Track cleaning - back to the drawing board

[AyJay]

The subject of track cleaning has come up before, although I cannot find anything recent on the subject, so apologies for digging it up again.

 

Well... remembering that I had a Triang Hornby track cleaning car, I dug it out to see if it could be pressed into service.

I replaced the original wheels with Alan Gibson wheels, so that it would run on my finescale track.

The original piece of felt was so badly deteriorated that it was no use; so searching on the internet, I purchased a sheet of 3mm thick wool felt. Cutting a strip to size, I fitted this and then gave it a try.

That's where my plan all went wrong.

Firstly, the pad pressing down was lifting the wheels, so I placed a couple of big nuts in the wagon to hold it down.

Then it caused so much drag that I had to 'tweak' the position of the pad so that it barely brushed over the track, I also had to dig out a heavy locomotive to haul it.

Now it moves, but comes to a halt over the points as the felt is getting snagged in the point frogs, It is also leaving threads behind, caught on the track.

I also started looking at a sheet of cork, but it would not bend the 180 degrees without splitting.

Is there no way that I can make this work???

Is my only realistic solution, the Dapol motorised track cleaner, B800?

 

I do also have the modern Hornby track cleaning car, R296, but refuse to use it because the 'point of contact' is a pair of abrasive pads.

My choice of cleaning fluid is IsoPropyl Alcohol.

 

Any suggestions?   Thank you

[brossard]

I had the track cleaner as pictured here:

 

https://www.cchobbies.com/trackcleaners/cleaners.htm

 

It uses a heavy brass roller wrapped with J cloth.  The J cloth is soaked in cleaner fluid and the car trundled around the track.  Because the cloth is on a roller, it doesn't snag.  The weight of the brass roller means that it drags on the track.  I thought it was great.

 

John

Edited November 30, 2021 by brossard

[ITG]

I bought one of these, tho I can’t for the life of me recall what make it is. The drop down pads are weighted, and as can be seen, they do pick up dirt.

Hopefully someone else will recognise it!

[ejstubbs]

30 minutes ago, brossard said:

I had the track cleaner as pictured here:

 

https://www.cchobbies.com/trackcleaners/cleaners.htm

 

It uses a heavy brass roller wrapped with J cloth.  The J cloth is soaked in cleaner fluid and the car trundled around the track.  Because the cloth is on a roller, it doesn't snag.  The weight of the brass roller means that it drags on the track.  I thought it was great.

 

That's the same kind of idea as the Lanarkshire Models track cleaners: http://www.lanarkshiremodels.com/lanarkshiremodelsandsupplieswebsite_036.htm although they are kits rather than RTR items - you have to supply the wagon yourself.

[brossard]

3 minutes ago, ejstubbs said:

 

That's the same kind of idea as the Lanarkshire Models track cleaners: http://www.lanarkshiremodels.com/lanarkshiremodelsandsupplieswebsite_036.htm although they are kits rather than RTR items - you have to supply the wagon yourself.

 

Yes, doesn't matter what the roller is in, the important thing is that you have a cloth wrapped heavy roller that is not actually connected to the wagon but rolls freely.

 

John

 

[ejstubbs]

49 minutes ago, AyJay said:

The subject of track cleaning has come up before, although I cannot find anything recent on the subject, so apologies for digging it up again.

 

Crewlisle posted this just last week: https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/168563-crewlisle-track-pointsswitch-cleaning/

 

The forum's own search function comes up with plenty of past threads on the subject: https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/search/&q=track cleaning&quick=1&type=forums_topic&search_in=titles including - as it's what you seem to be most interested in - a goodly number on the topic of track cleaning wagons.

 

 

[Chrisr40]

44 minutes ago, ITG said:

I bought one of these, tho I can’t for the life of me recall what make it is. The drop down pads are weighted, and as can be seen, they do pick up dirt.

Hopefully someone else will recognise it!

Ten commandments sell these. I have one and they are excellent.

[ITG]

4 minutes ago, Chrisr40 said:

Ten commandments sell these. I have one and they are excellent.

You’re spot on, that’s where I obtained mine.

[AyJay]

J-Cloths!  Of course.  I'll wait 'til the coast is clear, then 'liberate' one from the kitchen 

 

Thanks all,  I will look out for the Ten Commandments product, in case it does not work.

