KR Models to make SR Class 4DD

[Graham_Muz]

From the KR Models newsletter, (what is it with people publishing screen grabs of Cads without switching on the perspective view first I don't know). The curved windows into the roof line were always going to be a challenge, it is hard to be convinced from these images..,.

 

Also these units should have steel disc BFB wheels (with welded tyres, not totally successful in service)  when introduced later replaced with the spoked wheels as shown as shown, I do not know if this will be an option. I can not tell if they have taken into account the smaller wheels under the shorter 8ft trailing bogies.

Edited January 21, 2022 by Graham_Muz

[AlfaZagato]

I hope it is a lack of shading making the wrap-over top windows look odd.   The whole roof curve looks odd from those CADs.

[Michael Hodgson]

7 hours ago, Graham_Muz said:

From the KR Models newsletter, (what is it with people publishing screen grabs of Cads without switching on the perspective view first I don't know). The curved windows into the roof line were always going to be a challenge, it is hard to be convinced from these images..,.

 

Also these units should have steel disc BFB wheels (with welded tyres, not totally successful in service)  when introduced later replaced with the spoked wheels as shown as shown, I do not know if this will be an option. I can not tell if they have taken into account the smaller wheels under the shorter 8ft trailing bogies.

Hi-vis is all very well for the workers, but I'm not keen on those liveries for coaching stock!

[jonhall]

Were the trailing bogies really roller bearing? the photos I can find online imply the answer is no for the one at Sellinge, but my only visit there there was a tarpaulin covering the top and a load of scrap and nettles hiding the bottom, so I only have a single snap of about 60% of one end.

 

Jon

[spamcan61]

1 hour ago, AlfaZagato said:

I hope it is a lack of shading making the wrap-over top windows look odd.   The whole roof curve looks odd from those CADs.

As Muz alludes to, the perspective is all wrong on that top shot, they don't seem to be using oblique or isometric projection, just some weird hybrid 

[Wickham Green too]

5 hours ago, jonhall said:

Were the trailing bogies really roller bearing? ......

Highly unlikely .......... most photos show the front end, of course - and the ( otherwise useful ) shot a couple of pages back has a strategically placed clump of buddleia !

[phil gollin]

.

 

Excellent to see someone doing a 4-DD  -  I am truly amazed to see a 4-DD done before a 4-COR, 4-SUB, or even a Class 455, all of which I would have thought would sell many, many more 4-car sets.

 

I am pleased that this, and the Northern Line set, and Hornby announcements show that even in these inflationary days, 4-car sets can be produced for under £400.

 

I saw the 8 car set (2 x 4-DDs) a very few times.  When at a platform they just looked a bit odd, but when seeing them on the tracks from another train they looked really odd, sort of bloated. 

 

Still, someone thinks that they will sell.  I will be fascinated to see how they do the flush sealed curved windows at the turn of the top of the bodywork.

 

The only real question now is whether to order one, or more realistically two ?   Maybe if I wait KR will do a second run with the alternative unit number !

 

.

 

Edited January 22, 2022 by phil gollin

[Rich46]

Silver Fox produce a 4-COR. I've ordered two which are scheduled for production Nov 22 - Mar 23. I haven't yet decided how I want them finished except they are wanted for the 1950s period. 

[pete_mcfarlane]

On 21/01/2022 at 17:28, jonhall said:

Were the trailing bogies really roller bearing? the photos I can find online imply the answer is no for the one at Sellinge, but my only visit there there was a tarpaulin covering the top and a load of scrap and nettles hiding the bottom, so I only have a single snap of about 60% of one end.

 

Jon

 

On 21/01/2022 at 23:10, Wickham Green too said:

Highly unlikely .......... most photos show the front end, of course - and the ( otherwise useful ) shot a couple of pages back has a strategically placed clump of buddleia !

Here's a clearer picture - the bogies have roller bearings and match the ones in the KR models render. 

 

 

[Wickham Green too]

Hmmm .......... the round pressing on the cover certainly suggests roller bearings beneath - but the box itself doesn't look 'fat' enough to me !

[jonhall]

2 hours ago, pete_mcfarlane said:

 

Here's a clearer picture - the bogies have roller bearings and match the ones in the KR models render. 

 

 

Thanks, its certainly a clearer picture, and not what I was expecting to see, although I'll reserve judgement on whether they match the KR image, since that's not terribly clear.

 

The other thing that interested me with that picture is the shape of the springs - pretty droopy! I assume that the real thing has a number of broken springs, but its a bit odd that the power bogie on the KR model has them that way round, but the trailer is the 'normal' way around? 

 

Jon

[jonhall]

2 hours ago, pete_mcfarlane said:

 

Here's a clearer picture - the bogies have roller bearings and match the ones in the KR models render. 

 

 

Thanks, its certainly a clearer picture, and not what I was expecting to see, although I'll reserve judgement on whether they match the KR image, since that's not terribly clear.

 

The other thing that interested me with that picture is the shape of the springs - pretty droopy! I assume that the real thing has a number of broken springs, but its a bit odd that the power bogie on the KR model has them that way round, but the trailer is the 'normal' way around? 

