Western Times

[craneman]

This talk of Goodrington and the images of GWR No 3 steam crane working on the Tanners Road bridge reminds me that on Sunday 13th August 1989 the near-twin No 2 steam crane was used at Goodrington to lift out what had become the last BR operational gantry semaphore signal in Devon.

 

This lift took place in the very early hours of that Sunday morning so may not have been photographed, but is an incident of significance since it as far as it can be established it was the last time that any steam breakdown crane made an operational lift anywhere on BR metals, even though by that time the crane had sold by BR into the ownership of the Dart Valley Light Railway, and in fact by then had been resold to a private owner.

 

Since in those days the DVLR then owned and operated both the Paignton to Kingswear and the Buckfastleigh to Totnes lines the crane was maintained in a condition which allowed it to travel on BR metals between the two, a journey which took place on several occasions. It was therefore not a problem for the crane to be allowed onto the BR infrastructure for this historic lift.

 

I am not aware that this incident was captured on film, but hope that it might have been. I would be very interested to know if anyone has any photos of the operation, or even just of the gantry signal in question.   

Edited July 13, 2021 by craneman
Those pesky typos that only appear after you've clicked "save"!

[Robin Fell]

18 hours ago, MPR said:

Peter Gray took a series of images of this rebuild - the level crossing was still in place until this was completed. The images have been published elsewhere, but can all be found at Transport Treasury these days  -e.g  https://www.transporttreasury.com/p1039757392

(Images 725 to 728)

 

The Peter Gray gallery is well worth a look - I have purchased a number of large prints to provide information for "Torre" - the quality of the negatives is excellent (you can get FAR more from them than a typical book reproduction) Pricing and delivery were very good.

Thanks MPR - The images are also available at the Transport Library and have the full details of what they are as well. This link shows the whole collection, but there are categories on the left hand side to drill down into the collection more.

 

https://thetransportlibrary.co.uk/?route=product/search&search=Peter+Gray&category_id=0&page=1

 

The ones spoken about above can be found on this search - https://thetransportlibrary.co.uk/?route=product%2Fsearch&search=Peter+Gray+goodrington+1955

[Miss Prism]

I'm staying with my brother while I recuperate following my heart operation, and I won't be able to order a copy until I get back to my proper home, so save a copy of issue 1 for me !!!!!

 

[Miss Prism]

Western Times now referenced on gwr.org

 

[Andy M]

WESTERN TIMES - Issue No.2

 

Dear RMWebbers,

 

I am pleased to update that Issue 2 is compiled and on its way to the printers. The predicted release date is planned for early November and copies will be available to pre-order on the Transport Treasury website shortly.

 

The editorial team and the publisher have been greatly encouraged by the reception and feedback to this new periodical and our aspiration to produce more regular releases going forward has been affirmed. Work on Issue 3 is already well in hand!

 

We also continue to welcome the comments and discussion that has been generated with the readership thus far and contact can be made directly via WesternTimes@mail.com if you have something to say. I will post further updates over the coming weeks as production develops, but rest assured it is on its way. Here is what to look forward to.

 

Regards,

Andy.

  

 

 

Edited April 13, 2022 by Andy M

[bubbles2]

On 23/06/2021 at 05:01, St Enodoc said:

Ordered, together with the NPCCS book. Very reasonable shipping rate to Australia!

Just catching up with this thread, please excuse my ignorance what is the NPCCS book?

[St Enodoc]

55 minutes ago, bubbles2 said:

Just catching up with this thread, please excuse my ignorance what is the NPCCS book?

https://ttpublishing.co.uk/product/western-region-non-passenger-trains-images-from-dick-riley-and-peter-gray-collections/

[Andy M]

Dear All,

 

As promised a quick update.

 

Please be advised that  Western Times - Issue 2 is being printed and bound as we speak. It is expected to be at Transport Treasury HQ early next week and available for sale and distribution.

 

Regards,

Andy.

[Andy M]

Western Times - Issue No.2

 

'OUT NOW'

 

We are pleased to advise that Issue 2 has arrived a little early from the printers and as a result will be available on the Transport Treasury stand at The Great British Model Railway Show at Gaydon this weekend. For those of you not heading to Warwickshire, go to the Transport Treasury Publishing website https://ttpublishing.co.uk/transport-books/ where it will be available to order with free delivery.

 

By way of a little teaser, one of the articles in this issue is an account of the 'Scottish Twins', the pair of 16xx pannier tanks that made an unlikely journey north to work the Dornoch Branch in the Highlands. Illustrated with both B&W and colour images of their time north of the border, the photo below is one that didn't make the 'article cut', but I think too nice not to get an airing!

 

I hope you enjoy the latest offering and as always we look forward to your feedback.

 

Regards,

Andy.

[The Fatadder]

I assume I am not just being blind and issue 2 is not available on the website until tomorrow?

 

 

[Andy M]

4 minutes ago, The Fatadder said:

I assume I am not just being blind and issue 2 is not available on the website until tomorrow?