Yes I have used the dreaded track rubber, but the consensus is that they are not a good solution.

Thanks all.

[spikey]

1 hour ago, brossard said:

It uses a heavy brass roller wrapped with J cloth.  The J cloth is soaked in cleaner fluid and the car trundled around the track.  Because the cloth is on a roller, it doesn't snag.  The weight of the brass roller means that it drags on the track. 

 

But how is the j-cloth affixed to the roller so as to stay put even when soaked in fluid?

[brossard]

1 minute ago, spikey said:

 

But how is the j-cloth affixed to the roller so as to stay put even when soaked in fluid?

 

I used a couple of lengths of sewing thread.  I suppose some elastic bands might serve too.

 

John

[RexAshton]

While it's important to clean the track many modellers will suggest it's at least as important to ensure that all wheels are clean including and especially those that are fitted to rolling stock, tenders or any other unpowered wheels on locos. When I first started modelling in S4 it became very noticeable that the build up of crud and gunge was enough to cause derailments and when I'd gone through and cleaned all my wheels thoroughly not only did the derailments disappeared track cleaning became much less of an issue. I had a layout at the last 4 day York Exhibition  and only cleaned the track during setup. Never needed to touch it all weekend and also noticed that any derailments were generally operator error.

[cravensdmufan]

I don't use IPA now having come across this video - well worth spending 20 minutes watching it.  Explaining the science of oxidation.

 

 

Plus, if you have a bit more time - take a look at Tony's own video showing the products and his track cleaning wagons:

 

 

Having used the non polar WD40 CONTACT CLEANER -  not the regular stuff  I hardly ever need to clean my rails nowadays. 

Edited November 30, 2021 by cravensdmufan
additional video clip

[The Johnster]

I found that my cleaning regime could become significantly more relaxed if one removes as far as possible the formers and spreaders of crud.

 

Formers of crud; anywhere that arcing is likely to occur.  Pay particular attention to:-

 

.laying track as level and as smoothly joined as possible, so that the pickup wheels sit properly on the railhead and do not, even momentarily. lose contact with it. 

.ensuring that sideplay on pickup wheelsets is not restricted and that both the pickups remain in contact with the rear of the wheels across the full range of the sideplay.

.ensuring that point blades and closure rails are clean at the contact point, or carbon deposit will build up.  This will be more noticeable if you use insulfrog setrack turnouts on DC layouts to direct the current where you want it, but needs to be looked at even if you wire around the insulfrogs in DC or use DCC, as it will cause running problems eventually.

.keep an eye on flangeways; detritis here, even a grain of ballast, can lift wheels and cause arcing, your carbon enemy.  I have a set of pound shop childrens' nylon bristle paintbrushes which are u/s for painting with but perfect for sweeping out my flangeways,

 

Spreaders of crud; materials that carbon and other muck attach to and are thus transported  around the layout.  If you can, eliminate:-

 

.plastic wheels.  These are renowned spreaders of crud, and difficult to clean.  Replacing them with metal alternatives is well worth the cost and bother, and is an easy job; the plastic wheelsets can be sprung out of their bearing cones, and replacement metal sets sprung back in.  It is a mechanical matter rather than to do with layout hygiene, but you will experience better running and less drag, as well as wheels that are easier to clean and get less dirty in the first place.

.traction tyres.  Satan's expectorant, designed to make every part of your layout dirty and then, having shed material all over the place so that it gets into your mechs and bearings, they wear out and snag on crossing vees and point blades.  If you only do one thing to improve your layout hygiend, do this.

 

Another thing that helps IMHO, though I have no empirical evidence to back up MHO, is frequent and regular running, on a permanently erected layout.  Mine is in almost daily use, and I am 'in the zone' when it comes to early identification of building problems so that I can usually keep on top of them, but even taking this into account I am sure that my running is more reliable than it would be were the layout only in occasional use.  This comment is of no use if you have to put your layout away after use every time.  Being able to site the layout in the habitable part of the home rather than an attic, shed, or garage, will help as well.

[ejstubbs]

10 hours ago, cravensdmufan said:

I don't use IPA now...

