EFE Adams O2 tank.

[melmerby]

A slightly peripheral annoyance.

You can't put the loco back in the packing with couplings fitted. This the first time I've ever seen that and rather stupid IMHO.

[Butler Henderson]

10 hours ago, melmerby said:

A slightly peripheral annoyance.

You can't put the loco back in the packing with couplings fitted. This the first time I've ever seen that and rather stupid IMHO.

Can the packaging be trimmed - I have often done so to get a loco back in its packaging with detail parts fitted or in the case of the Hornby T9 so that the tender can remain coupled.

[Nile]

Just noticed that #182 is missing some lamp irons from the smokebox, unless this was a feature of the real thing.

[melmerby]

5 hours ago, Nile said:

Just noticed that #182 is missing some lamp irons from the smokebox, unless this was a feature of the real thing.

Mine is missing the nearside one at the front. doesn't appear to have any position for the smokebox ones.

It has a full compliment at the rear

[kebwight]

The DJM/EFE O2 is a lovely model, despite the inaccuracies I have outlined previously, a little bit finesse in manufacture could have turned this model from "OK" to "spectacular".  In my view, the brake gear is a bit "heavy" too. As I live on the IOW and grew up with the O2's in service here, I feel what we have here is a 'near miss'.

 

 

 

[JohnR]

I see Sam's Trains run of bad luck is continuing. 

[MattA]

13 hours ago, JohnR said:

I see Sam's Trains run of bad luck is continuing. 

aka "run of models that aren't Hornby" - I can't take Sam seriously when he keeps dunking on pretty much any manufacturer except Hornby and Hattons

Edited August 22, 2021 by MattA

[Opelsi]

Very happy with my Southern Olive Green one.

No problem with colour variations, green application appears uniform in daylight and under daylight florescent lighting condition.

Ran in on DC on rolling road.

Fitted with Zimo MX617N and programmed with ECoS - all really good!

 

[andyram]

On 20/08/2021 at 01:37, samfieldhouse said:

 

Yes sadly mine does. I'll be at the IOW next weekend for an event so will return/replace it and see if it's the whole batch, or just a few that are affected.

I'm not on board with it being prototypical - there is no gap between the tanks and the running plate on the real loco. The model is warped 

 

I think the warping shown in your photos is severe when compared to the others I have observed.

[PaulRhB]

1 hour ago, col.stephens said:

 

To be fair, the loco he tested was pretty dire as regards performance. 

The thing is though he should return it and see if it’s true of the replacement too to get a better idea. I guess the rush to be first with reviews colours this aspect though. 
I mentioned early on I’d had minor issues with my original ones but so far the new ones have been perfect and much quieter. I suspect there’s something about the design that means a slight defect in a part or assembly can cause binding somewhere. I’m tempted to strip and attempt to totally fettle my original one now that I have the option of parts from the EFE run if I muck it up. 
I’ve had a similar issue with a German 2-10-2 where three run perfectly but one continued to run like a dog despite sending it back three times to Germany and stripping checking and re-assembling myself as well until it was finally replaced. If that had been my only one it would get a poor review!

[atom3624]

If I had been a manufacturer providing a demo locomotive, I would have been seriously embarrassed, looking at the video.

I believe he purchased it as you or I would do normally, so it was pot luck, and it basically stalled - contacts, whatever nearly every time, amongst the other shortcomings.

It was a fair review IMHO.

Al.

[spamcan61]

12 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

The thing is though he should return it and see if it’s true of the replacement too to get a better idea. I guess the rush to be first with reviews colours this aspect though. 
I mentioned early on I’d had minor issues with my original ones but so far the new ones have been perfect and much quieter. I suspect there’s something about the design that means a slight defect in a part or assembly can cause binding somewhere. I’m tempted to strip and attempt to totally fettle my original one now that I have the option of parts from the EFE run if I muck it up. 
I’ve had a similar issue with a German 2-10-2 where three run perfectly but one continued to run like a dog despite sending it back three times to Germany and stripping checking and re-assembling myself as well until it was finally replaced. If that had been my only one it would get a poor review!

To me the fundamental challenge with modern short production run  toy trains is that there is unlikely to be a business case to expend the considerable extra time/effort/money required to make the design assembly error proof. Poka-Yoke and all that. Combine this with the desire to outsource design and manufacture to third/fourth parties on the other side of the planet and the challenges get bigger.

 

Hence we see time and time again new products where some are clearly wrong 'uns and some are perfect. Then there's different people's different expectations to deal with.

 

I wouldn't fancy being a toy train 'manufacturer'

Edited August 22, 2021 by spamcan61

[Butler Henderson]

To expect every mass produced product to be perfect is unrealistic given the often sample testing that takes place rather than every one and to what extent that testing may be - seems to me all a model loco is asked to if tested is run up and down a straight length of track rather than round 2nd radius curve and over dead frog points which would show up pick up issues. If a loco does not perform right get it exchanged  which is what the irritant should have done and then video a decent runner

[atom3624]

If I were 'in the market' for one, which I'm not, I must admit there's little in the video to inspire me to purchase one.

Appearance at many angles and distances was very good, others pretty, erm, dire.

Performance was unacceptable.  True, the supplier should have been contacted for consideration to return, replace, refund.

Al.

