Component positions around the layout

[Michaelaface]

This may be a bit of a dumb question, but just looking for thoughts and advice on where to put all the DCC components on my layout (command station, block detection, accessory decoders, etc)

as it stands, I have my command station next to the fiddle yard, as it has the largest amount of dropper wires for power, and I try to keep all the other components the shortest distance from where they are relevant, so I have 3 boards around the layout next to each junction with a DCC concepts ads-8fx for points and a digikeijs 4088 for block detection, and anything else that section, everything works fine, but I am getting a little irritated with the wiring getting a little busy, and having these boards all over the place, and accessibility is hindered at times, with it being awkward to check things, or these control boards getting in the way

now I've noticed that on a lot of larger DCC layouts (my layout is 3.5m by 3.5m roundy) all the DCC equipment seems to be in one place (server cabinet style kinda thing), so basically I was wondering whats the best way to go about wiring everything, so it still functions properly, but with neatness and accessibility as the key

Should I move all the components into one place, or will the distance of the wires, to point motors etc, become too long and affect performance

[WIMorrison]

Block detectors should be place as close as possible to where they are being used to minimise the length of the wires and thus reduce crosstalk. 
 

The loconet/XpressNet/can/etc cables can be much longer and will not suffer from the crosstalk

[Michaelaface]

so basically, leave as is and I just need to rethink how I've placed them

[KingEdwardII]

I place most of my components out around the layout close to the places their outputs are used. This usually minimises the wiring, although my latest acquisition, the CMME 16-way servo controller, gives me a bit of a headache in that I use it to drive servos for semaphores and the signals are scattered around the layout, resulting in some long wire runs. So, the CMME controller is excellent from a cost perspective, but having a large number of outputs in one location has its drawbacks in terms of wiring runs.

 

By contrast, the 8 channel Digikeijs DR4018 units that I use for point motors are just about right and I only have one long cable run of over 2 metres.

 

Yours,  Mike.

[Alan Kettlewell]

I too follow the suggested practice of grouping the modules around the layout where the wiring can be kept to a minimum.  I've attached some of my 'planning diagrammes' for my latest 0 gauge layout I'm building.  You might make out I'm setting up five small  'boards' each consisting of a turnout module, a feedback module and a switch module for electro-magnets. 

 

Each board is positioned to be close to the components they operate.  I should add that, as these boards do not need any interaction once they are set up, they are positioned just under the front edge of the layout - out of sight but easily accessible should I need to work on them later.    

 

Notes:

These are for planning purposes, the actual wires don't run dead straight as shown.  (Sorry, had to say that in case some smarty-pants picked up on it ...lol). 

The blue arrows are just there to indicate where the support legs and cross members  are - used to ensure turnout motor positions don't clash with the supports.      

This is not a portable layout.

 

 

Good luck with your project.

 

Cheers ... Alan

 

[melmerby]

The command stations and handsets etc are away from the actual layout but everything else is on the underside of the baseboard as close as possible to where they are required, with a few longish runs to a module from more distant points, blocks etc.

It is cluttered as there are lots of blocks (over 100) and points (more than 50) to control.

 

[Michaelaface]

thank you for all the input! keeping wires to the minimum has always been preferred way of doing things, maybe too much of a minimum sometimes

another fairly daft sounding question but how do you all go about mounting these components? screwed to the bottom of baseboard? bespoke cabinets?  looking for inspiration in how to go about things here 

[RFS]

4 minutes ago, Michaelaface said:

thank you for all the input! keeping wires to the minimum has always been preferred way of doing things, maybe too much of a minimum sometimes

another fairly daft sounding question but how do you all go about mounting these components? screwed to the bottom of baseboard? bespoke cabinets?  looking for inspiration in how to go about things here 

 

I just scew mine to the underside of the baseboard. Most of these components have the necessary screw holes to do that.

[Ron Ron Ron]

5 minutes ago, Michaelaface said:

......another fairly daft sounding question but how do you all go about mounting these components? screwed to the bottom of baseboard? bespoke cabinets?  looking for inspiration in how to go about things here 

 

That's a very good question, not a daft one.

 

Most people screw their various electrical and electronic modules to the underside of their baseboards, but whether that's the best place for them, or the most sensible, is debatable.

 

A couple of the issues are installation and access (for maintenance, making changes or fault finding).

Installation  will be much easier with the boards on their sides, or upside down, but if you are trying to fit them and wire it all up upside down, it can be a real hassle.

Similarly, for access later on, if the boards cannot be turned up or over, crawling around underneath can be difficult, possibly time wasting or just a downright nuisance.

 

As an alternative, make the electronics accessible from the start and reduce under board installations to the minimum.

One method is to mount the electronics on the facia, possibly hidden behind a cover or flap arrangement of some description.

Another is to have a vertically mounted panel running underneath the board, which can either be fixed, or hinged as a drop-down flap, for access.

The vertical mounting board could be the inside of the board framing itself, if it's deep enough.

These various methods will make installation easier, but more importantly, much easier to access for fault finding, making changes, adjustments or additions and for maintenance.

 

As always, there's more than one way to skin a cat, so to speak.

 

 

.

 

[jpendle]

As my layout isn't portable I have attached all my accessory decoders and block detectors to the baseboard frames at the edges of the layout.

