Peterborough North

[Richard E]

Sorry my mistake. I've had a look at the ECOC website,( http://easterncountiesomnibusco.com/ecocroutes.html ) nearest I can find is the 306, Westfield Road to Dogsthorpe, though what route it took I have no idea!

Might be possible to include a coach though, could be going to pick up a load of schoolkids of out somewhere?

 

Stewart

If it is Westfield Road to Dogsthorpe then it wouldn't cross Spital Bridge but almost certainly the next one north (which is the eastern end of Westfield Road, Dogsthorpe is east of the ECML) and which is offscene for Gilbert.

 

I suspect the service would most likely have started at Baker Perkins on Westfield Road and ran to take workers to and from the Dogsthorpe estate. Nowadays that journey would involve a bus into the town centre and then a second one to Dogsthorpe.

[great northern]

Today I have had to apply one of my first rules of model railways. It goes like this: if it bugs you now, it will continue to bug you for all time, and probably even more so as time passes. I've been very fortunate with PN, as there has really been very little that has bugged me up to now, probably because for the first time in my life I planned it meticulously before even starting it.

 

Now though I have a problem staring me in the face, and it isn't going to go away. Spital bridge. While the temporary bridge was in place, I didn't have a problem, firstly because it was temporary, and secondly because it was in the right place. This one isn't, which is entirely my fault, not that of Peter Leyland, who built exactly what I asked for, namely this.

It is a lovely bridge, and correct in every detail, but it sits in the wrong place, as was shown in that recent head on shot of the B1 on the fish train. The whole thing really should be further to the left, and in the end I can't accept it. Eventually, I gingerly picked up Peter's bridge, and moved it over. For me, it worked, but it would involve alterations. I put it back hurriedly, and tried to get it as Peter had painstakingly done. I wasn't going to move it again, and so asked Andy Y if he could use his skills to alter photos to show it where I think it should be, which, bless him, he readily agreed to do.

 

We now need to consider the first image above. The bridge abutment prototypically is to the right of the DE siding, and its fence joins up to it. I moved the whole thing so that it butted up to the next track on the left, which is the engine road, and it seemed to work. It is then prototypically wrong, but then there should be more lines under the bridge anyway, and they should be straight, not on ridiculously tight curves.

If we then consider the second image, the thing to note is that the abutment should be in line with the sand drag, but isn't. Moving the whole thing across to butt up to the engine road on the right side though means that it is then in line. So far so good but the problem is that the left side abutment is now too far away from the track, which it wasn't, and would not have been, given the extra cost that would entail. There is a lot to be gained though by doing this. Which brings us to the big question? Should I do it?

 

Well, I invite your views on the subject, but first you need to see how it would look, and that is where Andy's phototrickery comes in.

The problem on this side is that the DE fence now can't run to the abutment, and if it is reset to run to the new position it bisects the siding. the only thing to do is as shown, which is to put a gate in the siding so that the DE area can be secured when it is closed for business. This is exactly what happened at the other end of the siding, by the way. It is tucked away into a corner anyway, and I reckon I can live with this.

 

Next we have a high level view of the bridge as it stands, and below as it would look if I follow my plan.

Now the abutment line up with the sand drag, and the Midland lines, if they existed, would line up with the brick arches, which I think shows how much better this is.

 

And so it comes down to this.

 

1. Is the fudge on the DE side acceptable? It will hardly be noticed, and most of that area is a work of fiction anyway.

 

2. And this is the one that matters. Is that gap between abutment and track just too great to be allowed? I know it is my train set and all that, but I really would appreciate some dispassionate and independent views on this. Of course it is wrong, but it looks more nearly right. Is it too wrong to contemplate though? Over to you.

[Market65]

It looks better in the new position. As you say the 'fudge' over the D&E siding is nothing to be concerned about. The gap between the abutment and the track looks quite acceptable to me. I would go ahead with the change.

 

With warmest regards,

 

Rob.

Edited May 9, 2016 by Market65

[Oldddudders]

Gaps where nothing appears are a feature of the railway scene, particularly in recent years when rationalisation of infrastructure has taken place. As such there is nothing wrong with your preferred location for the bridge. And the gate into the Civils' compound looks authentic. Do it and rejoice.

