What is this all about?????

[cctransuk]

I came across https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002220918204.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.14da3d12ooT6Z9&algo_pvid=910eca63-7a4e-4337-a8be-d4e6bd1d4a19&algo_exp_id=910eca63-7a4e-4337-a8be-d4e6bd1d4a19-33&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id"%3A"12000019336714187"}

 

Pricing aside - which is not cheap - what do we make of these?

 

They look good - too good to be motorless shelf ornaments.

 

Any ideas?

 

John Isherwood.

[brossard]

My suspicion is that the seller doesn't know what he's talking about.  They look to me to be pukka 00 locomotives and the price isn't bad for a proper running model.

 

A friend of mine bought a lovely Hornby pre group train pack from a US retailer who thought it was a toy train and priced it accordingly. 

 

John

[Bucoops]

Manufacturer rejects or overproduction? The seller is in China so...

[cctransuk]

9 minutes ago, brossard said:

My suspicion is that the seller doesn't know what he's talking about.  They look to me to be pukka 00 locomotives and the price isn't bad for a proper running model.

 

A friend of mine bought a lovely Hornby pre group train pack from a US retailer who thought it was a toy train and priced it accordingly. 

 

John

 

This isn't just a one-off seller, though - see https://gdmodel.aliexpress.com/store/910324060?spm=a2g0o.detail.100005.2.6fe0679fYkOo9x

 

They have, or have had, a significant proportion of the Bachmann UK range of steam locos available - all a bit mysterious, unless it's Kader selling direct.

 

John Isherwood.

[brossard]

I would have thought Kader knew better than to describe them that way. 

 

John

[Steamport Southport]

Chinese translation machine gone woof woof.

 

 

Like a dirty towpath in Manchester, I wouldn't touch that with a bargepole.....

 

 

 

 

Jason

[Kris]

Copyright knock offs. 

[Nearholmer]

I wonder if they are factory rejects, test-builds, or items from training of assembly workers.

 

The same dealer seems to supply other models that they attribute to the correct brand, just as a normal hobby shop would.

[cctransuk]

8 minutes ago, Kris said:

Copyright knock offs. 

 

Is it likely that a factory has tooled an unauthorised duplicate model for the relatively few sales that Aliexpress will generate.

 

I feel that these are probably over-production from the original tooling.

 

John Isherwood.

[melmerby]

An unusual inclusion in their gallery is the long out of production 31-831 split chassis 43XX No. 4358.

 

Maybe they are all left over split chassis, because the LMS Ivatt 2-6-2T is also split chassis (31-456)

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by melmerby

[cctransuk]

6 minutes ago, melmerby said:

An unusual inclusion in their gallery is the long out of production 31-831 split chassis 43XX No. 4358.

 

Maybe they are all left over split chassis, because the LMS Ivatt 2-6-2T is also split chassis (31-456)

 

 

Are there not more recent Bachmann models amongst those illustrated? Some of which are post the split chassis era?

 

John Isherwood.

[melmerby]

36 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

Are there not more recent Bachmann models amongst those illustrated? Some of which are post the split chassis era?

 

John Isherwood.

 

The 43XX stood out as it was one slated in to be re-tooled under Bachmann's split chassis replacement programme, which rather ground to a crawl with new locos taking precedence.

I assume it will now never happen since the Dapol release.

The other was the ivatt 2-6-2T at the top of the post.

 

Looking again, the O4 was a brand new tooling (no split chassis version), the 57XX pannier is a later solid chassis example, the Jinty is also solid chassis.

One thing in common appears to be they are all old releases and the usual culprits have sold out.

[cctransuk]

1 hour ago, melmerby said:

 

The 43XX stood out as it was one slated in to be re-tooled under Bachmann's split chassis replacement programme, which rather ground to a crawl with new locos taking precedence.

I assume it will now never happen since the Dapol release.

The other was the ivatt 2-6-2T at the top of the post.

 

Looking again, the O4 was a brand new tooling (no split chassis version), the 57XX pannier is a later solid chassis example, the Jinty is also solid chassis.

One thing in common appears to be they are all old releases and the usual culprits have sold out.

 

If there was anything there that I could justify, I might just have given it a whirl.

 

Aliexpress do offer an Ebay-style refund policy, which I have used successfully when I received an item not as described. I have also made multiple purchases which have arrived - in due course - exactly as described.

 

John Isherwood.

[melmerby]

3 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

If there was anything there that I could justify, I might just have given it a whirl.

 

Aliexpress do offer an Ebay-style refund policy, which I have used successfully when I received an item not as described. I have also made multiple purchases which have arrived - in due course - exactly as described.

 

John Isherwood.

Have you used them since the change in UK import rules?

I had used AliExpress extensively before then for component purchases (but not since) and found as you did, excellent service, with a lost in post item immediately refunded.

The biggest bind was the extremely variable delivery times with China Post economy rates, I've had from 8 days to 3 months!

[cctransuk]

Just now, melmerby said:

Have you used them since the change in UK import rules?

I had used AliExpress extensively before then for component purchases (but not since) and found as you did, excellent service, with a lost in post item immediately refunded.

The biggest bind was the extremely variable delivery times with China Post economy rates, I've had from 8 days to 3 months!

 

Not since Brexit - but I can't see why this should affect imports from non-EU China.

 

Delivery from China - I generally allow a couple of months and am not often disappointed. Patience is a virtue!

 

John Isherwood.

[melmerby]

Ah Ha! a snag.

I tried selecting a loco for elivery to UK and got this:

 

[cctransuk]

4 minutes ago, melmerby said:

Ah Ha! a snag.

I tried selecting a loco for elivery to UK and got this:

 

 

They're not going to sell many, then - are they?!?

 

Ah well - so much for Chinese logic!

 

John Isherwood.

[melmerby]

8 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

Not since Brexit - but I can't see why this should affect imports from non-EU China.

 

Delivery from China - I generally allow a couple of months and am not often disappointed. Patience is a virtue!

 

John Isherwood.

Small value items used to by pass customs under the previous rules, now everything from everywhere should have VAT added and Royal Mail will collect it and charge their handling fee.*

I was wondering whether to avoid mountains of extra invoicing that small value items might get let off.

 

*N.B. If the company has a GB VAT registration, the price will include VAT and no further checks are required as long as the VAT No. is included on the package.

This includes ebay purchases

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by melmerby

[RichardT]

4 hours ago, cctransuk said:

 

Is it likely that a factory has tooled an unauthorised duplicate model for the relatively few sales that Aliexpress will generate.

No, it’s not likely that they would have tooled a duplicate model. More believable is  “third shift counterfeiting” - you fulfill your contracted orders in the first two shifts, then use the third shift to run off some more for your own use.

 

RT

Edited September 10, 2021 by RichardT
Punctuation

[The Stationmaster]

11 hours ago, RichardT said:

No, it’s not likely that they would have tooled a duplicate model. More believable is  “third shift counterfeiting” - you fulfill your contracted orders in the first two shifts, then use the third shift to run off some more for your own use.

 

RT

Or even more believable surplus stocks of older models being sold off by Kader through Aliexpress - hence out of date models appearing.   If Bachmann Europe don't want them then it makes sense for Kader to shift them via another route,