Class 76/EM1 cab on disposal list at Manchester Museum of Science and Industry closing date 31/12/2021

[dave75]

Be nice to see it get a new home.

 

Em2 loco society dont have any suitable storage for it, so cant offer it a home.   

 

 

https://www.sciencemuseumgroup.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/SMG-Transfers-Advert-October-to-December-2021.pdf

[Mol_PMB]

There's a couple of nice railway-related machine tools too. A wheel lathe and a penudulum grinder (for grinding expansion links).

 

[Johann Marsbar]

...and a trolleybus that's not been on public display since the 1990's ..........

[009 micro modeller]

Does anyone know if Irchester or Rocks by Rail (or suggest any other relevant sites if I’ve missed them) would be interested in the ironstone wagon? I think at least one of these two is an accredited museum but would need to check. Or even a local (non-railway) museum in the area around Scaldwell that wants to display some ironstone-related objects.

[jonhall]

The lathe and pendulum grinder appear to be those at 'the flour mill' workshop?

 

Jon

[Johann Marsbar]

6 minutes ago, jonhall said:

The lathe and pendulum grinder appear to be those at 'the flour mill' workshop?

 

Jon

It was suggested elsewhere that the ex-Swindon machinery up for disposal may be located in the workshop at York which is closed due to pending redevelopment there, though that hasn't been confirmed.

If that isn't the case, then if they are at the "Flour Mill", then the de-accession process may actually be a required formality before they are passed over to that organisation, though I'm guessing that they are a Commercial operation rather than a Registered Museum which would complicate matters.

[Ian Smeeton]

11 hours ago, 009 micro modeller said:

Does anyone know if Irchester or Rocks by Rail (or suggest any other relevant sites if I’ve missed them) would be interested in the ironstone wagon? I think at least one of these two is an accredited museum but would need to check. Or even a local (non-railway) museum in the area around Scaldwell that wants to display some ironstone-related objects.

 

I did flag this up to RBR's Chairman, but he is going to contact the Southwold Railway as they are 3'

 

We would need to find space undercover for it, and even though Cottesmore West Pit was originally 3' gauge tramway worked, we have no other 3' gauge exhibits.

 

Regards

 

Ian

Edited December 13, 2021 by Ian Smeeton
Sp

[009 micro modeller]

3 hours ago, Ian Smeeton said:

 

I did flag this up to RBR's Chairman, but he is going to contact the Southwold Railway as they are 3'

 

We would need to find space undercover for it, and even though Cottesmore West Pit was originally 3' gauge tramway worked, we have no other 3' gauge exhibits.

 

Regards

 

Ian

Irchester has, as you might expect, a large number of ironstone-related exhibits. Their running line is metre gauge but they seem to have exhibits of various gauges.

[adb968008]

I seem to  recall that 76 cab… when the museum when first set up, had a tv screen showing a video of the woodhead route infront of the cab window, and the simulator actually responded to controls, slowing, speeding up and operating the horn, even the speedo adjusted… early 1980’s ?

I wonder if Bury Transport Museum would have any space for it ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 13, 2021 by adb968008

[Steamport Southport]

It did. I think it was one of the commercial videos. Possibly this one.

 

https://www.telerail.co.uk/railway-dvds-railfilms-titles/archive-electric-traction-cab-rides/the-woodhead-route-cab-ride

 

Bonkers. I do wonder who is in charge of these museums that seem to have no interest in heritage. Yet will probably set up yet another kids play area that the kids just walk past instead. Or a café (as Manchester hasn't got hundreds of eateries...)

 

Shambles of a museum now. Last time I went was when Rocket was there and everything was filthy, and not in a "good" way like many transport museums usually are. Just a sense of dereliction as if no one cared.

 

 

 

Jason

[62613]

On 14/12/2021 at 02:20, Steamport Southport said:

It did. I think it was one of the commercial videos. Possibly this one.

