Bachmann 009 Double Fairlie

[Fair Oak Junction]

1 hour ago, RJS1977 said:

 

As I'd guess around 50% of layouts are analogue controlled (based on what I've seen at shows and in model magazines), there may be a significant proportion of purchasers who are quite happy to buy one without a DCC socket, especially if it knocks a little off the price.

 

Of course, and mine will be staying analogue. I just find it a very strange design decision on a brand new model being made as we enter the second decade of the 21st century. The info from Peco/Kato says it is due to lack of space, but that is entirely down to their design not scale as proved by Bachmann fitting a 6-pin socket into the Quarry Hunslets. I feel that for a model that has an RRP of £150 they could have done better.

 

But it is what it is and I'm sure they will still sell well. Hopefully with those and the Bachmann Fairlies we are going to see a whole bunch of new 009 Ffestiniog and maybe even more freelance layouts springing up, which is never a bad thing.

Edited November 4, 2021 by Obsidian Quarry

[ian]

23 minutes ago, Obsidian Quarry said:

I just find it a very strange design decision on a brand new model being made as we enter the second decade of the 21st century.

Kato will be seling it in their home market in Japan which is overwhelmingly analogue DC and wedded to traction tyres. Sales there will dwarf what UK modellers buy so it is a perfectly logical decision for them.

[Fair Oak Junction]

Fair, I know very little about the details of the Japanese market and what their models are like.

[PaulRhB]

24 minutes ago, Obsidian Quarry said:

Fair, I know very little about the details of the Japanese market and what their models are like.

Kato are very good in prototype detail and run very well indeed. Their US range has long been considered the best available until the last few years when several new entrants joined the market and Athearn etc responded with their Genesis range, as did others.
The home Japanese market uses a lot of temporary layouts and like the various bridge sets with impressive gradients so traction tyres are essential in their eyes. One of the guys who lives out there says that many are disappointed when they find European manufacturers don’t use them! It’s a varied world  

[JaymzHatstand]

Looks like there's going to be a rush on early quarrymen's carriages! I can see around 20 in this c.1880 photo of Merddin in the condition Bachmann are producing him. Two types, 1b and 2a, neither of which are in the Dundas range, or in Peco's development (both of which are the later type 3 of 1885)

 

http://217.34.233.120:8086/index.php?a=ViewItem&key=SXsiTiI6MSwiUCI6eyJ2YWx1ZSI6Ik1lcmRkaW4gd29uZGVyIiwib3BlcmF0b3IiOiIxIiwiZnV6enlQcmVmaXhMZW5ndGgiOiIzIiwiZnV6enlNaW5TaW1pbGFyaXR5IjowLjUsIm1heFN1Z2dlc3Rpb25zIjoiNSIsImFsd2F5c1N1Z2dlc3QiOm51bGx9fQ&pg=1&WINID=1636104159583#ODt0-q0kmfsAAAF872hEUQ/1869

 

There is a Mercian brass kit that I'm aware of, but at £16 a throw, that's going to cost as much as the loco for a decent rake of just the one type. I might have to break out the plasticard, I'm sure I've hi some plans somewhere!

 

Cheers

 

J

[Steven B]

23 hours ago, Obsidian Quarry said:

Of course, and mine will be staying analogue. I just find it a very strange design decision on a brand new model being made as we enter the second decade of the 21st century. The info from Peco/Kato says it is due to lack of space, but that is entirely down to their design not scale as proved by Bachmann fitting a 6-pin socket into the Quarry Hunslets.

 

It's the Kato way of doing things. As has been mentioned, DCC isn't commonly used in Japan and so support for it by Kato is limited. Where it is given some consideration then it tends to be either a complete after-market replacement PCB (e.g. most US models and their N Gauge Eurostar) or a Kato specific decoder (N Gauge class 800).

 

Standard 6,8,18 or 21 pin decoder sockets are noticeable by their absence in most (all?) Kato models. They're only just becoming common in American outline models.

 

Steven B

 

[The Johnster]

On 03/11/2021 at 14:48, Michael Hodgson said:

how about motorised slate wagons to replicate the gravity trains?

Sound fitted brakemen with hunting horns?

[rembrow]

Looks like these are proving very popular. Rails have advised they have sold out of both versions of Livingston Thompson and both of the remaining sound versions on pre orders.

[Michael Hodgson]

Nor surprising, the double Fairlies are much prettier than single ended narrow gauges locos even though they were something of a rarity outside of the Festiniog.

[Michael Hodgson]

8 hours ago, The Johnster said:

Sound fitted brakemen with hunting horns?

We should have had them in Olde England.    Brakesmen would have worn bright red coats.  Yaroop!   Tally Ho!

 

Actually the last place I saw huntsmen gathered was in Abergavenny.

 

[The Johnster]

The Festiniog's (period spelling) gravity trains were pretty impressive; 100 slate wagons, a brakesman every 15 or so wagons, hunting horns used as warnings and for communication.  Speeds could be up to 70mph apparently, which must've been, um, interesting on short wheelbase fully loaded wagons with primitive springing, no shelter just sitting on top of the slate holding the brake handle, the Cresta Run comes to mind, and this in an area with one of the highest rainfall figures in Wales, a country not noted for it's desert-like climate in the first place...

[RJS1977]

Not just the period spelling, it's also the official spelling as laid down in the Act of Parliament and registered with Companies House. Changing the official name would require a new Act.

