Bachmann announce NEW Class 47

[Ron Ron Ron]

Will the Class 66 be the next loco to get this treatment by Bachmann?

A once plentiful selection of liveries ever year and a big seller, Bachmann have cut back to just a couple of batches over the last 12 months or more.

The interest and excitement generated, preceding the arrival of the first Hattons releases, indicates the desire for and popularity of higher spec models, now borne out by the reception for this new Class 47.

 

 

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[Ron Ron Ron]

22 minutes ago, The 158 Man said:

My Local said end of November...but not which year. 

I thought that stale joke had long outlived it’s usefulness, ………as of nearly 2 years, since Bachmann changed its release strategy’?

 

 

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[Chris56057]

12 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

I thought that stale joke had long outlived it’s usefulness, ………as of nearly 2 years, since Bachmann changed its release strategy’?

 

 

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I think November is probably achievable, looking forward to these. 

[Ron Ron Ron]

3 minutes ago, Chris56057 said:

I think November is probably achievable, looking forward to these. 

 

November is within the maximum time window of 3 months from announcement, that Bachmann now aims to get new releases into the shops by.

 

 

 

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[DY444]

On 03/08/2021 at 15:00, luke_stevens said:

 

Wow! I threw the cat amongst the pigeons with that comment, didn't I? It certainly wasn't international...

 

 

I don't believe I've ever complained about how long things are talking to arrive. Having had some experience of manufacturing I know schedules can be variable and are apt to slide. Maybe it is just time for some balance from "things are arriving too slow" to "things are arriving too fast"? No delivery schedule will suit everyone. 

 

I approach my modelling by trying to be responsible with my purchases and budgeting. I am happy to accept that there will always be things I would "like" but won't be able to afford / budget for. I do hope we're not moving to a point were we can't express "disappointment" with the actions of a a manufacture? I was under the impression that polite feedback was positive. I'm not saying I will never buy from Bachmann again, or that I will post snotty reviews, or that they are crazy. I just pointed out that Bachmann's change of policy form the start of this year does not suite everybody; a justified view i would have thought.

 

Most manufactures announcements give time to "plan", "prepare" and "save": all good habits. This allows the customer to choose what they are going to commit to. Short notice announcing lessen that choice by change it to deciding what to cancel. 

 

Spoilt brats would be "I want it all and I want it NOW". My approach is more "I want to be allowed time to make my choice. 

Luke

 

I'm sorry but I still don't understand your problem here.  If you've watched the video and read the Guv'nor's write up then two things will be apparent; firstly Bachmann have spent a fortune on this from which they'll want a return, and secondly the initial releases only feature a fraction of the prototype variations which they've designed into the tooling.  Then there's the vast number of potential liveries.  It would take a month of Sundays to attempt to list the variants not present in the first batch but the various styles of eth in BR Blue is an obvious one ultimately covering roughly half the class at one point before LL and sector liveries kicked in.  Ergo there will be numerous periodic releases over a few years.

 

So if, as you claim, this is not about wanting it now then do what you normally do.  Save up and buy from a later batch.  Problem solved.

Edited August 7, 2021 by DY444

[frobisher]

7 hours ago, maico said:

German Trix used to make British outline N gauge, an A3 and Mk1 coaches. A dated product that Marklin dropped in 1999 after buying Trix.

 

You're being somewhat disingenuous to the Minitrix UK line there which was one of the pioneers of UK N gauge through its various distributors (Peco, Hornby and Bachmann).

[frobisher]

7 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Theres at least 2 other EU manufacturers that have anecdotally been linked to a UK retailer comission, and another to a UK manufacturer in the last few years.

 

Roco manufacture Bachmann UK's set track for them, for reasons not entirely unrelated to Roco no longer manufacturing Hornby's set track since production of that was moved to China 

[Paul.Uni]

2 hours ago, Chris56057 said:

Getting back on to the topic of the new Bachmann 47... 

 

Do we know when these will be hitting the shops? I've seen November/December quoted on the Kernow site...

https://www.Bachmann.co.uk/category/bra/autumn-2021

[Dunsignalling]

12 hours ago, maico said:

 

I've got a Fleischmann Warship with Mk1 coaches, it's Ho. The connection of course is the prototype was of German lineage. These days Fleischmann is only N gauge after Roco bought the company.

German Trix used to make British outline N gauge, an A3 and Mk1 coaches. A dated product that Marklin dropped in 1999 after buying Trix.

Hornby owned Lima, Jouef are out of the equation so of the larger established brands that leaves Kato...

LS Models make excellent coaches in China but I can't see them taking on Bachmann or Hornby even though their product is better it's more expensive.