 

https://www.telerail.co.uk/railway-dvds-railfilms-titles/archive-electric-traction-cab-rides/the-woodhead-route-cab-ride

 

Bonkers. I do wonder who is in charge of these museums that seem to have no interest in heritage. Yet will probably set up yet another kids play area that the kids just walk past instead. Or a café (as Manchester hasn't got hundreds of eateries...)

 

Shambles of a museum now. Last time I went was when Rocket was there and everything was filthy, and not in a "good" way like many transport museums usually are. Just a sense of dereliction as if no one cared.

 

 

 

Jason

Sadly, these days, Manchester ( the city) in general seems to be engaged in a headlong rush to erase any trace of its  past, however dirty. Utterly, utterly sad!

[25901]

On 13/12/2021 at 22:21, adb968008 said:

I wonder if Bury Transport Museum would have any space for it ?

A plan is in hand for a local Museum but not Bury, plus this party are getting another Woodhead cab too if the master plan works. Keep watching

[Johann Marsbar]

4 hours ago, 25901 said:

A plan is in hand for a local Museum but not Bury, plus this party are getting another Woodhead cab too if the master plan works. Keep watching

 

Are they an Acredited Musum with Arts Council England though, as I couldn't see anything obvious on the website for the Museum in question.  The Science Museum Group don't tend to pass things on to organisations which aren't....

[25901]

1 hour ago, Johann Marsbar said:

 

Are they an Acredited Musum with Arts Council England though, as I couldn't see anything obvious on the website for the Museum in question.  The Science Museum Group don't tend to pass things on to organisations which aren't....

Not sure on accreditation but it is a Manchester museum and they have got their hands on other major items plus have the backing of other groups  

[Johann Marsbar]

10 minutes ago, 25901 said:

Not sure on accreditation but it is a Manchester museum and they have got their hands on other major items plus have the backing of other groups  

 

Good luck to them then, as it would be a suitable place for it to go.

I was involved in trying to get something out of the NRM from one of their previous disposal lists and, despite the Rail Museum in question having an excellent record on restoring rolling stock of that type in very short time periods, they were not deemed suitable because of them not being an Acredited Museum and their status (even as a not for profit body) didn't conform to the SMG requirements. We don't know whether anyone got the item in question in the end, as nothing has been said as to the fate of most of the items on that list. It's most probably still sitting at Shildon.....

A funding package was even in place to get it restored!

[009 micro modeller]

This gives more information about accreditation: https://www.artscouncil.org.uk/accreditation-scheme/accreditation-how-apply#section-1

 

All seems sensible although I wonder whether some smaller organisations would have problems with the need to ‘open to the public regularly.’ There’s also the issue of time required to do the application.

[Johann Marsbar]

8 minutes ago, 009 micro modeller said:

This gives more information about accreditation: https://www.artscouncil.org.uk/accreditation-scheme/accreditation-how-apply#section-1

 

All seems sensible although I wonder whether some smaller organisations would have problems with the need to ‘open to the public regularly.’ There’s also the issue of time required to do the application.

It is an awful lot of work to become Acredited, as I know what has been involved in the way of systems/paperwork etc with the local Transport Museum which has that status.  Once you are at that stage, it does open various funding sources which are not available to those bodies which aren't though. 

 

[Northmoor]

On 27/12/2021 at 10:25, 009 micro modeller said:

This gives more information about accreditation: https://www.artscouncil.org.uk/accreditation-scheme/accreditation-how-apply#section-1

 

All seems sensible although I wonder whether some smaller organisations would have problems with the need to ‘open to the public regularly.’ There’s also the issue of time required to do the application.

If you're not open to the public regularly (and remember regularly doesn't mean frequently, it could mean one Sunday every third month), then it's reasonable to argue you aren't a museum, you're a private collection.  You can't expect to get public funding for something you're keeping to yourselves, but as @Johann Marsbarsays, the rewards of taking your collection seriously, in terms of making external funding available, can be considerable.