 

 

Hi Fatadder,

I’m sure it will appear on the website anytime now. Robin is probably busy preparing for the weekend exhibition.

 

Regards,

Andy.

[Robin Fell]

Now available on the site

 

https://ttpublishing.co.uk/product/western-times-issue-2/

[Silas]

And arrived in Bristol only 24hrs after ordering - my initial flick through suggests another very good issue.  Well done Team!!

 

Jon T

[The Stationmaster]

My copy arrived yesterday from Bath and contains some really good stuff it being particularly nice to see some photos from Paul Cooper - a colleague of mine many years ago.  

 

I did notice however what seems to be a major error in the caption to one of the photos in the Milk Train article - because if following the booked route 9708 would have gone nowhere near the Victoria Branch from North Pole Junction to Old Oak Common East or the needless crossing of all 4 busy running lines between Old Oak East and Old Oak West in order to access the Greenford Loop via Park Royal.  And going that way very obviously hardly 'minimised movements over the Paddington - Bristol route' because it did exactly the opposite

 

It would, rather more obviously - and unless some incident had prevented it - have used the booked route from Viaduct Jcn to North Acton which also had the added advantage of offering the easiest means of shunting the milk depot at Wood Lane and was normally the booked route for all trains of milk empties, including long distance workings, from the West London Line to the GWML.  There is of course a fairly well known picture of a 'Castle' hauled train of milk empties, on that route,  just after it had passed under the GWML near Old Oak West.  And as mentioned in the Dick Riley article (some) Up Milk rains for the West London Line also used that route.

 

 

By the way looking at the article about the distant signal did the GWR actually have any four aspect colour light signals in 1947?  I might be wrong but I thought that four aspect colour lights didn't appear anywhere on ex GWR routes until  the first stage of the Hayes - Hanwell - Acton resignalling in 1953?   And of course with 4 aspect colour lights there would be at least 3 dead ramps before arriving at the signal showing a red aspect and in a few places in the past there could even be four.  

 

And of course running on tight headways in colour light areas can, and does, mean running on far more successive dead ramps/magnets than four or five.  Nowhere near the Tuplin nonsense but still a repetitive sequence of dead ramps which is of course no different today - has not only long been identified as posing the risk of warnings being cancelled but has resulted in at least one collision for precisely that reason.

 

[Karhedron]

1 hour ago, The Stationmaster said:

I did notice however what seems to be a major error in the caption to one of the photos in the Milk Train article - because if following the booked route 9708 would have gone nowhere near the Victoria Branch from North Pole Junction to Old Oak Common East or the needless crossing of all 4 busy running lines between Old Oak East and Old Oak West in order to access the Greenford Loop via Park Royal.  And going that way very obviously hardly 'minimised movements over the Paddington - Bristol route' because it did exactly the opposite

 

The same caption also claims that milk tanks were discharged at an MMB depot at Kensington Olympia which I am pretty sure is incorrect. I have a full list of MMB facilities from 1948 and it doesn't mention Kensington. I have also looked at old maps and photos and there is nothing resembling a bottling plant at the trackside in any of them.

 

The only rail-served dairy in the area I have been able to find was the Henry Edwards and Son bottling plant on Hoffland Road near the junction with Sinclair Road.  This was a short distance from the railway and I think the company used Rotanks which were dismounted at KO and driven the short distance to the dairy rather than being discharged at the station itself. The area has now been redeveloped but the gate the milk floats used was still there up until about 10 years ago. HE&S was taken over by Express Dairies at some point so I don't know how long the Rotank service lasted.

 

As far as I have been able to work out, Kensington Olympia was used as a marshalling point for milk trains rather than a location for discharging the tanks. Trains would come in from the GWML and SWML and be concentrated at KO. They would then be split up and shorter rakes would be tripped to the various bottling plants that ringed the capital. Apart from the aforementioned Rotanks, I don't think any unloading of milk took place at KennyO, especially not to an MMB plant. If anyone has information to the contrary, I would certainly be interested to see it.

 

An MMB plant in London would not make a great deal of sense in any case. The MMB was concerned with ensuring stable supplies and prices for milk. Their plants tended to be at the country end to serve farmers and either get milk to London or process excess supply into longer lived products. London was the biggest market for milk and was well served by many major dairies so there was no need for the MMB to get involved there.

[Kris]

Somehow I had missed seeing these announced. An order has now been placed to rectify this oversight. 

[Karhedron]

The HE&S bottling plant on Hoffland Road can be seen quite well in this 1938 aerial photo. You can see the KennyO station to the left and although they are close, the road and terraced houses in between means it is unlikely milk could be directly discharged from the station area or sidings to the dairy.

 

[Miss Prism]

Concerning the location query of the pic on page 7 of issue 1, I think it may be the north end of Gloucester Central. (Was it called 'Central' way back then?)

 

Edit:  Aha! I see this is confirmed in the editorial in issue 2 !  (Which I've just started to read.)

