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GWR Travelling Generator Van


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Post war was it kept as a generator or did they strip out all the kit and turn it into a standard parcels van?

 

once I know if the modelling funds are safe (after my wife crashes the car into next door’s house!) I think I will drop Worsely a line to see if their etch can be adapted…

will all depend on whether the car is repairable or a write off

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On 14/06/2021 at 12:33, kada33 said:

There is a photo of this vehicle in Russell's GWC appendix II Fig 459. It is easier to find by Figs than Page numbers.

 Dave

Looks very nice seeing it in gwr colours I must say, I think I am tempted with a kit if one appears from Worsleyworks.

 

dave brighty

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I have the Roxey Mouldings K15 etch in front of me.  It would take some serious modelling to turn it into that later van - all the panelling would have to be covered in with filler and smoothed, then a number of doors filled with louvre vents.

 

That would also make for quite a weighty van - a brass kit with sides full of filler.

 

Even the earlier version of it with less panelling would be a challenging model to make.  But not impossible.

 

The louvre doors are challenging me at the moment.......

 

Or I might just build the K29 I was planning...........

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Worsley can adapt the etch for the K15 to make this diagram.  I have been corresponding with Allen.

 

It would seem that it had two distinctly different appearances after what could be estimated as a "major" shop in 57 when it seems the sides (might) have been heavily plated.

 

So who would be interested in an "early" (1944 - 1957) semi-plated version, and who would like a "late" post 57 heavily plated version?

 

PM me please - I need fairly firm "yes" numbers before anything further gets done.  Obviously if we get to critical mass and the etch (es) go (es) into production/catalogue, the "Maybe's" can then commit on their own later.

 

I'm going for an "early"

 

 

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On 14/06/2021 at 12:33, kada33 said:

There is a photo of this vehicle in Russell's GWC appendix II Fig 459. It is easier to find by Figs than Page numbers.

 Dave

A very useful photo, I wasnt expecting it to be finished in chocolate and cream (single lined with GWR over crest) so its avoided my making a mistake with the painting.

 

Nice to have a coach with just a single number as well! 

 

Still no idea how I will use it, but such an interesting prototype just needs to be modelled!

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3 hours ago, The Fatadder said:

A very useful photo, I wasnt expecting it to be finished in chocolate and cream (single lined with GWR over crest) so its avoided my making a mistake with the painting.

 

Nice to have a coach with just a single number as well! 

 

Still no idea how I will use it, but such an interesting prototype just needs to be modelled!

Put off at Brent with a hotbox and waiting C&W attention (must have been fresh out of shops to finish up with a hot box, that was when they usually occurred on coaching stock ;) )

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3 hours ago, The Fatadder said:

 

 

Still no idea how I will use it, but such an interesting prototype just needs to be modelled!

On its' way to Plymouth to power lights for night repairs on the Royal Albert Bridge.

 

Mike Wiltshire

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See what I've just stumbled across in the GWR Magazine for July 1945. No mention of the van being intended for Eisenhower's train (but presumably that was still restricted information) & note it didn't have a steam-heating boiler as has been suggested elsewhere. No one has questioned why a K15, with gangway connections, was chosen rather than a K14 or K16 which didn't have them. There were 70 of the latter 2 diagrams but only 50 K15s & most were still in service in 1944.

GWRMag-July1945-ElecGenVan.pdf

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Hand starting a diesel engine !!!!!

 

Thanks for that info- all helps with the etch which is coming along.

 

Three squared off roof scoops - one is definitely for the generator room.  The other two just to ventilate the battery rooms?

 

 

 

 

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The LNER had generator vans but used standard box vans in sets of 3, each one containing a separate part of the generating 'system'.  I believe they were intended for powering up areas affected by bombing raids etc.  A friend has designed and produced a 3-D printed 4mm scale version of the LNER vans.

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Work on the 4mm etch for the "early" panelled (semi plated) version of W2W is coming along.