[Reorte]

On 21/12/2021 at 20:34, 62613 said:

Sadly, these days, Manchester ( the city) in general seems to be engaged in a headlong rush to erase any trace of its  past, however dirty. Utterly, utterly sad!

Got to make way for those bland, shiny lifeless towers that look like they could be anywhere in the world, can't let people be distracted from them!

[woodenhead]

22 minutes ago, Reorte said:

Got to make way for those bland, shiny lifeless towers that look like they could be anywhere in the world, can't let people be distracted from them!

Most of them are built on derelict empty land, the older buildings generally get refurbished and repurposed - Gmex, Great Northern Warehouse, the remaining goods warehouses near Piccadilly.  The Arndale - a 70s monstrosity looks better for it's enforced rebuild and that whole central area is quite nice if you take away all the people who inhabit the spaces.  Mayfield is due for development, it was never a piece of real architecture, more functional than anything so when it finally get's repurposed for retail and leisure properly it will  look better than it does now.

[phil-b259]

On 14/12/2021 at 02:20, Steamport Southport said:

It did. I think it was one of the commercial videos. Possibly this one.

 

https://www.telerail.co.uk/railway-dvds-railfilms-titles/archive-electric-traction-cab-rides/the-woodhead-route-cab-ride

 

Bonkers. I do wonder who is in charge of these museums that seem to have no interest in heritage. Yet will probably set up yet another kids play area that the kids just walk past instead. Or a café (as Manchester hasn't got hundreds of eateries...)

 

Shambles of a museum now. Last time I went was when Rocket was there and everything was filthy, and not in a "good" way like many transport museums usually are. Just a sense of dereliction as if no one cared.

 

 

 

Jason

 

You can be the most dedicated Heritage person out  when running a museum - but that counts for little if you don't have enough income to pay staff (including people to clean the exhibits), utility bills, keep the building itself in good condition etc.

 

Given the reluctance from central Government to properly fund the museum sector (and thus the reliance on Cafes, merchandise sales and chargeable 'extras' to generate income), frequently Heritage considerations must take a back seat when it comes to actually ensuring the museum can remain a going concern financially.

 

 

Edited January 5, 2022 by phil-b259

[Reorte]

15 hours ago, woodenhead said:

Most of them are built on derelict empty land, the older buildings generally get refurbished and repurposed - Gmex, Great Northern Warehouse, the remaining goods warehouses near Piccadilly.  The Arndale - a 70s monstrosity looks better for it's enforced rebuild and that whole central area is quite nice if you take away all the people who inhabit the spaces.  Mayfield is due for development, it was never a piece of real architecture, more functional than anything so when it finally get's repurposed for retail and leisure properly it will  look better than it does now.

What they're built on isn't the only thing that matters, it's also very important how they change the whole look and feel (which can be both good and bad, not that I've ever found the slightest appeal in skyscrapers).

[62613]

On 05/01/2022 at 18:17, woodenhead said:

Most of them are built on derelict empty land, the older buildings generally get refurbished and repurposed - Gmex, Great Northern Warehouse, the remaining goods warehouses near Piccadilly.  The Arndale - a 70s monstrosity looks better for it's enforced rebuild and that whole central area is quite nice if you take away all the people who inhabit the spaces.  Mayfield is due for development, it was never a piece of real architecture, more functional than anything so when it finally get's repurposed for retail and leisure properly it will  look better than it does now.

Does that include the one next door to the Britons' Protection? For which a planning application is pending?

 

[woodenhead]

42 minutes ago, 62613 said:

Does that include the one next door to the Britons' Protection? For which a planning application is pending?

 

?

[Johann Marsbar]

The Science Museum Group must now be in the process of informing the successful bidders for the items on that list as we have apparently received an e-mail this afternoon stating that we have got the Ransomes single decker trolleybus!  (after about 30 years of trying....)