 

The Fleischmann Warship was neither 3.5mm or 4mm scale, IIRC, some dimensions were one, some the other.

 

It was too close to OO for those who wanted HO , and too close to HO for established OO users. That's why it and their equally nice, but similarly compromised, Bulleid coaches didn't take the UK market by storm.  

 

Somebody else (or was that Fleischmann too?) made a similar faux pas with a parallel-boiler Royal Scot and LMS coaches around the same time. 

 

The continental makers clearly didn't understand the concept of OO back then. Unless that's changed,  there'd be a danger of history repeating itself. However, I think there may be a view that the UK r-t-r market is too price-sensitive to bother with. If not, why haven't they had a go at N where the competition is a lot less cut-throat, since the days of Minitrix. 

 

Of course, Heljan have proved catering for us can be done successfully, even if their initial idea was HO evangelism.   

 

John

Edited August 7, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[Ron Ron Ron]

2 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

......The continental makers clearly didn't understand the concept of OO back then. Unless that's changed,  there'd be a danger of history repeating itself. .......

 

Wasn't that over 40 years ago?

Why would it be repeated today, in a different world, with a different, more developed and demanding RTR market and with all the advances in manufacturing technology?

 

That's like saying Ford got certain things wrong on the Cortina and wondering if there's a danger of a repeat on their next new model....50 years on.

 

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[newbryford]

8 hours ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

Will the Class 66 be the next loco to get this treatment by Bachmann?

A once plentiful selection of liveries ever year and a big seller, Bachmann have cut back to just a couple of batches over the last 12 months or more.

The interest and excitement generated, preceding the arrival of the first Hattons releases, indicates the desire for and popularity of higher spec models, now borne out by the reception for this new Class 47.

 

 

.

 

I think it's very unlikely given that Hattons have intimated another run in an article in Hornby Magazine - with the design/QC issues noted and hopefully sorted on the next batch.

 

Personally, I think the Hattons 66 is a great model (axlebox/QC considered) and would be difficult to improve upon.

 

Going further O/T - one loco that never seems to get a "we want a retooled version" is the Hornby 60. Still up there with the best of today's new releases apart from Hornby persisting with the 8-pin plug.

Edited August 7, 2021 by newbryford

[Michael Hodgson]

I think it was Rivarossi at about 3.8 mm/foot who made the Scot and LMS coaches

Edited August 7, 2021 by Michael Hodgson

[Dunsignalling]

25 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

 

Wasn't that over 40 years ago?

Why would it be repeated today, in a different world, with a different, more developed and demanding RTR market and with all the advances in manufacturing technology?

 

That's like saying Ford got certain things wrong on the Cortina and wondering if there's a danger of a repeat on their next new model....50 years on.

 

.

Perhaps, but mixing scales the way they did was pretty obviously a mistake, even back then. Presumably they were trying to make a HO Warship but it came out too narrow to go over the existing V200 mechanism so they widened it  but weren't willing to make a longer mechanism to keep everything in proportion.

 

There has to be some reason why (Heljan apart) none of the big names from mainland Europe hasn't had another go at making stuff for the UK market in all that time.

 

Could simply be, of course that they're doing perfectly OK with their day job and they don't have spare capacity they need to find a use for....

 

John

Edited August 7, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[Chris56057]

24 minutes ago, newbryford said:

 

I think it's very unlikely given that Hattons have intimated another run in an article in Hornby Magazine - with the design/QC issues noted and hopefully sorted on the next batch.

 

Personally, I think the Hattons 66 is a great model (axlebox/QC considered) and would be difficult to improve upon.

 

Going further O/T - one loco that never seems to get a "we want a retooled version" is the Hornby 60. Still up there with the best of today's new releases apart from Hornby persisting with the 8-pin plug.

What issue was this in? Did they specify when the next production run would take place?

[newbryford]

31 minutes ago, Chris56057 said:

What issue was this in? Did they specify when the next production run would take place?

See the Hattons 66 thread.

[irishmail]

1 hour ago, newbryford said:

 

I think it's very unlikely given that Hattons have intimated another run in an article in Hornby Magazine - with the design/QC issues noted and hopefully sorted on the next batch.

 

Personally, I think the Hattons 66 is a great model (axlebox/QC considered) and would be difficult to improve upon.

 

Going further O/T - one loco that never seems to get a "we want a retooled version" is the Hornby 60. Still up there with the best of today's new releases apart from Hornby persisting with the 8-pin plug.

Just out of curiosity, what is wrong with the 8-pin plug?

[newbryford]

1 minute ago, irishmail said:

Just out of curiosity, what is wrong with the 8-pin plug?

