Layout design struggles

[JN]

Changes I've made:

• Created a new junction with a crossing from the in line to the siding (assuming; inner = anti-clockwise, outer = clockwise)...
• Created a headshunt (to the right of the siding entrance) from which wagons can be transferred from the reception siding to the load/unload siding (and back again)...
• Created a store line (the yellow piece) on which a train locomotive can be stored awaiting departure with its next turn...

If you put a metaphorical mirror at the end of the curves, the oval is completed and another sidings is created. The plan is getting quite complicated in terms of wiring, even without any signalling and point motors. I find all that electronic stuff 'intimidating'/worrisome for reasons I've mentioned in the kit building section. I'm actually tempted to get hand levers for the sidings with a figure on the lever that I could use and use point motors on the main line (as if controlled from a signal box).

I could take out the red siding altogether and the headshunt (I've seen a photo of a coal train being loaded by a JCB on a single line siding). An available locomotive waiting on the yellow track (I don't know what else to call it) then backs on to the train and takes it away. Once the train has left the locomotive that arrived with the inbound train then goes to the yellow track awaiting its next turn on the next outbound train...

 

I don't want to get too far ahead of myself, but looking at the plan I was thinking this side could be a very gentle gradient coming away from the dock and a gentle gradient back towards the dock...

[Flying Pig]

I wonder if something like this would work for you?   All the curves are flexi and the tightest is 28" radius so I have used standard Streamline spacing (though you might want to chech that with your rolling stock).  All long points except for one curved and one long Y in the yard.  Station platforms at the top.

 

The operating well is 2' 6" wide - the same as a standard door, so should be ok.

 

I have kept the yard quite simple which is probably right for the period you are modelling.  You could make the top siding an exchange siding and add a kickback into the docks if you wanted, with a private shunter (plenty of suitable models to choose from).

 

Edit: there should be a second facing crossover top right to allow trains to run from the outer circuit to the goods loop.  It would be between the platforms of course, but I don't think that's a problem with a colour light signalling scheme.

 

 

 

Edited June 23, 2021 by Flying Pig

[Flying Pig]

Alternative plan showing the additional crossover mentioned above.  This one has a bay platform which can double as a carriage siding to allow more stock to be run but I'm not sure I like having the platforms on such a tight curve (30" radius on the inner line).

 

[Chimer]

Your last plan looks much better to my eye.  I think the trains you are intending to feature were usually in permanent rakes and only rarely shunted, but if you do want to shunt, the headshunt allowing shunting clear of the main line is a good addition.  The double junction off the main into the dock also looks better.  The extra siding is perhaps not necessary, as the loco waiting to take the next train out could happily sit in the headshunt.

 

But my other reservations about this being unexciting operationally still apply, and if you do intend to have a number of different freight rakes and a few varieties of passenger stock, you really do need some storage roads somewhere to hold them .....

[RJS1977]

Another potential issue with that plan is the reverse curves caused by having another set of points adjacent to the top crossover.

 

We had a similar arrangement on my father's layout and one of our larger modern locos kept derailing on it. We moved the crossover along a foot or so (it's a big layout!) away from the other point, and no problems since.

[Dungrange]

On 24/06/2021 at 12:38, Chimer said:

The extra siding is perhaps not necessary, as the loco waiting to take the next train out could happily sit in the headshunt.

 

Whilst I agree that the train locomotive could sit in the head shunt, the head shunt as shown is significantly shorter than either the arrival / departure road (blue) or the dock siding (red), so it looks like the transfer of wagons between these two tracks may involve splitting the train and transferring each half separately.  As such, the presence of a locomotive at the end of the head shunt may not be ideal.  I'd therefore keep the extra stabling siding (yellow) as @JN has shown it.

 

On 24/06/2021 at 12:38, Chimer said:

But my other reservations about this being unexciting operationally still apply, and if you do intend to have a number of different freight rakes and a few varieties of passenger stock, you really do need some storage roads somewhere to hold them .....

 

That's a concern that I share.  It looks very much as though each train that is operated will have to be removed from the layout in order to run the next train, which isn't particularly appealing in my eyes.  I feel that there really is a need for some storage space somewhere.

[Chimer]

4 hours ago, Dungrange said:

 

Whilst I agree that the train locomotive could sit in the head shunt, the head shunt as shown is significantly shorter than either the arrival / departure road (blue) or the dock siding (red), so it looks like the transfer of wagons between these two tracks may involve splitting the train and transferring each half separately.  As such, the presence of a locomotive at the end of the head shunt may not be ideal.  I'd therefore keep the extra stabling siding (yellow) as @JN has shown it.

 

My assumption was the loco sitting in the headshunt would do any necessary shunting .....

[Dungrange]

15 minutes ago, Chimer said:

My assumption was the loco sitting in the headshunt would do any necessary shunting .....

 

I think the assumption is that there will be a dock shunter, which will sit in the head shunt.  A train will arrive from the mainline with the mainline locomotive becoming trapped at the buffers at the end of the arrival road (blue).  The dockside shunter would then transfer the wagons from the arrival / departure road (blue) to the dock siding (red) (possibly in two halves) and this would then allow the mainline locomotive to move to the stabling point (ie yellow siding).  The dock shunter would then transfer the wagons back from the dock siding (red) to the departure road (blue) and when completed, the shunter would return to the head shunt and the mainline locomotive would leave the stabling point to couple up to the train ready for departure.  As I said, it is possible to stable the mainline locomotive at the end of the head shunt, but only after it's been released by the local shunter, at which point it gets in the way of the transfer of wagons from the dock siding pre-departure.  That's why I'd leave it as @JN has shown.

[Flying Pig]

I'll put this here as a plan that has "non-hidden storage" to allow a variety of trains to be run.  Changing locos or trains is achieved by prototypical shunting movements as part of the normal operation of the layout.  There should be plenty to do, but if that isn't enough there's still scope for adding private sidings to the freight yard.

 

Another plan worth looking at is Guide Dog Bridge.