Dimensions of Dearborn Station train shed roof?

[webbcompound]

Anyone on here know the dimensions of the Chicago Dearborn Station train shed roof? I've tried asking on an ATSF discussion board but got no reply. Or if not how about any of the Chicago train sheds?

[long island jack]

Have a read, there some size in text 

https://www.american-rails.com/dearborn.html

Edited July 2, 2021 by long island jack

[mdvle]

The Library of Congress (LOC) and the Sanborn Fire Maps are potentially your friend - if what you want is old enough.

 

The LOC has Sanborn maps (and a lot of other stuff as well) online to view from about 1925 and earlier (aka they are out of copyright).

 

Dearborn Station can be found in Volume 1 of the Chicago, Cook County Sanborn Maps - sheet 82

https://www.loc.gov/resource/g4104cm.g01790190601S/?sp=83&r=-0.465,0,1.638,1.149,0

 

(in general, Google search of LOC Sanborn Map <location> will list anything if it exists)

[webbcompound]

3 hours ago, long island jack said:

Have a read, there some size in text 

https://www.american-rails.com/dearborn.html

thanks Mr Jack. I had this info, but it only gives a size for the head end buildings. I'm trying to find (or work out) the height of the roof. I have an early  plan (which may not be entirely accurate for my time-slot) so using the dimensions of the head end building I can get a possible approximation of the length. I want to make a roof as part of my plan for the Union Station at Fort Dearborn (slight diversion along the time line means it isn't called Chicago, and the group of companies using the station aren't the same as the groups of companies using the various stations in Chicago). Basically I want to run my choice of streamliners and heavyweight consists circa 1938-42

[webbcompound]

9 minutes ago, mdvle said:

The Library of Congress (LOC) and the Sanborn Fire Maps are potentially your friend - if what you want is old enough.

Thanks for this info mdvle. Excellent stuff. I'll have to see if I can access it from the UK, or if not via a VPN. Unfortunately maps and plans won't give me the height of the roof, which is what I will need to simulate it.

[mdvle]

7 minutes ago, webbcompound said:

Thanks for this info mdvle. Excellent stuff. I'll have to see if I can access it from the UK, or if not via a VPN. Unfortunately maps and plans won't give me the height of the roof, which is what I will need to simulate it.

 

LOC should be available worldwide (I'm not in the US).

 

The Fire Maps have a lot of miscellaneous information on them - the purpose was for setting insurance rates - so materials used will often be noted.

 

For example, looking at the map the left side of the train shed has a note that appears to say "brick wall 10' high" which may help with getting measurements from photos.

Edited July 2, 2021 by mdvle

[APOLLO]

Some good photos on the web to help Guestimate

 

 

 

 

 

A great station to model, 

 

Brit15

[APOLLO]

Couple more

 

 

 

 

 

Never seen this before !!

 

 

Hope they are of use.

 

Brit15

[mdvle]

11 hours ago, webbcompound said:

thanks Mr Jack. I had this info, but it only gives a size for the head end buildings. I'm trying to find (or work out) the height of the roof. I have an early  plan (which may not be entirely accurate for my time-slot) so using the dimensions of the head end building I can get a possible approximation of the length. I want to make a roof as part of my plan for the Union Station at Fort Dearborn (slight diversion along the time line means it isn't called Chicago, and the group of companies using the station aren't the same as the groups of companies using the various stations in Chicago). Basically I want to run my choice of streamliners and heavyweight consists circa 1938-42

 

Just throwing this out there to provide ideas for you or anyone else with no expectation that it will change your current plans.

 

You mentioned other Chicago stations, the one I am most familiar (which isn't much) is the Rock Island's LaSalle Street Station, which like so many North American stations had a very low roof:

 

https://marmarinou.tumblr.com/post/177329384639/rock-island-lasalle-street-station-by

 

Somewhat better (because half the roof is missing - the bankrupt Rock Island being unable to fix it so removed it) again showing very little clearance - last picture on page

http://www.trainweb.org/rshs/VRP LaSalle Street Station.htm

 

Or this 1911 photo of C&NW in Chicago

https://www.shorpy.com/node/9755

 

They were dark/gloomy places and really weren't much taller than a double decker passenger car (to the extent that in Toronto they aren't sure how they will provide overhead electric lines for electrification).

 

The problem is that they really aren't very conductive to model railroads - they hide the trains from view and need to be engineered with the roof being removable in case anything happens with the trains.

 

Anyone wanting a more model friendly design, and not trying necessarily to model a specific station, might find the designs used in Detroit (GTW) and Buffalo (NYC) where only the platforms were covered and the tracks exposed more to their liking:

 

Buffalo - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_Central_Terminal#/media/File:PC_4272_with_the_Buffalo_Day_Express_at_Buffalo_Central_Terminal,_July_1969.jpg

 

Detroit (Brush Street) - https://www.flickr.com/photos/railphotoart/30237062251

 

This drawing (Detroit's Michigan Central Station train shed cross section) gives somewhat typical track and platform spacing widths of the early to mid 1900's train stations

https://www.flickr.com/photos/ashtonpar/3966786241/in/photostream/

 

 

[webbcompound]

Ah, but this assumes that the train shed is the actual station. I'm using the Dearborn shed, and the pre-rebuild  Union Station layout. Although this is a terminus the tracks go right through the station, and trains can be longer than the shed. I don't have room for full length trains in H0, so all you will see is the front end of arriving trains, with locos detaching and shifters moving head-end cars; and the back of trains dragged in by shifters before departing;, (because this is an old train shed the trains are longer than the shed), the end of the shed is a vision block, and the roof is removable, covering the casette fiddle yard when there is no running. Or at least that is the idea.