Beetle prized cattle wagon in BR maroon; end colour black or maroon?

[Neil]

As the title implies I'm part way through a build of the Parkside kit for this wagon. In BR maroon should the ends be maroon or black? All the photos I can find have been inconclusive.

 

Many thanks.

[Trainshed Terry]

That is a tough question to answer, it could be either liveries and when they where rebuilt or had repairs done. But as it was a passenger vehicle I would go with black end, there has been a thread on these vehicle previously. if you click this link it will take you to relevant thread.

 

I hope that is a help to you.

 

Terry.

[The Johnster]

The difference is to do with the introduction of spray painting in the 60s (1963 I think) and my feeling is that few Beetles would have been overhauled and repainted after this.  Black ends would be my go-to unless there was specific evidence relating to a particular vehicle that I wanted to represent.  Any in crimson pre-1956 livery should have black ends.

[Michael Hodgson]

I did mine in maroon, but there's a good case for black. 

 

Not much evidence either way on line, but I have seen this

 

https://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/2381209

[Steamport Southport]

Careful with preserved examples as they wouldn't have got black ironwork like that example has. Was that one painted by Oxford Rail? 

 

 

 

Crimson with black ends pre 1957. Then maroon. I doubt many of them would have got maroon ends. I think at the time they were on the way out and any survivors probably went to departmental use.

 

The one at the bottom of this page looks right to my eyes.

 

http://www.gwr.org.uk/liverieswagonsiphon.html

 

 

 

Jason

[kevinlms]

31 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

Careful with preserved examples as they wouldn't have got black ironwork like that example has.

 

Jason

That statement might be plain wrong!

 

In LMS Standard Coaching Stock Vol 2, there is a photo of contemporary 1927 built Prize Cattle Van to Diagram 1876, in as new condition.

 

The caption says 'It rather seems as if the hinges and strapping have been picked out in black'.

As these vehicle were special vehicles for a premium traffic, perhaps the railway companies, went to a little more trouble, than normal, for what many people would regard as cattle wagons. They were not of course and I suspect the people paying to transport their expensive animals, paid good money for the privilege.

 

There seems to be no evidence that PCV's were ever painted with anything but maroon ends, but of course this is not the GWR/WR!

[Steamport Southport]

1 minute ago, kevinlms said:

That statement might be plain wrong!

 

In LMS Standard Coaching Stock Vol 2, there is a photo of contemporary 1927 built Prize Cattle Van to Diagram 1876, in as new condition.

 

The caption says 'It rather seems as if the hinges and strapping have been picked out in black'.

As these vehicle were special vehicles for a premium traffic, perhaps the railway companies, went to a little more trouble, than normal, for what many people would regard as cattle wagons. They were not of course and I suspect the people paying to transport their expensive animals, paid good money for the privilege.

 

There seems to be no evidence that PCV's were ever painted with anything but maroon ends, but of course this is not the GWR/WR!

 

 

We are talking about post 1948 BR....  

 

Even the example in the picture was built by BR.

 

Why 1927 LMS livery is being brought up is bewildering. 

 

 

 

Jason

[Neil]

Brilliant, many thanks all, black it is.