 

Limited to only three physical function outputs - Usually used for 2x directional lights and sometimes cab lights. 

No direct speaker connections.

 

 

 

[Ron Ron Ron]

3 hours ago, irishmail said:

Just out of curiosity, what is wrong with the 8-pin plug?

 

As newbryford says above, too limited for auxiliary function outputs.

That may be OK on the fairly basic British outline steam locos, but it's far from ideal for D&E if we are to have properly independent lighting and the possibility of additional working features.

Very few European continental mainland locos are now available with 8-pin sockets and virtually no new releases have had then for a good few years.

They're fading fast in N. American models too.

 

 

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[gordon1970]

On 03/08/2021 at 15:58, adb968008 said:

There was a Large Logo 47/7  cat 31-665 and a blue 47435 cat 32-807 still outstanding, but noticed they seem to have gone today from the website.

 

I was thinking Bachmann had been quiet on 47’s for a while.

 

Watching the video, they really seem to have upped their game on detail, it looks very attractive indeed, its a very impressive stack of detail and range of configuration options.. all of a sudden renumbering a 47 and swapping fuel tanks around got a whole lot more complicated !

 

Lets see what they announce.

First impressions of the New 47 are - Excellent! Perhaps a bit pricier than I would like, but, what isn't sneaking up in price.

As for 31-665 and 32-807, Rails Cancelled my pre-order for the former in February after Bachmann told them it had been pulled from Production. A few days later Bachmann told them it hadn't been so the pre-order was re-instated. Frustrating as a buyer not to get a loco I was eagerly anticipating (Here is hoping the range of 47s expands with some 47/4s in BR Blue and of course 47711 and other shove duffs.... - however I can't help feel Bachmann have pulled the above mentioned stuff - not cricket to muck prospective customers about with announcements of models they must know aren't happening not to mention mucking retailers about with pre orders. (Assuming they have cancelled the above models)

[PJ10]

Morning Gordon1970,

 

Bachmann mentioned in the video of the Autumn announcement that both 47711 and 47435 will be produced next year using the new tooling. Like you I've been waiting for both for some time so its good news they still plan to be produced.

 

I feel that with a significant investment to recoup, Bachmann will most likely be producing class 47 models regularly over the next few years. Fingers crossed for lots more BR Blue and Large Logo.

 

PJ10

[TomScrut]

13 hours ago, irishmail said:

Just out of curiosity, what is wrong with the 8-pin plug?

 

In an ideal world, other lighting functions aside (such as cab and engine bay etc) we would have 8 functions for end lighting on most OO locos, front markers, rear markers, day headlights and night headlights on each end. That needs a lot more than 4 pins (which is all is left on an 8 pin after motor and pickups).

 

The aforementioned Hattons 66 has 10 lighting functions, the 8 mentioned above and 2 cab lights.

 

I am pleased that the manufacturers (other than Hornby) are now recognising the importance of lighting.

 

When something is going around the layout, the lights are about the most obvious thing about the loco, and is definitely more noticeable than tiny details in practice.

 

I am guessing this loco will have 3 lighting functions at each end as it also has an engine room light which would mean the most end lighting features it could have is 6 to work with a Loksound V5 which is 10 function, but I presume a 47 doesn't have day/night modes on the lighting?

Edited August 8, 2021 by TomScrut

[55020]

The new tooling has potentially saved us from having a model of 47711 in LL livery with the incorrect headlamp.  It was only once painted in Scotrail livery was it modified with a high intensity light, prior to that it carried a Scottish style car headlamp.

 

Hopefully Bachmann get it right with the new tooling and the 47/7 EP in the video is destined to be a different model.

[PJ10]

1 minute ago, 55020 said:

The new tooling has potentially saved us from having a model of 47711 in LL livery with the incorrect headlamp.  It was only once painted in Scotrail livery was it modified with a high intensity light, prior to that it carried a Scottish style car headlamp.

 

Hopefully Bachmann get it right with the new tooling and the 47/7 EP in the video is destined to be a different model.

Thats my hope too. I'm sure i heard in the new tooling announcement that the tooling allowed for the Scottish style.

 

PJ10 

[rob D2]

It's a shame people have to wait for a LL 47 of plain 47/4 but I'm sure end result will be worth it 

 

[Max Legroom]

I’m considering 47012 with a view to renumbering as a ScR 47/0, ideally an Eastfield machine, but I have to admit that my knowledge of 47s is limited. I think the Brush built locos are 47001-16, 96-191 and 212-261 so this has thrown up 47120, 141 and 149 as possibilities. Is there anything else I need to consider, e.g. boiler panels on the roof?