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Anybody ever made working end doors in 4mm scale mineral wagons?


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Hi folks

 

I'm thinking about modeling an end tippler in 4mm and wondered about making some 16 ton minerals or RCH type coal wagons to work with it. Has anyone had any success in making these wagons with a working end door that looks reasonable scale? I guess than in addition to a hinge (which is probably the easier part) I'd like some kind of latch to stop the door from opening when moving.

 

Any ideas gratefully received.

 

David

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13 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

Many years ago, Hornby made a working wagon tipper, which came with a wagon with an operating end door.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/185118254222?hash=item2b19e8648e:g:8x8AAOSwu8xhcBBh

 

Available in several PO liveries over the years, with and without the huge metal operating lever on the side.  The wagon body is a cupboard door type but the underframe is the inappropriate NER 8 shoe clasp brake type complete with floor/curb rail, so the wagon appears to have two floors.

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Though I would imagine replacing the underframe would be easier than trying to build a new hinge mechanism (unless of course the catch is built into the underframe).

 

My point is though, that it is possible, and has been done, and whether the OP uses the Hornby wagon or not, it is probably a useful starting point for reverse-engineering.

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14 hours ago, Fen End Pit said:

Hi folks

 

I'm thinking about modeling an end tippler in 4mm and wondered about making some 16 ton minerals or RCH type coal wagons to work with it. Has anyone had any success in making these wagons with a working end door that looks reasonable scale? I guess than in addition to a hinge (which is probably the easier part) I'd like some kind of latch to stop the door from opening when moving.

 

Any ideas gratefully received.

 

David

Rather than using a latch, would it be feasible to ballast the bottom of the door to keep it vertical?

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I built one from a white metal kit years ago, as you say the hinge was the easy bit. The latch was a long metal strip pivoted under the wagon and hooking under the door. the idea was that it would be pulled down by a magnet to release the door, the problem turned out to be getting it to reliably shut again. Despite the door being fairly heavy it wouldn't do this reliably and it also tended to open a bit travelling round the layout spilling some of its load as it went. I don't use real coal for this, I've seen this done once in 4mm and the coal slowly turns to dust and jams any mechanism - I use Woodlands Scenics cinder ballast. The wagon is still in use but it has long since had its door welded shut so I can't show any photos, I think the operating mechanism might still be in it but it's all packed up with the other coal wagons to go to Leeds exhibition today with Herculaneum Dock.

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Thanks for all the thoughts so far. I'm wondering how the Hornby wagon kept its load in while running round the track, presumably coal on the carpet was an occupational hazard.

 

I guess now I need to find a wagon to play with...

 

David

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7 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

As far as I can tell, there is no latch

 

The latch appears to be the metal T shape at the near corner of the wagon which hooks round the outside of the door until released when the wagon is pushed firmly against the end of the tipping table.

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Someone else made one as I have one somewhere, can't remember if it was a kit or RTR as purchased 2nd hand years ago, perhaps Playcraft? Its not Hornby as have a few of those

 

Airfix kits have side doors nearly all mine work just pushes  and fits in without glue,  it's a good model and one of the few which has correct wheelbase

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Could the latch not be made like a sort of reversed tension lock coupling under the wagon

Normal position (raised)  is holding doors closed  and held down by a magnet on the tipper bed

 

It would only need to be close enough to stop the door opening rather than be a tight fit.  We're talking fractions of millimetres here.

Of course choice of load material would be critical. 

 

I think the hardest bit would be the hinging as mentioned above.

Friction is a fickle beast,

 

An interesting challenge to get something that works and looks right in operation. 

 

 

Andy

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This is the experimental wagon.

IMG_0926.jpg.dda752f692db63f75d38030487002d1e.jpg

It's an RCH 13T mineral without bottom doors so I pivoted the latch on the brake cross shaft. The latch is a nickel silver strip with a strip of phosphor bronze acting as a return spring on the underside of the wagon floor. My memory was a bit faulty, it wasn't magnetically operated but mechanically by a ramp on the tipping floor.

776624031_IMG_09271.jpg.42e0332c39522fa3057f48e1a3fb4875.jpg

The door hinge was the easy bit, it's done exactly like the full size one with a wire across the top of the sides and straps looped over it on the top of the door. The latch is fairly unobtrusive. The main difficulty was getting it to close after emptying the wagon, if the latch was loose enough to reliably close the fit was too slack and allowed the coal to escape a bit when it was filled again. If the latch was tight enough to effectively seal, it wouldn't close, even with a heavy white metal door.

In the end it was abandoned, the door welded up and the coal wagons on Herculaneum run on an empties/fulls circuit in and out of the fiddle yard.

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