Swift Express Freight - Class 321 EMU

[Arpster]

Eversholt Rail have finished the conversion of a Class 321 for use on 100mph freight services. The first of many, or doomed to failure? I can't see any proposed customers or routes.

 

https://eversholtrail.co.uk/news/class-321-swift-express-freight-train-ready-for-service/

[phil-b259]

53 minutes ago, Arpster said:

Eversholt Rail have finished the conversion of a Class 321 for use on 100mph freight services. The first of many, or doomed to failure? I can't see any proposed customers or routes.

 

https://eversholtrail.co.uk/news/class-321-swift-express-freight-train-ready-for-service/

 

Its a trial at the moment.

 

IIRC the idea is that parcel traffic (which has risen massively over the past decade as people shop online) can be transported swiftly to city centre locations without using HGVs for onward distribution by 'man in a van' setup. There is also some scope for supplying retail outlets too - though probably not ones that deal in foodstuffs that require refrigeration.

 

As a concept its a good idea, however the devil will be in the detail as many stations have been made inaccessible to road vehicles. Former Royal Mail terminals would be a good choice - but not sure how that would work out given the users of the trains are likely to be in competition with Royal Mail.

[BernardTPM]

Back when even M.U.s had proper luggage compartments there was Red Star parcels.

 

[Phatbob]

Ooh!  New rolling stock.
So, now for the most important question about any new rolling stock.  What is the official enthusiast's nickname going to be?
A Dusty Bin converted to carry parcels.

 

A Postie Bin?

[BernardTPM]

Ironically the closely related Class 325s were built in such a way that they could be converted into passenger units if needed.

[Zomboid]

It's a great idea on the face of it. I hope it works.

[phil-b259]

1 hour ago, BernardTPM said:

Back when even M.U.s had proper luggage compartments there was Red Star parcels.

 

 

Rather a different concept!

 

Lets be clear passenger TOCs are NOT in the business of carrying parcels - space is needed for fare paying passengers who pay far more than a bunch of parcels.

 

This new venture is conceptually no different to a container train - only its going to be carrying roll on / roll off cages of parcels between dedicated places for the likes of Amazon, My Hermes*, DPD*, etc

 

* No idea if they will use the service but thats the type of company the promoters will be looking to attract.

[TravisM]

As a trial, I’m hoping that it’s successful but I feel more work needs to be done on the unit, such as remove the sliding doors and replace with roller ones, seal up the windows to make it more secure and adapt the interior to accept road transport standard trailer cages

[black and decker boy]

19 minutes ago, jools1959 said:

As a trial, I’m hoping that it’s successful but I feel more work needs to be done on the unit, such as remove the sliding doors and replace with roller ones, seal up the windows to make it more secure and adapt the interior to accept road transport standard trailer cages

The interior is adapted with chequer plate floor and securing points for the trolley cages.

 

We still have a shortage of HGV drivers in the U.K. and with decarbonisation, low emission zones being introduced in major cities, freight MUs may well now find a niche  doing trunk SRFIs to city centres with electric LGVs doing final delivery.

[Revolution Ben]

 

Hi all,

 

This feels like a similar concept to the ROG Orion project.

 

I hadn't realised there was a shortage of HGV drivers.  Perhaps that will be the tipping point factor that makes this idea viable.
 

cheers

 

Ben A.

[BernardTPM]

2 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

Rather a different concept!

Lets be clear passenger TOCs are NOT in the business of carrying parcels - space is needed for fare paying passengers who pay far more than a bunch of parcels.

Yes, different concept. BR was making use of spare space in existing stock to create an extra income flow. But 100mph parcels trains are hardly a new idea and the conversions are pretty much the same as a Cl.325. Good luck to them though.

[Titan]

2 hours ago, black and decker boy said:

We still have a shortage of HGV drivers in the U.K. 

 

 

Or to put it another way, HGV drivers are so badly paid that there are plenty of other jobs that pay better for less stress.  If the companies were prepared to pay more then the shortage would disappear... 

Edited July 2, 2021 by Titan

[Zomboid]

8 hours ago, jools1959 said:

As a trial, I’m hoping that it’s successful but I feel more work needs to be done on the unit, such as remove the sliding doors and replace with roller ones, seal up the windows to make it more secure and adapt the interior to accept road transport standard trailer cages

If it is a success then there might be scope to make bigger changes to the trains, but as a proof of concept there's no need to plate over the windows.

[black and decker boy]

A timely article from BBC

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57690505

[DY444]

In theory this sort of thing is a good idea however I suspect it will suffer from the usual problems of lack of paths and lack of platform capacity and road vehicle accessibility at termini (where most that had it now don't). 

 

Also most of the talk surrounds the destination city centre termini but you've also got to consider the origin warehouses.  If you've got to ship by road to the nearest suitable station (which might be 30 miles away) then it's very tempting just to continue to do the whole thing by road.  I have no detailed knowledge as to the exact reasons Railnet failed but I've often suspected the relative convenience of moving time sensitive mail from say Mount Pleasant to Euston, St.Pancras or Paddington compared with the hassle of getting to Stonebridge Park might have played a part in its demise.

 

Despite all the net zero talk the Government is doing very little to encourage modal shift and until it does the bottom line will always beat mission statements about reduced emissions.  Failing to invest in electrification and putting the onus on rolling stock providers to solve the problem with bimodes, batteries or bionic duckweed increases leasing and ownership costs compared with a bog standard emu and that is going to negatively affect the viability of these kinds of schemes.