 

Regards,

 

John P

[melmerby]

26 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

 

That's a very good question, not a daft one.

 

As always, there's more than one way to skin a cat, so to speak.

 

My modules are all "bare bones" i.e. not cased and are screwed to a piece of ply with stand offs to allow clearance under the PCB for the soldered terminals etc.

The ply boards are then screwed to the underside of the baseboard.

There is enough clearance for me to sit on the carpet under the baseboard to work on the wiring, so not too much hassle.

They are about kitchen worktop height - 950mm, with a higher section at 1050mm.

 

I have 2 DCC busses, one for the track power via a circuit breaker to the occupancy detectors and one for the accessories, points, signals etc.

This means that only the track will go dead if something shorts it out, keeping control of the accessories

(These can both come from the same command station or as I have from two different systems)

 

Don't forget you also may need an auxillary power supply for the modules (often 15-16v AC) and feedback bus(ses) for the occupancy detectors and anything else that needs to communicate with the command station.

 

"Just two wires" DCC ain't!

Edited August 19, 2021 by melmerby

[WIMorrison]

I screw mine onto small boards and I attach the small boards to the underside using a hinge (if I have 2 modules then go onto one board) - when I need to work on them, I drop the board to a vertical position but in normal use they are pinned up horizontal and parallel to the baseboard.

[melmerby]

11 minutes ago, WIMorrison said:

I screw mine onto small boards and I attach the small boards to the underside using a hinge (if I have 2 modules then go onto one board) - when I need to work on them, I drop the board to a vertical position but in normal use they are pinned up horizontal and parallel to the baseboard.

Doesn't work so well if wires come out both sides (most of mine have)

 

Unless you turn one set back on themselves.......

[WIMorrison]

3 minutes ago, melmerby said:

Doesn't work so well if wires come out both sides (most of mine have)

 

Unless you turn one set back on themselves.......

Just takes a little bit of forethought and planning

 

You simply take all wires to the to the hinge side of the board so they fold down (and up) easily - makes it so much easier to work on than trying to work upside down.

[melmerby]

2 hours ago, WIMorrison said:

 

You simply take all wires to the to the hinge side of the board so they fold down (and up) easily - makes it so much easier to work on than trying to work upside down.

Not so sure I would want to keep flexing 1.5mm conductor wires.

Mind you I have had very little trouble since I wired my layout up, apart from having to move a few things due to modifications.

[KingEdwardII]

5 hours ago, Michaelaface said:

how do you all go about mounting these components?

In my case, I screw the components to the underside of the baseboard.

 

This means that work on the components and their related wiring is done from below looking upward. To make this comfortable for me, I use one or two bean bags on the floor and position myself on top of those to get close to the work. The main concern with this is avoiding dropping off to sleep, since it gets perhaps too comfortable . I also make sure that there is *no* soldering under the baseboards - everything is either screw fit or clamped. I keep the work under the baseboards to a minimum by pre-assembling and pre-testing everything. Once a particular component and its related wiring is installed, it tends to be left in peace.

 

I should point out that my railway room is an ex-bedroom with laminate flooring which makes it very easy to slide stuff around the floor. As a result, I have little problem getting access under any section of the layout since any stuff stored under the baseboards can be slid out of the way in seconds. If this were not the case, I suppose I would consider mounting components on hinged panels under the baseboards which could be dropped down vertically for access, but this would make the wiring a bit more complex. I've not needed to do that as yet.

 

Yours,  Mike.

[Michaelaface]

for reference here's how everything is currently set up, forgive the mess in the middle of rebuilding and just reached the wiring stage

a lot of it was improvised with whatever was on hand just to get things going, but the more I operate the layout the less happy I am with it all, also I've tried mounting things under the baseboards and I find that an absolute pain to wire up

[ISW]

8 hours ago, Michaelaface said:

also I've tried mounting things under the baseboards and I find that an absolute pain to wire up

I can turn my baseboards over to attach items to the underside (each baseboard can be removed), but for a couple of cases where this was 'difficult', I simply mounted all the bits onto a small piece of thin plywood, with 'fly leads' going off the plywood. I then screwed the plywood to the underside of the baseboard and attached the fly leads to their components.

 

The other way is to hinge a piece of plywood, attach the components and fold away when complete. It has the advantage of giving easier access later if necessary.

 

Ian

[Michaelaface]

unfortunately for a variety of reasons everything on this current layout is fixed in place, otherwise that'd be an ideal solution

here's what I've gone for in the end, this was a test but the 45 degree angle works quite nicely, so I'll be repeating it around the layout


 

[Nigelcliffe]

If its a fixed layout, then I'd be installing moving "drawers" under the layout, with the components arranged on the face of the drawer.   Cables coming off grouped and guided with enough flex in them to slide in-out.   Thus, work can be done from above, with all visible, but once done, slide away out of harms way.     

The drawer doesn't need to be anything fancy - sheet of ply running in a groove created by two bits of softwood.   

 

- Nigel

 

[RAF96]

Due to age and infirmity, along with a stick neck and vari-focal specs, working under the boards is avoided whenever possible so many of my wiring modules are mounted top-side with a suitable building or bit of infrastructure planted on top to hide them. Some thought has to go into the initial placement of these electrical bits and bobs not only to locate them fit for purpose but also for the coverup item to be believable.