[Kaput]

I generally like Sam's videos as a decent idea of the quality of a model (with limitations due his own personal bias towards certain things) but I really wish he'd actually stop reviewing obviously faulty models and get them replaced first. If the replacement is just as rubbish then mention that in the review.

[Legend]

5 hours ago, MattA said:

aka "run of models that aren't Hornby" - I can't take Sam seriously when he keeps dunking on pretty much any manufacturer except Hornby and Hattons

That’s not true and suspect posted without seeing this actual review . He compares it to the Bachmann 1P an 0-4-4 T at the same price and makes comparisons .  I think the Bachmann 1P is currently no 1 on his leader board , while the Hornby 66 is last , so hardly someone who thinks everything Hornby is brilliant . His views on the Hornby A2 verify this . 
 

I think he makes a series of good points on this model . The slop in the drive is one of them with the back axle rotating ahead of the front one causing the plastic coupling rod to tilt up . This is a feature of the all geared drive on the loco . The difficulty of getting into the mechanism , in fact he can’t , is also pointed out . 
 

As to sending it back as being defective , is it? It’s not obvious , I mean the model runs , maybe this is just the way the model is . I didn’t see anything obviously defective . 
 

So I’d actually watch what he says before being too dismissive . 

[woodenhead]

I watched the Sam video too, he actually made some good points about the chassis design and his price comparison was spot on.

 

The price point I imagine is because there are extra people in the chain on an EFE model - so in addition to Bachmann and the retailer you have the original manufacturer be it Kernow, Heljan or whoever who will also need their cut from sales otherwise what is the point in them licensing these items to Bachmann.

 

I've two of the original 02s from Kernow, they ran fine for what I required and I am happy with both of them, and my Well Tanks but I get Sam's point about the difficulty in getting inside to clean them after a few years use.

 

I don't agree with his comments on the fitting of the DCC chip, I'll give DJM credit it made it easier at the time than taking the body off (because you cannot) and Dapol have since improved on this as have other manufacturers - Accurascale for example with their lift off rooves.  The new 02 from EFE is a re-run so I would not expect to see changes from how DJM designed it, you may as well have just started over than do that.

[Compound2632]

3 hours ago, Willoughby Glen said:

I think Sams video hits on the nail, the pulling power is not good,as previous pages have already pointed out in this thread.  Must admit I am seriously contemplating sending mine back.

 

There must be room for some lead in the smokebox and forward end of the tanks?

[melmerby]

3 hours ago, Willoughby Glen said:

 it cant pull prototypical length formations.

 

What do you call prototypical length trains?

 

BTW the Hattons 48XX, the Dapol 43XX, the Bachmann 2251 and others also can't pull prototypical length trains

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

There must be room for some lead in the smokebox and forward end of the tanks?

Possibly. But is the motor up to it?

The Dapol 43XX is underweight, if you add weight to increase haulage it just slows down

[Ian Hargrave]

In this case ,the original Kernow DJM specimen had identical haulage issues so it appears to be repeating them with this rebranded one. I have a chuckle to myself as I read the above posts when I recall that when they landed several years ago,they were hailed by many on this forum as a cracking model. How the world turns. I’d be happy with gated stock or with no more than two Maunsells.That way you have a prototypical branch line train that looks right. It certainly won’t punch above its weight that’s for sure. If modelling IOW you may experience problems in attempting a serious outfit and empty stock workings out of Waterloo are beyond reach. Otherwise it’s happy pottering on with a couple of coaches in the Cornish sunshine. As regards warping then there’s no excuse.Return to sender.

 

 

[Ian Hargrave]

3 hours ago, Willoughby Glen said:

But doesn't that contradict what a review is.  In any field a review is carried out of the item you have purchased straight out of the box, not of the replacement.  If it was of a replacement and we found out after the review that they had swapped it, would we not then loose confidence in the reviewer, especially if we bought it and then found the faults seen with the first one.

As I mentioned in an earlier thread these from a distance look fab, its just let down by the issues with the front bow and more importantly the issue that it cant pull prototypical length formations.

 

Having just posted on the haulage issue,I’d  be interested in your idea of prototypical length for an O2 .

[Compound2632]

Just now, Ian Hargrave said:

Having just posted on the haulage issue,I’d  be interested in your idea of prototypical length for an O2 .

 

You mean length of train? They were built for the suburban services out of Waterloo - brisk acceleration with longish trains - equivalent passenger capacity to a pair of 4-VEPs?

[Ian Hargrave]

9 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

You mean length of train? They were built for the suburban services out of Waterloo - brisk acceleration with longish trains - equivalent passenger capacity to a pair of 4-VEPs?

Thanks for that. And that’s fair enough,you’ve answered the question. History is obviously repeating itself ,this time under a new label. To expect it to perform to as built specification is shall we say unrealistic I’m afraid. 
 

 What other 0-4-4 tank models in rtr  can come close to prototypical performance straight out of the box  ? The new Bachmann Midland 2P is held as an acceptable performer ,though I have not tested it myself. Hornby’s M7 isn’t particularly good and needs fettling. I’m not suggesting that perfection isn’t possible but maybe there are constraints in manufacturing such in 4mm form .

[Ian Hargrave]

18 minutes ago, Willoughby Glen said:

On the Isle of Wight, Newport to Ventnor trains were 6 coaches

And IIRC I believe we heard complaints about the IOW version first time round.