[ess1uk]

Nice idea but I can’t see it working 

[Reorte]

2 hours ago, DY444 said:

In theory this sort of thing is a good idea however I suspect it will suffer from the usual problems of lack of paths and lack of platform capacity and road vehicle accessibility at termini (where most that had it now don't).

Road access might definitely be one. Could the paths and platforms be available at night though? (would engineering make that non-viable?)

[phil-b259]

11 hours ago, Revolution Ben said:

 

I hadn't realised there was a shortage of HGV drivers.  Perhaps that will be the tipping point factor that makes this idea viable.

 

cheers

 

Ben A.

 

For years the UK has had a shortage of home grown HGV drivers - until a certain event beginning with B happened that hole was being filled by drivers from Eastern Europe.

 

 

 

However, before anyone starts celebrating - lorry driving as with crop picking tends to not be seen as an attractive job for Brits with people simply shunning such jobs so don't expect the gap to be fixed anytime soon.

 

You combine that with an increased focus on air quality in our cities (poor air quality has gone down on a Coroners report as causing the death of a child in London), plus the growth in 'man in a van' type of parcel drops fuelled by the likes of Amazon and an opportunity has presented itself.

 

As with most freight these days however the devil will be in the detail. Unreliable service or difficulties in transferring parcels to local agents for drop off will still have the potential to wreck the idea.

 

Also, as with Supermarkets using rail,  people should note that its only going to work between major centres of population and may end up being restricted to just a few routes. The WCML axis London - Daventry - North West - Scotland being the most likely to work financially.

Edited July 2, 2021 by phil-b259

[phil-b259]

9 hours ago, Titan said:

 

 

Or to put it another way, HGV drivers are so badly paid that there are plenty of other jobs that pay better for less stress.  If the companies were prepared to pay more then the shortage would disappear... 

 

Actually they are not!

 

While some cowboys do exist the shortage of drivers has seen many large logistics companies raise their game pay wise with most well in excess of UK minimum wage rates reflecting that it is a skilled ocupation.

 

The bigger problem is the way a large section of British society see such manual tasks as being 'beneath them' and not a worthwhile job for a Brit to be doing. In effect they all want to be bosses and employ someone else to do the hard work.

 

We have seen this in the farming sector - wages well above UK minimums are simply not attracting UK people to apply for crop picking (or those that do jacking it in after one day) to replace those not coming as result of Brexit.

 

Its not a new phenomenon - culturally the upper echelons of UK society has always been keen to exploit others - be it Irish, Empire, Commonwealth nations to do the hard work and perhaps its no surprise that several decades of economic policy designed to empower folk (home ownership, pushing a share ownership, developing property, etc) has magnified the problem and the 'we are superior' attitude amongst most Brits.

 

This is not helped by an over focus on the 'I want to be famous / on telly / an influencer / etc' attitudes being pedalled by the media across the land which undervalues proper manual work in favour of what is in effect 'get rich quick' approach.

Edited July 2, 2021 by phil-b259

[phil-b259]

11 hours ago, Revolution Ben said:

 

This feels like a similar concept to the ROG Orion project.

 

 

It is

 

However I think the ROG project has the edge because they are using bi / tri mode 319s so will have a bit more flexibility than the electric only 321

[pete_mcfarlane]

26 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

As with most freight these days however the devil will be in the detail. Unreliable service or difficulties in transferring parcels to local agents for drop off will still have the potential to wreck the idea.

IIRC Red Star was killed off by post-Hatfield unreliability. Which is a shame, as it filled a useful niche.

 

i can see this working. The logstics of getting goods from trains to road vehicles shouldn't be a massive problem. If the goods are in wheeled cages, then pretty much every major station these days has step free access to the platforms for wheelchair users, so it's just a case of moving the cages to the lorry via the lift. The vans/lorries can potentially park outside the station entrance, as the whole thing is happening overnight or very early in the morning so they won't be obstructing anyone. The only potential challenge is the amount of labour needed to push the cages around, so you might end up with staff travelling with the train to do the unloading. 

 

[Barclay]

It's a great idea and I hope it works out, good for the environment and a superb way to re-use trains that are being replaced by new stock, but.... having travelled on these units since their introduction I think the one word I would not use to describe them is 'classic' ! Parcels will be less fussy I hope.

[Revolution Ben]

1 hour ago, phil-b259 said:

 

It is

 

However I think the ROG project has the edge because they are using bi / tri mode 319s so will have a bit more flexibility than the electric only 321

 

Hi there,

 

Yes, that makes sense.  I suppose if the High Speed parcels concept starts to fly, the Eversholt Breeze project may make the 321s more attractive for similar reasons...

 

cheers

 

Ben A.

[black and decker boy]

Internal shots here

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/paul_rail/status/1410595643827965958

[highpeakman]

3 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

 

 

 

While some cowboys do exist the shortage of drivers has seen many large logistics companies raise their game pay wise with most well in excess of UK minimum wage rates reflecting that it is a skilled ocupation.

 

 

I thought that this would be a good career move for my son a few years back but we found that obtaining an HGV licence was a major issue as we couldn't find any local transport companies willing to give any on the job training. They only wanted HGV licenced employees. So, while I was willing to pay for a training course for him, taking that course would have meant giving up the job he already had because the training period was so long plus he would have to travel a long distance every day to get to the course. As he had a young family he was unwilling to take the risk of losing the job he had. 

 

He has since got a job as a delivery driver for a car parts company so is now driving fair distances but in a large van.

 

We felt, at the time that the transport industry wasn't doing enough to support and train new drivers and maybe that is still the case.