[stewartingram]

Stewart that hasn't linked or were you wanting us to cut and paste?

Phil

I couldn't link it I'm afraid. So a cut and paste is in order.

 

The 1st link to the Eastern Counties webpage should work ok.

The 2nd one to ehattons for the Oxford coach wouldn't copy, so I typed it in, just copy it to your browser search box.

The ebay links also wouldn't copy, so I've given the sale id, just put each of the 3 into the ebay search box. (Note, there may be others identicl but cheaper - I didn't look that far!).

 

Sorry about the confusion, it appears that the reply box on here is the problem in that the address could be copied b me ok (Control C), but could not be pasted into the box at all (Control V).

 

Incidentally I have posted a couple of relevant questions on the EC web page, I'll make sure any replies are put up on here.

 

Stewart

[rockershovel]

I agree, the sand drag/abutment detail is the main thing.

 

If the gap between track and abutment really troubles you, what about some minor work to the ground cover, to indicate a former trackbed in that location?

Edited May 9, 2016 by rockershovel

[Mallard60022]

I agree, the sand drag/abutment detail is the main thing.

 

If the gap between track and abutment really troubles you, what about some minor work to the ground cover, to indicate a former trackbed in that location?

.....good thinking, with some toning of the ballast colour (s) to create shadow?

Phil

[Theakerr]

Suggest it doesn't matter what we think, YOU will always know it is wrong.

[stewartingram]

How about re-aligning and lengthening the sand drag slightly, so that it encroaches on the path under the bridge?

 

Stewart

[uax6]

Or, sadly, getting the girder span of the bridge remade longer, so that it can then sit correctly at both ends?

 

Andy G

[great northern]

Thank you for all the replies and suggestions so far. I shall sleep on it, and see how things are in the morning, just in case anyone else has any views to contribute. In the meantime, here are a couple more pictures of less contentious areas.

I think I'm getting the hang of these under roof shots now, though they often seem to feature Ivatts for some reason. This time I've gone for a rather wider angle.

And here is Sun Castle about to join the Ivatt and contribute to the smoke under the roof. The train is the 5.00pm from Kings Cross, and will terminate here.

[trw1089]

Hi Gilbert

 

I do like the bridge in the proposed new spot and the gap between the running lines and the abutment could suggest a throwback to a removed track but I suppose that is not correct for the prototype then.  The new position just conveys more space down that end which would seem to fit better with the mainline railway that it is representing.

 

Like you have told me, once you know about these things, it is hard to ignore them, so just concentrate on what makes you satisfied with it.

 

Cheer
Tony

[Richard E]

I couldn't link it I'm afraid. So a cut and paste is in order.

 

Sorry about the confusion, it appears that the reply box on here is the problem in that the address could be copied b me ok (Control C), but could not be pasted into the box at all (Control V).

 

Stewart

Stewart

 

I get that problem using IE10 when at work, if I use Chrome, Safari or Firefox I can copy and paste without any problems.

 

Gilbert

 

I'm not sure if this helps at all but it does show that the main span of Spital Bridge is pretty long and there is a lot of unused trackbed space under it these days:

 

[great northern]

Stewart

 

I get that problem using IE10 when at work, if I use Chrome, Safari or Firefox I can copy and paste without any problems.

 

Gilbert

 

I'm not sure if this helps at all but it does show that the main span of Spital Bridge is pretty long and there is a lot of unused trackbed space under it these days:

 

Indeed it does.and I would think there can be few single span girder bridges longer than this.

[great northern]

Decision time. Thanks again for all the input. Had anyone told me that the bridge as suggested would be structurally wildly improbable, and/or that it would greatly detract from the realism of the scene, I would have been worried, as that is the last thing I would want to do. Thankfully, that hasn't happened, and so I shall ask Peter to do the necessary small alteration to the end of the bridge, and then reposition it as shown. I don't want to get into major alterations, either to the bridge itself or to the surrounding area, so all I shall do is to consider another small hut carefully positioned so as to hide the gap from track to abutment. As to the other side, I'll discuss that with Peter again once we have the bridge in its revised position. I have to say that I am greatly relieved to get this sorted.