 

Jon

[Bucoops]

The adjacent vehicle doesn't have buffers but going by solebar height the DD certainly appears significantly lower.

 

I am assuming that even with it being DD the buffer height should be standard so it can be moved easily?

[Michael Hodgson]

20 hours ago, pete_mcfarlane said:

 

Here's a clearer picture - the bogies have roller bearings and match the ones in the KR models render. 

 

 

 

I'm not keen on that livery either.  I suppose it's a good picture for those who  want one that's heavily weathered.

[jonhall]

1 hour ago, Bucoops said:

The adjacent vehicle doesn't have buffers but going by solebar height the DD certainly appears significantly lower.

 

I am assuming that even with it being DD the buffer height should be standard so it can be moved easily?

 

I think the buffers might be a preservation era addition to allow it to be shunted?

 

Jon

[Wickham Green too]

6 hours ago, Bucoops said:

I am assuming that even with it being DD the buffer height should be standard so it can be moved easily?

The outer buffers ARE at standard height - aligned with the upswept frame over the motor bogies ...... the inner end would have had the standard S.R. 'single buffer and three-link' arrangement and would never have had to match anything else in service - as Jonhall says, the buffer you can see is a preservation mod positioned higher than the solebar.

[Graham_Muz]

The May update includes the same previously seen images of cad drawings and the same contradictory text...

 

"Tooling has begun and we should have samples in about 6 months" and "The CAD drawings are almost complete and look very interesting."  

 

Why would tooling have started if the Cads are not complete...?

 

 

 

[Wickham Green too]

...... unless tooling of some components has begun and CAD drawings of the remainder are almost complete ........................... possible - but unlikely !!?!

[Graham_Muz]

Certainly not usual or economic practice and highly unlikely.  

 

 

[The Stationmaster]

2 hours ago, Graham_Muz said:

The May update includes the same previously seen images of cad drawings and the same contradictory text...

 

"Tooling has begun and we should have samples in about 6 months" and "The CAD drawings are almost complete and look very interesting."  

 

Why would tooling have started if the Cads are not complete...?

 

 

 

Alas I get the impression at times that a good understanding of the English language is not one of KR's strongest features.  For instance one of their adverts - which ran in the mags some months  - said 'We would like to make ...'   for something which they had previously announced they would be making, confusing to say the least. 

[adb968008]

On 13/05/2022 at 11:10, The Stationmaster said:

Alas I get the impression at times that a good understanding of the English language is not one of KR's strongest features.  For instance one of their adverts - which ran in the mags some months  - said 'We would like to make ...'   for something which they had previously announced they would be making, confusing to say the least. 

It certainly damages credibility….

 

this one is looking like its coming back to haunt the customer, at least those purchasing prior to that have some recourse if unhappy.

 

regarding Fell..

Quote

Here is the latest screenshot of the CAD drawings so far. These should be complete by the end of April. Then we head to tooling. We should have a working sample in time for Warley this year.

…

 

There were other changes to the body work that we can't change without a huge expense. So we are keeping to the one we have the most information on.

 

Is this where Generic Fell emerged ? And why is modifying a CAD more expensive, than modifying a tooling, if that tooling hasnt yet started ? 

Full marks on GT3 and the Consetts, the were a bit vague there too, but they did listen, even if communication was a bit opaque, but Fell for me feels  a bridge too far!
 

So personally I’m happy to order via Rails, rather than pay upfront a year plus in advance from now on. The risk tolerance drops with lines like the above, and lack of clarification of what were seeing… when the DD etc lists there i’ll move, unless the Fell turns up accurate and surprises us again too..in that case i’ll truly bet on them for winning a poker face challenge and i’d be lost for words.

Edited May 16, 2022 by adb968008

[Darius43]

14 hours ago, adb968008 said:

 

i’d be lost for words.

Now that would be an extraordinary occurrence.

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[Michael Hodgson]

16 hours ago, adb968008 said:

IThe risk tolerance drops with lines like the above, and lack of clarification of what were seeing… when the DD etc lists there i’ll move, unless the Fell turns up accurate and surprises us again too..in that case i’ll truly bet on them for winning a poker face challenge and i’d be lost for words.

 

If we saw a Fell hauling a DD, we'd all be lost for words!

[spamcan61]

16 hours ago, adb968008 said:

 

Is this where Generic Fell emerged ? And why is modifying a CAD more expensive, than modifying a tooling, if that tooling hasnt yet started ? 
 

I assume what they meant is that having different toolings for different body variations is (understandably) too expensive, hence Generic Fell.

[trevor7598]

On 13/05/2022 at 08:59, Graham_Muz said:

The May update includes the same previously seen images of cad drawings and the same contradictory text...

 

"Tooling has begun and we should have samples in about 6 months" and "The CAD drawings are almost complete and look very interesting."  

 

Why would tooling have started if the Cads are not complete...?

 

 

 

Visually at least there's some work to do to get them looking right.