 

Having used the non polar WD40 CONTACT CLEANER -  not the regular stuff  I hardly ever need to clean my rails nowadays. 

 

Have you read the technical data sheet for the WD40 Contact Cleaner?

 

Quote

SPECIAL USE WARNINGS

 

...

 

FIRST AID: Ingestion: CONTAINS n-Hexane and Isopropyl Alcohol.

Edited December 1, 2021 by ejstubbs

[Roger Sunderland]

I’ve mentioned this several times on here already but there is one track cleaner which really does work . It is the one supplied by DCC Concepts. Totally unlike the Peco one, and most others I’ve seen. It doesn’t have harsh grit in it but contains aluminium oxide. Unlike other track cleaners you must not press or rub hard, rather simply lightly run over the tops of the rails with a polishing action, this means there is no crud.

Ive used one for several years on both my home layout and a large exhibition layout- superb results. No connection with DCC Concepts just a very satisfied customer.

[SamThomas]

I use a combination ;

Gaugemaster (AKA Noch) axel hung pads - amazing how much they pick up from "clean" track.

Roco/Piko/Gaugemaster Track Cleaning Van - with the springs removed so that it's only the weight of the pad on the track.

Track Magic - I also use tiny, tiny amount on sliding contacts.

For the few diffecult to get at areas if necessary I have a Lux Track Cleaner with a felt roller & the vacuum Wagon to go with it.

Rarely have to clean the track unless I've been doing scenic work.

I also try to keep my ManCave dust free.

 

I do replace traction tyred wheelsets on my OHE/Diesel locomotives but some Steam Outline still have (& need them) but I don't seem to have an issue with them - maybe HO European manufactures use a different material to UK ones ?

 

IMHO the worst thing you can use is the rubber that's been around for decades.

Edited December 1, 2021 by SamThomas

[cravensdmufan]

4 hours ago, ejstubbs said:

 

Have you read the technical data sheet for the WD40 Contact Cleaner?

 

I am aware that the WD40 Contact Cleaner does contain IPA, but I don't know what percentage.  It doesn't say on the tin.

 

All I know is that having used it, my rails and wheels have stayed much cleaner than when I used to use the 99% strength IPA.

[Andymsa]

5 hours ago, cravensdmufan said:

I am aware that the WD40 Contact Cleaner does contain IPA, but I don't know what percentage.  It doesn't say on the tin.

 

All I know is that having used it, my rails and wheels have stayed much cleaner than when I used to use the 99% strength IPA.

I concur about the wd contact cleaner and have seen numerous tests on it which have been done scientifically. But there be those who will debunk anything against norm  

[PenrithBeacon]

I use cigarette filter in a modified Bic ball point pen.  I just dip the filter in Iso and rub it on the track. Easy peasy. 

[Sir TophamHatt]

There's an Australian / American guy on YouTube that is quite excitable:

 

 

I personally use the CMX track cleaner.  It works pretty well but my layout doesn't see much use.

I use (less than 99%) isopropanol cleaner but I've also been experimenting with not bothering with cleaning at all and using a graphite stick.

The graphite stick did help some of my older locos get around the layout a little smoother.

[Andymsa]

8 minutes ago, Sir TophamHatt said:

There's an Australian / American guy on YouTube that is quite excitable:

 

 

I personally use the CMX track cleaner.  It works pretty well but my layout doesn't see much use.

I use (less than 99%) isopropanol cleaner but I've also been experimenting with not bothering with cleaning at all and using a graphite stick.

The graphite stick did help some of my older locos get around the layout a little smoother.

inox as they call it in oz, can’t remember what we call it is not compatible with locos that use traction tyres as it rots the traction tyre..

[mezzoman253]

This may be useful https://dccwiki.com/Track_Cleaning

 

Rob

[rob D2]

What’s wrong with IPA then ?

cotton buds and IPA I use as a rule and Rocco track cleaner for the locos 

[Andymsa]

On 08/12/2021 at 22:53, rob D2 said:

What’s wrong with IPA then ?

cotton buds and IPA I use as a rule and Rocco track cleaner for the locos 

watch the videos above, they explain it much better than I can. But basically IPA will cause black crud to accumulate much more quickly and hence have to clean track more often .