 

Sorry for a delay in update - i was away and then caught COVID again!

 

MartinT's post above has helped confirm a few things.  Thank you for posting.

 

The size of the three vent scoops is going to be a "best guestimate".

 

As for location of the shell vents - does anyone have an accurate drawing of how there were on the original?  That would be a good start point.

 

Thank you

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12 minutes ago, nick baxter said:

Another variation on a K diagram Brake van:

 

58128 at Swindon.

K11 of Lot 813 1898.

Rebuilt as Q18 Slip Coach

 

 

I wonder what service required a brake to be slipped - a postal or parcels service? Or was it slipped with a passenger-carrying vehicle?

 

By the time of that photo it is presumably in BR crimson rather than GWR all-over brown?

 

The board in the eves seems to say STORES VAN but I can't make out the line below.

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18 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I wonder what service required a brake to be slipped - a postal or parcels service? Or was it slipped with a passenger-carrying vehicle?

 

By the time of that photo it is presumably in BR crimson rather than GWR all-over brown?

 

The board in the eves seems to say STORES VAN but I can't make out the line below.

The longer word in the lower line looks rather like 'Didcot';  the top line definitely says Stores Van.  As a departmental vehicle would it be in black - it certainly looks darker than the vehicle next to it although that might be down to the effect of it being a wet day (and it doesn't look like a 'DW' number)

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19 hours ago, nick baxter said:

Another variation on a K diagram Brake van:

 

58128 at Swindon.

K11 of Lot 813 1898.

Rebuilt as Q18 Slip Coach

58128 Swindon  (K11) Q18.jpg

 

... to a Slip Coach? Are you sure?

The Sep 1967 article in MRC has K11 1068  of lot 812 (09/1896) being converted first to a 'Lamp Van (03/1936) & later (date not given) to a Stores Van ultimately numbered 58128, Diagram Q 18.'

 

Martin

 

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@NickBaxter

 

What year is that photo please Nick?  Any idea?   The white roof on the van is throwing my thoughts one way, but with it looking very clean and refurbished, it could be pre WW2 if this had just been convered/re-designated as a Stores Van.

 

Now that I have read that the fourth word may be "Didcot" I can't "un-see it"   

 

If someone had a list of the routes where the different stores vans ran in what years...........but then again it was more likely to be designated with a route than a single destingaiton as these vans went to a lot of places on their 5 day round trips.  

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9 hours ago, M.I.B said:

What year is that photo please Nick?  Any idea?   The white roof on the van is throwing my thoughts one way, but with it looking very clean and refurbished, it could be pre WW2 if this had just been convered/re-designated as a Stores Van.

 

The vehicle next to it would appear to be in post-1957 BR livery with a W-prefix number.

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2 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

The vehicle next to it would appear to be in post-1957 BR livery with a W-prefix number.

No. The vehicle next to it is in the earliest BR livery for non-corridor vehicles - lined crimson with the painted number at the left hand end of the vehicle side - so circa 1950.

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6 hours ago, bécasse said:

No. The vehicle next to it is in the earliest BR livery for non-corridor vehicles - lined crimson with the painted number at the left hand end of the vehicle side - so circa 1950.

 

Ah; my understanding was that the livery for non-corridor stock up to 1956/7 was unlined crimson. I had not realised that there was a lined style that preceded it. I should stick to c. 1902...

 

But anyway it demonstrates to @M.I.B that the photo is post-WW2. The light shade of the roof is due to the sunlight reflected off it - compare the elliptical roof of the other vehicle, which gets lighter as it curves round.

Edited by Compound2632
post-WW2 not pre-WW2!
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I have always had a liking for these 40ft vans, having built or ‘rescued’ three K’s kits and with yet a further carded one to think about (which will probably be a stores or departmental van of some sort).

 

But, given that only a very small handful would still have been in use by the late-‘40s, and probably even fewer in this fairly original condition, I was surprised to see that the look-outs had not been removed and parts of the paneling plated over. I thought that this would have been almost inevitable by then.