 

Let us then move on to some more pictures.

Sun Castle about to enter the train shed. I do like the contrasting roof lines on this shot.

I don't think I've done  a shot with both platforms occupied before. Quite nice, really.

[Clearwater]

Have just whizzed through Peterborough so captured a quick shot of the bridge. Apols for any blurriness and reflection but I didn't think I could ask the driver to stop... Pic taken about 10 minutes ago

 

David

 

Edit: for some unknown reason picture is right way up on my phone album but wrong way up when I upload..

Edited May 10, 2016 by Clearwater

[The Stationmaster]

Does this help?

 

[LSWRlinesider]

Dear Gilbert,

 

I was at Winchester station last Saturday and saw a chap "sitting" on a platform bench that made me think of Peterborough North and previous conversations about "proper" reality versus actual reality!  

 

 

I was tempted for a fleeting moment to go over and "right" him to an acceptable position, but wisely thought better of it.

 

All best,

Matt

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jwealleans]

Are you sure he wasn't standing up but his blu-tak had gone soft?

[Mallard60022]

Dear Gilbert,

 

I was at Winchester station last Saturday and saw a chap "sitting" on a platform bench that made me think of Peterborough North and previous conversations about "proper" reality versus actual reality!  

 

improbable_passenger.jpg

 

I was tempted for a fleeting moment to go over and "right" him to an acceptable position, but wisely thought better of it.

 

All best,

Matt

Presumably he was too lazy (or very cautious) about removing a rucksack? If not, he is storing up big trouble for old age with that posture.....bl**dy spinal nightmare.

(Station announcement from friendly staff member; "Sit up young man on Platform 1, that position will do you no good at all".

That is, of course, unless it is the relaxation version of a reverse 'Plank' exercise. Or he might be rigor mortised of course having waited for days for his train!

[great northern]

Tonight's featured train is another Grantham arrival, this time the 6.20pm from that vibrant hub of life.

I tried for a different angle, which doesn't quite come off, and as for those signals.

And so we revert to a more familiar view. Anyone from Corby Glen or Essendine hoping to sample the fleshpots of Peterborough will need to get a move on, as the last train back leaves in less than an hour.

[great northern]

I have friends from Wolverhampton MRC visiting today. At least if things fall off they will tell me why, and even most times stop it happening again. Should you wonder why I don't know these things myself, the answer is that I have never been an operator of an exhibition layout, and they assure me that a few years of doing that is how to pick up all these tips. And now of course I am of an age where the things I'm told don't always stick in my mind.

 

A couple more images first though.

Getting on for 7.30pm now, and the Ramsey branch loco's day is nearly done, as it returns with the Holme pick up, which will be almost exclusively traffic from the branch. Mainly empty minerals, but there are some vans out of sight at the back.

Another attempt to do something artistic.I must stop trying to do so.

[great northern]

A very pleasant day with good friends, and, after a bad start, a layout that behaved quite well. Then a visit to our local curry house, so I've had little time to spare, so I picked one image that was very easy to deal with.

Just the J6 again, about to pass under Spital Bridge, after which it will almost immediately cut across the main lines and into New England yards.

[great northern]

I've had all sorts of computer problems this morning- no e-mail - running incredibly slowly- all that stuff. Eventually, with a blinding flash of inspiration, I connected this problem with the presence of a very large Virgin Media van, parked in plain sight by a junction box. Could this be the answer? It is all back on now anyway. All this meant that it took a long time to process one image, and it didn't turn out too well as a result.

Fuzzy black and white covers a multitude of sins, but not all. 60117 is at the head of the 6.20pm KX- Leeds.

[great northern]

One of our photographers has been permitted to climb up something, I'm not sure what, and can now give us some slightly different views. As nothing is actually moving when he gets settled down, he first records a B17 which has come up from East with a short parcels train. The stock for the 8.58pm to Grimsby is in the bay.

He then leans a bit further to capture a local B1 in Platform 3, which has brought in the 5.52pm from Kings Cross. Earlier in its journey, it had formed part of one of the very few regular double headed services on this part of the ECML. The train split at Hitchin though, and the other part, behind a B17, headed off to Cambridge.