 

Edited November 24, 2021 by Miss Prism

[Miss Prism]

Regarding the caption for issue 1's rear cover picture, "and the end of the distant arm does not go to such a sharp point as with the wooden variant". I've always thought the norm was sharpened points (another example). Possibly this is a can of worms.
 

[The Stationmaster]

22 hours ago, Miss Prism said:

Regarding the caption for issue 1's rear cover picture, "and the end of the distant arm does not go to such a sharp point as with the wooden variant". I've always thought the norm was sharpened points (another example). Possibly this is a can of worms.
 

In many respects it is a can of worms.  The shaping of the 'points; on wooden arms was changed at some time - probably pre-1910 if not earlier - and in any case the wooden centre pivot arms appear not to have have come to a point (although maybe that was changed at some time too?).  The two types of pressed steel arm appear to have differed from each other  at the end of the point and it is possible that the design was also changed at some time on the second type of pressed steel arm (which had the turned over rim) in order to improve resistance to corrosion?  

 

Best answer is to check whichever orignal Reading drawings still remain.

[Andy M]

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to all our readers from the Western Times editorial team.

 

It has been quite a first year for Western Times, since the launch of Issue 1 back in late June. We are pleased to say the publication has been well received and the desired interaction with the readership continues to unearth some fascinating information. We have also noted your feedback and will strive to make improvements going forward.

 

One such request has been for a subscription service, which has now been agreed with our publisher at Transport Treasury (details to follow).

 

Looking forward to 2022 and beyond, Issue 3 is pretty much 'in the can' and will be the first of three releases next year. The expected publication dates will be as follows:

 

Issue 3 - Apr 22

Issue 4 - Aug 22

Issue 5 - Dec 22

 

Thank you again for your valued support and we can promise you some unique articles, discussion and imagery to come!

 

Best wishes,

Andy.

Edited February 1, 2022 by Andy M

[kandc_au]

Excellent News!

Khris

[Karhedron]

On 19/11/2021 at 12:41, The Stationmaster said:

I did notice however what seems to be a major error in the caption to one of the photos in the Milk Train article - because if following the booked route 9708 would have gone nowhere near the Victoria Branch from North Pole Junction to Old Oak Common East or the needless crossing of all 4 busy running lines between Old Oak East and Old Oak West in order to access the Greenford Loop via Park Royal.  And going that way very obviously hardly 'minimised movements over the Paddington - Bristol route' because it did exactly the opposite

 

I have been scratching my head over that picture as well. I wonder if it not tanks coming from North Pole junction at all. I wonder if it is actually empties from the Express Dairy at South Ruislip. South Ruislip to West Ealing is a short and easy trip to the get the empties in position to be worked back west for refilling.

[The Stationmaster]

13 hours ago, Karhedron said:

 

I have been scratching my head over that picture as well. I wonder if it not tanks coming from North Pole junction at all. I wonder if it is actually empties from the Express Dairy at South Ruislip. South Ruislip to West Ealing is a short and easy trip to the get the empties in position to be worked back west for refilling.

That's an interestng point.,  Obviously things varied over the years - to quite a considerable extent.  For example in one timetable (1960/61) the Kensington - Neyland empties ran via North Acton and West Ealing  (where it obviously had to reverse so it must also have been there to attach traffic) whereas the other two ran direct via Hanwell.  

 

Rather strangely in another timetable two trains of empties each day ran from Kensington/Wood Lane to West London - a rather peculiar way of sending what was obviously westbound traffic.  I wonder if that was a timetabled diversion because of some sort of long term problem with the route from Viaduct Jcn to North Acton? (Interestingly in the same timetable)  a train of milk for Bollo Lane was routed via Old Oak Common.)

 

 

[Bluemonkey presents....]

On 24/12/2021 at 12:34, Andy M said:

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to all our readers from the Western Times editorial team.

 

It has been quite a first year for Western Times, since the launch of Issue 1 back in late June. We are pleased to say the publication has been well received and the desired interaction with the readership continues to unearth some fascinating information. We have also noted your feedback and will strive to make improvements going forward.

 

One such request has been for a subscription service, which has now been agreed with our publisher at Transport Treasury (details to follow).

 

Looking forward to 2022 and beyond, Issue 3 is pretty much 'in the can' and will be the first of three releases next year. The expected publication dates will be as follows:

 

Issue 3 - Mar 22

Issue 4 - Jul 22

Issue 5 - Nov 22

 

Thank you again for your valued support and we can promise you some unique articles, discussion and imagery to come!

 

Best wishes,

Andy.

 

Apologies I am very late to the party and only just found this thread and the said journal. I attended a finescale modelling exhibition about 3-4 years ago in Warminster Wiltshire where there was an 'interests list' being compiled for a future GWR publication. Nothing ever seemed to materialise from this but I am hoping your publication is either, that what was planned or a development there of.

 

Having read the comments I have placed orders for the first two issues, of which I am immensely looking forward to receiving and reading. I am also encouraged that a subscription is planned.