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Is this concrete garage useable, repairable or condemnable?


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  • RMweb Gold

Just moved to a new house, pne of the attractions of which (to me) was the goodly sized garage, which just needed lining to make it cosy as the survey said it was dry, serviceable and supplied with mains power.
Or so I thought.
Well, the power (a) doesn’t work and (b) wouldn’t be safe it it did and the dryness is questionable without some repair work.

 

But what concerns me is the rebar showing through the concrete, due to depassivation. 
 

Hence the question: is it worth trying to repair this, or should I plan to have it demolished and reuse the concrete floor?

 

Having been made redundant yesterday, I am in no tearing hurry as I have other priorities, but would like to plan for the future.

 

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38 minutes ago, AyJay said:

Is that an asbestos roof!!!

Certainly looks it.  That will cost you to demoliish - all protective gear and fees to have it taken away.  

If you bought this house, I would expect any survey to have picked that up.

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  • RMweb Gold

The garage and panels have reached end of life so I wouldn't waste money on it, when you have the time/money I'd take it down and dispose of it. Or do what I've done with several and sell it on Ebay with "Buyer dismantles and collects"

 

The roof is white cement board which has a degree of asbestos within, leaving it where it is isn't a problem but if you take it down it can be bagged and collected as contaminated waste by an approved contractor. Alternatively if you're thinking of some concrete paths around the house or shed use it as sub material.  The issue is with it leaving the property so if reused as inert material it avoids that.

 

Use the garage base as a slab for an insulated shed.

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Personally, I would be more concerned about the asbestos roof. The concrete cancer is, compared to the roof a minor issue.

 

I would get rid of it using a specialist contractor & look to the surveyour to at least contribute towards the cost, via legal action if necessary. If the surveyour missed that I would be inclined to have another survey done in case anything else was missed. Make sure you document everything in case you want to seel the property later.

 

I would not bury the waste - just google "can I bury asbestos" & you will find loads of information on the subject.

 

Even if the structure was in good order it would cost serious money to insulate & make it a comfortable environment for you & your model railway. Have a look at a log cabin type structure - easy to insulate & not too expensive to heat.

 

 

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  • RMweb Gold
3 minutes ago, SamThomas said:

Personally, I would be more concerned about the asbestos roof. The concrete cancer is, compared to the roof a minor issue.

 

I would get rid of it using a specialist contractor & look to the surveyour to at least contribute towards the cost, via legal action if necessary. If the surveyour missed that I would be inclined to have another survey done in case anything else was missed. Make sure you document everything in case you want to seel the property later.

 

I would not bury the waste - just google "can I bury asbestos" & you will find loads of information on the subject.

 

Even if the structure was in good order it would cost serious money to insulate & make it a comfortable environment for you & your model railway. Have a look at a log cabin type structure - easy to insulate & not too expensive to heat.

 

 

 

As Mr Bacon has said, there is asbestos and there is asbestos, not all is highly dangerous blue crocidolite, and having dealt with asbestos to quite a depth in my gas board days your reaction isn't unusual.

Carefully removed with the appropriate precautions taken, it's not particularly harmful, so is no more problematical than the walls in this situation.

 

Mike.

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  • RMweb Gold

The roof is asbestos, and I am aware of it. It would need specialist attention to remove it and dispose of it, but is safe enough as it is.

 

The “concrete cancer” is more of a concern: if it is repairable, then I can line out the garage and replace the roof at a future date.  If not, no point spending money on it.

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15 minutes ago, SamThomas said:

Personally, I would be more concerned about the asbestos roof. The concrete cancer is, compared to the roof a minor issue.

 

 

The problem with this material is it's mis-description by those with only partial knowledge, It is not "asbestos" but white cement board with a fibre content. You are more at risk from loft insulation from the 60's and 70's which has a very high loose glass shard content. The roof board is fine while in place, in one piece and outside.

 

Quote

I would get rid of it using a specialist contractor & look to the surveyour to at least contribute towards the cost, via legal action if necessary.

 

You'd be wasting your time, Unless the surveyor was specifically tasked to include the garage it would be excluded as it is not a permanent structure.

If the survey was for a mortgage company it would only be to ascertain whether the house would reach enough value to discharge the mortgage should the borrower default on the mortgage.

 

Quote

I would not bury the waste - just google "can I bury asbestos" & you will find loads of information on the subject.

 

Google is not the font of all knowledge, I did not suggest it be buried but used as inert material in concrete paths or a base. This binds the material up in concrete and is a recognised and legal way of dealing with the material.

 

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  • RMweb Gold
4 minutes ago, Regularity said:

if it is repairable,

 

It's not, it will just get worse as the re-bar is open to the elements.

 

New shed time.

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  • RMweb Gold
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, chris p bacon said:

 

It's not, it will just get worse as the re-bar is open to the elements.

 

New shed time.

That is what I suspected, and all I needed to know.

Didn’t instruct them surveyor to go into great detail about the garage, either: that wasn’t why we were buying the house - it was just a bonus.

 

Thanks for your detailed input, Dave, and to everyone else for contributing.

 

Anyone know how much us a reasonable price to pay for the removal of the roof, if nothing else?

