had to source the shorter bogies for that (from 247developments). Worsely works do some alternative side etches to fit these Hornby clerestories too but I've not tried any. Here's my D40: 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darwinian Posted May 25, 2021 Share Posted May 25, 2021 Just remembered that I described the D40 build here: 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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