 

Effectively the current situation is that the Festiniog Railway Company is trading as the "Ffestiniog Railway".

[pauliebanger]

I've had the privilege to ride the gravity train in recent times and in excellent weather, too, thankfully.

 

Still uses a bugle as AWD but now the brake operators are concentrated towards the front of the formation.

 

Given that the line is built with a continuous gradient down from Blaenau Ffestiniog, high speed would have been possible but the tight curves on much of the route would have been an inhibiting factor (I hope).

 

The FR's modern day max speed is 20 mph. Whilst it certainly felt much faster being so close to the ground and to the sides of cutttings it would probably been around 20mph and that was fast enough for me!

 

i could be more sure of the speed if I had timed the run over the known distance from Dduallt to Minffordd but I was so excited I almost forgot to press 'Record' on my equipment, let alone look at my watch. LOL.

 

I agree, a motorised sound fitted gravity train would be cool, but sadly, rather too niche. (and before anyone says otherwise, there's plenty of noise to capture. It might not have motive power, on the way down, but the gravity train is far from silent).

 

Best regards,

 

Paul

Edited November 7, 2021 by pauliebanger
Another spelling correction - having a bad day

[RJS1977]

6 minutes ago, pauliebanger said:

 

 

Given that the line is built with a continuous gradient down from Blaenau Ffestiniog, high speed would have been possible but the tight curves on much of the route would have been an inhibiting factor (I hope).

 

 

The line did have a continuous gradient from Blaenau, however that was lost when the Deviation was built, as there is now a summit between the Power station and Archer Dam.

[pauliebanger]

Correct,  that's why, when it runs,  it now usually departs from Dduallt, below the Deviation.

 

I should, of course, have said 'was built', as I was referencing the speed of the historical operation described by  The Johnster in his post. My mistake.

 

i would imagine that the continous gradient was actually 'lost' when the Tanygrisiau reservoir created for the powerstation blocked then flooded the existing line just below Baenau FFestiniog. The building of the Deveation, being the engineering solution selected to circumvent the obstruction, was a much later event.

 

Best regards,

 

Paul

Edited November 7, 2021 by pauliebanger

[Steamport Southport]

 

That's Deviation!  

[pauliebanger]

Shame it's not Breguet

[cornelius]

6 hours ago, pauliebanger said:

I agree, a motorised sound fitted gravity train would be cool, but sadly, rather too niche. (and before anyone says otherwise, there's plenty of noise to capture. It might not have motive power, on the way down, but the gravity train is far from silent).

 

It has been done, with very small Japanese N gauge mechanisms and I think possibly an Arnold KoF. - the recent Kato Portram would comfortably fit but the wheels are too small and hard to change. I think the sound chip and speaker would have to go in subsequent wagons though!

[Quarryscapes]

On 03/11/2021 at 16:14, PaulRhB said:

DC with next18 socket. 
 

from the product page

 

I know what it says, but it doesn't answer my question. Is there a chip or not? 

[Roy Langridge]

1 minute ago, Quarryscapes said:

 

I know what it says, but it doesn't answer my question. Is there a chip or not? 

 

I don't believe so as the part number does not indicate it is DCC Fitted.

Roy

[rembrow]

I was going to order a Fourdees tramway loco, but diverted my order to a second of the Fairlies, Earl of Merioneth.

[PaulRhB]

1 hour ago, Quarryscapes said:

 

I know what it says, but it doesn't answer my question. Is there a chip or not? 

 
I answered your question above the quote  
 

 

It’s either DCC sound or DC with a socket. 
 

 

Edited November 8, 2021 by PaulRhB

[bubbles2]

This may not be the right place to ask but as my previous foray into 009 was 50 years ago and having been 4mm scale OO dc only since if I go for the DCC sound option of double Fairlie what controller should I buy to take full advantage of the sound as supplied, I am a complete novice with DCC so need a pointer of where to start.

[PaulRhB]

12 hours ago, bubbles2 said:

what controller should I buy to take full advantage of the sound as supplied,

It will have somewhere in the region of 20 functions, some of which will be things like announcements and draincocks, so a controller that can access 20+ functions is an advantage. 
Most basic starter systems will nowadays access these but a couple of the most basic only have 10 function buttons. 
The Piko Smartcontrol is one off he cheapest with access to all those and a nice piece of kit that’s simple to learn https://www.dcctrainautomation.co.uk/piko-55017-smart-control-light-.html

(I use the handset with my more advanced Roco Z21 alongside their own ones)

If you have a local modelshop that’s a good option if they can recommend one as you’ll get in person support. 

Plenty of others available like NCE, Gaugemaster Prodigy and Digitrax that are fine but the Piko is a good price and design while mostly slightly cheaper. 
 

The discussion on which is best is endless and I’d suggest looking in the DCC section for more details rather than a big diversion in this thread. I recommend the Piko one from personal experience of friends and my personal systems and the link for James at DccAutomation gives good support. Others like Digitrains and Coastal DCC offer similar good advice so those three would be my first calls if you don’t have a local shop. 

[Oldddudders]

On 08/11/2021 at 13:21, Quarryscapes said:

 

I know what it says, but it doesn't answer my question. Is there a chip or not? 

They are using conventional terminology, meaning that the non-sound loco is DC, but has a DCC socket with a blanking plug, so runs on DC as sold. Unplug the blanking plug and plug in a DCC decoder of your choice, either silent or sound, if you need to. Next 18 is a particularly small and neat interface.