Edited by Regularity
Autocorrect needed correcting
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Check out whether a epacement garage will need planning permission, some do some don't.

A wooden building would seem to be a good idea, we are just having a stable built as a storage unit, 24 X12ft circa £3000 erected,  The key is to have a standard size building, provided by a firm for whom providing and erecting are everyday jobs.   Get a non standard size or have to have a new base built and costs rocket, I think our base is circa £1500.   Your local bodge builder will quote to do it cheaper, except he will hit an expensive and completely unforseen snag or twenty which will bump the bill up to around the price of a reasonable secondhand Ferrari.

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Depends on budget and desire for perfect buildings. It is unlikely to collapse in the next ten years and a little rendering and paint will make it more attractive. Once you have investigated the local rules and facilities for disposing of the cement board roof a replacement using treated 3x2, OSB sheets and Onduline top sheets is a straight forward DIY for around 500 pounds. Another 500 will see it insulated and lined out. 

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Clearly, those that took issue with my post missed the word "personally" - let me explain to those who missunderstood - that means what I would do & that's based on having spent 50+ years in an engineering/building management environment.

 

I say again, I would err on the side of caution.

 

FWIW I am aware that google is not the font of all knowledge. However, there is a lot of information on there, some correct, some incorrrect & generally I take a concensus of opinion & then make my own call.

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Just to add my tuppence. Firstly Crispy Bacon is a super resource on here with building queries, in the past Dave has been very helpful in a garage conversion then advice on my new railway room

 

At my old club one of the members built himself a new shed in the garden for his railway, the bottom half was built in blockwork, the top half and roof was timber clad. Sometimes its worth spending a little extra, for extra comfort and or security

 

When we moved house just over 5 years ago I looked into having a shed built for a railway room which would be both insulated and secure security wise. As you would expect the estimate came to several thousand £'s, we were having an extension designed so included the shed's footprint into the plan, as we were having building work done the extra cost was much the same (if not less) as a bespoke shed. However is far more secure and no real additional heating costs in the future,

 

What I would say is explore every avenue, firstly look to see what you can replace it with as you may well be able to make it more model railway friendly. Secondly consider if what you build will enhance the value of the property. Thanks to the architect our kitchen is larger and more desirable and my railway room is an extra room downstairs (study, den, bedroom etc). The shed would not add any value to the property, the better kitchen and extra room certainly does 

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12 minutes ago, SamThomas said:

Clearly, those that took issue with my post missed the word "personally" - let me explain to those who missunderstood - that means what I would do & that's based on having spent 50+ years in an engineering/building management environment.

 

I say again, I would err on the side of caution.

 

FWIW I am aware that google is not the font of all knowledge. However, there is a lot of information on there, some correct, some incorrrect & generally I take a concensus of opinion & then make my own call.

 

I think most houses built in the 60's and 70's will have asbestos somewhere, our old house had the kitchen chimney lined with it, it was capped off both up the top and bottom, many ceilings were texture coated with materials which included asbestos. being sealed away they are safe

 

You are quite right to be concerned about the roof, but just follow professional advice on its disposal/continued reuse 

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17 hours ago, Regularity said:

The roof is asbestos ...

 

No it isn't.  As Mr Bacon says earlier in this thread for those who care to read his wise words, it's one of the various old cement/asbestos boards.  Not at all the same thing as "asbestos".

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You might also want to chop down the ash tree sapling before it gets any more established.

 

Check with your local council regarding the disposal of the asbestos containing roof sheets. We took down a concrete panel garage and were able to dispose of the roof via a council waste site. The sheets needed double wrapping in 1000 gauge polythene (from builders merchants) and we were charged about £50 - with the PPE we bought (think CSI white suits, gloves, goggles, mask etc) there was change left from £100.

 

Steven B.

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The building looks like one of those sold by such firms as "Banbury" who specialised in self assembly stand alone concrete garages. I had one at a previous property and the roof looks the same.

(The slab has a Ford cylinder block buried in it, that should prove interesting for archaeologists in 1000 years time!)

 

Personally I would not use the structure for anything other than a car as there are usually too many gaps for wind & rain to penetrate.

I would start with a new wooden building if not required for a car.

 

Edit What's the drainage pipe for?

Edited by melmerby
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29 minutes ago, spikey said:

 

No it isn't.  As Mr Bacon says earlier in this thread for those who care to read his wise words, it's one of the various old cement/asbestos boards.  Not at all the same thing as "asbestos".

 

I agree with Dave. But try telling that to the Jobsworths at your local council tip.

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1 hour ago, spikey said:

 

No it isn't.  As Mr Bacon says earlier in this thread for those who care to read his wise words, it's one of the various old cement/asbestos boards.  Not at all the same thing as "asbestos".

 

1 hour ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

 

I agree with Dave. But try telling that to the Jobsworths at your local council tip.

Well, yes, it is cement with asbestos in it, not  “pure” asbestos, but as far as the local authorities will be concerned…

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1 hour ago, melmerby said:

Edit What's the drainage pipe for?

I mentioned the condemnable electrics…?

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2 hours ago, Regularity said:

I mentioned the condemnable electrics…?

Blimey they must be bad if they need to be drained...........:(

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