 

Tony

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16 minutes ago, Prometheus said:

But, given that only a very small handful would still have been in use by the late-‘40s, and probably even fewer in this fairly original condition, I was surprised to see that the look-outs had not been removed and parts of the paneling plated over. I thought that this would have been almost inevitable by then.

 

The pic is an exception to that norm, although there is a plate over the side surface of the lookout. Some of the door and side panelling has been refurbished/plated over. I think lookouts were removed only if they were in bad condition. Some went in the mid-1920s, so there is no general rule. The function of the lookouts became a bit pointless when working with wider (Churchward and beyond) stock.

 

Edited by Miss Prism
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5 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Ah; my understanding was that the livery for non-corridor stock up to 1956/7 was unlined crimson. I had not realised that there was a lined style that preceded it. I should stick to c. 1902...

 

But anyway it demonstrates to @M.I.B that the photo is pre-WW2. The light shade of the roof is due to the sunlight reflected off it - compare the elliptical roof of the other vehicle, which gets lighter as it curves round.

There was reportedly lining on some WR non-gangwayed crimson livery passenger vehicles but to be honest that vehicle on the right looks far too dark for an ex-works crimson liveried coach and i reckon it is in maroon, not crimson.  The roof of 58128 is probably showing up like that because of the weather - just look at the workshop roof in the background which is very similar in tone because it too is wet.

 

The photo is of course, as you originally said, obviously from the BR era as the adjacent vehicle clearly carries a BR number. 

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8 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

The photo is of course, as you originally said, obviously from the BR era as the adjacent vehicle clearly carries a BR number. 

 

You have drawn my attention to a blunder in my post, which I have now corrected, I wrote pre-WW2 meaning post-WW2 of course, as you no doubt realised.

 

Also, in my sunny optimism I wrote of sunlight reflected off the roof; looking at the photo again, I agree it's a wet, grey day!

Edited by Compound2632
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4 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

There was reportedly lining on some WR non-gangwayed crimson livery passenger vehicles but to be honest that vehicle on the right looks far too dark for an ex-works crimson liveried coach and i reckon it is in maroon, not crimson.  The roof of 58128 is probably showing up like that because of the weather - just look at the workshop roof in the background which is very similar in tone because it too is wet.

 

The photo is of course, as you originally said, obviously from the BR era as the adjacent vehicle clearly carries a BR number. 

The initial BR non-corridor livery, introduced officially in February 1949 but effectively not before early-summer that year, was waist-lined crimson with the painted number at the LEFT hand end of each vehicle side. This livery officially continued until the spring of 1951 when the waist-lining of non-corridor vehicles (which often looked ridiculous in practice) was discontinued and the painted numbers were transferred to the right hand end. Swindon was slow to apply the Railway Executive instruction to make these particular livery changes and it was probably mid-1952 before they were implemented there. The paucity (and poor quality) of early colour photographs makes it difficult to be certain but black & white photos suggest that newly-painted non-corridor stock turned out by Swindon looked just like such stock turned out by other works, the crimson looking rich and quite dark. What does seem certain from colour photographs is that Swindon-painted crimson stock faded much faster than stock painted elsewhere, my suspicions are that Swindon, having traditionally always had cream upper works (which it still had on corridor stock, of course), used a pale undercoat whereas other works used a darker one, although it is possible (but seems unlikely) that Swindon's painting (or possibly revarnishing) techniques were sub-standard. Certainly by the mid-1950s typical WR non-corridor vehicles looked very different to, say, typical SR ones, which of course they met in the West Country.

 

The 1956 maroon livery was initially lined only for vestibuled vehicles, the lining being extended to non-corridor stock from mid-1959, (this lining was normally, but not always, applied at contrail level as well as at waist level), but in all cases the painted numbers were applied to the right hand end of the sides and therefore the photo cannot show a lined maroon liveried vehicle as the painted number is clearly at the left hand end.

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