Peterborough North

[2750Papyrus]

I think it has to be a Beyer-Garratt, representing a unique type of locomotive from the Gorton foundry in addition to representing the LMS.

[Metropolitan H]

I can see the attraction of the LMS Beyer-Garratt 2-6-6-2 locos, but there are other Beyer-Garratts preserved in UK, albeit most are narrow-gauge and the standard gauge one(s) of the 0-4-40 type and there are better large ones preserved in Africa and Australia - see NSWGR class AD60 No.6029, watch 

Also I'm not convinced that the LMS types were that marvellous? - If they had been better you would have expected there to have been more built instead of the 8Fs and later the Riddles MOS 2-10-0s and the BR 9Fs?

 

So my vote goes to the Fowler Class 4 2-6-4T - another good big tank loco which started a succession of good Class 4 tank designs.

 

Regards

Chris H

[landscapes]

4 hours ago, great northern said:

Back to the big green engines, the correct green too. Prince of Wales has the heavy 13 coach Up Ripon.

 

 

Hi Gilbert 

 

Lovely finish to the A3 Tim’s work by chance?

 

Very nice photo.

 

Regards

 

David

[New Haven Neil]

The Fowler 2-6-4T for me too, a good design with modern features - that were not always carried on to subsequent Fowler locomotives.  Rather good looking too, especially with the original type cab not the 'limousine'  side window job.

[LNER4479]

Sorry to interrupt the poll, but hopefully our glorious leader will appreciate a quick update on the latest signal replacement construction.

 

 

They've now got arms! Don't worry about the angle of them at this stage; there's adjustment on the 'stops' which will be fine-tuned as each one is finally fitted. Rest assured that both structures are the same height - it's just the way the right hand one is propped up for this photo!

 

As you can see, they also now have a covering of paint. What I've done (for now) is a coat of grey primer, followed by a waft of white so that we start from a darker base than virgin white. A modicum of weathering on top of this should give the desired effect. The arms however are more of a definite white base colour, upon which to paint the red and black. As always seems to be the case, the camera hasn't fully replicated the actual colour of them.

 

Right - back to the poll ...

Edited February 23, 2021 by LNER4479

[great northern]

4 hours ago, AHW said:

Hi there,

 

Polite question - where do your signals come from?

 

Apologies if this info is already on the thread.

 

Many Thanks

If it is, it is a very long way back, and I wouldn't expect you to trawl through all that. The signals were professionally built, and some go back to my previous layout, so they are 25 years old. I think the builder used MSE parts almost exclusively. Some are now showing their age, and as you will see from the post above are being replaced. One already has been, having come off worse in a collision with my elbow.

[great northern]

1 hour ago, LNER4479 said:

Sorry to interrupt the poll, but hopefully our glorious leader will appreciate a quick update on the latest signal replacement construction.

 

 

They've now got arms! Don't worry about the angle of them at this stage; there's adjustment on the 'stops' which will be fine-tuned as each one is finally fitted. Rest assured that both structures are the same height - it's just the way the right hand one is propped up for this photo!

 

As you can see, they also now have a covering of paint. What I've done (for now) is a coat of grey primer, followed by a waft of white so that we start from a darker base than virgin white. A modicum of weathering on top of this should give the desired effect. The arms however are more of a definite white base colour, upon which to paint the red and black. As always seems to be the case, the camera hasn't fully replicated the actual colour of them.

 

Right - back to the poll ...

You can interrupt the polls any time you like to show things like this. Looking great Graham, and it seems that in only four months time we may be able to see them in place. Good news indeed. And I can see already that they will be much easier to photoshop.

[Sandhole]

7 hours ago, great northern said:

Not many votes in this poll, but almost half of them were for a Metropolitan 2.6.4T.

 

Now we come to post grouping locomotives, either built or rebuilt after 1923, and right up to the end of steam. No blue lecktrickity things. Again we are looking for glaring gaps in preservation, and we will start with the LMS.

Very ordinary,
Fowler and Stanier 2Cylinder 2-6-4 tanks.

[Sandhole]

4 hours ago, Metropolitan H said:

I can see the attraction of the LMS Beyer-Garratt 2-6-6-2 locos, but there are other Beyer-Garratts preserved in UK, albeit most are narrow-gauge and the standard gauge one(s) of the 0-4-40 type and there are better large ones preserved in Africa and Australia - see NSWGR class AD60 No.6029, watch 

Also I'm not convinced that the LMS types were that marvellous? - If they had been better you would have expected there to have been more built instead of the 8Fs and later the Riddles MOS 2-10-0s and the BR 9Fs?

 

So my vote goes to the Fowler Class 4 2-6-4T - another good big tank loco which started a succession of good Class 4 tank designs.

 

Regards

Chris H

If the LMS had let Beyer Peacock build the 2-6-2_2-6-2 they wanted to build, the Garratts would have been a far better beast.

[Sandhole]

Totally off the wall, British Legion.

[jazzer]

A difficult one again. The choice for me is between the Beyer -Garrets , the Stanier class 3 2-6-2’s and the Fowler 2-6-4 tanks.

 If we are talking about preservation the Garrett is far too expensive to run and to big to be transported by road from one preserved line to another. The Stanier class 3’s are really good lookers but rubbish steamers so not a great proposition in service.

So we are left with the Fowler’s, wonderful go anywhere , do anything locos , capable of anything from express work to Station pilots , and according at least one ex-fireman faster than the Staniers and the Standard 4’s on the LTS section. 

Like the economic Standard 4 tanks the the ideal  loco for preserved lines. So that’s my vote.

[robmcg]

Much as I admire the Patriot and 2-6-4T my vote must go here...  LMS Garratt.

 

[thegreenhowards]

Fowler 2-6-4T for me. Two worked on the GN out of Hitchin so I even have an excuse to run one on my layout and they represent the only LMS power that I run.

[Flying Fox 34F]

Fowler 2-6-4t.  
Just read an article in the latest edition of Irish Railway Record Society magazine about the links between these and the W Moguls and the WT Jeeps over on the NCC LMS.  Turns out the Fowler tank is based on a Hughes Crab!

 

Paul

[robmcg]

1 minute ago, Flying Fox 34F said:

Fowler 2-6-4t.  
Just read an article in the latest edition of Irish Railway Record Society magazine about the links between these and the W Moguls and the WT Jeeps over on the NCC LMS.  Turns out the Fowler tank is based on a Hughes Crab!

 

Paul

 

You could do a lot worse!  LMS was blessed. 

[great northern]

Prince of Wales at rest is passed by a local V2 on parcels duty.

 

 

[manna]

G'day Folks

 

I'm going for the Fowler 2-6-2T, Ugly as sin, and basically useless, so I've been told.

 

manna 

[Brian Hawkins]

Beyer Garratt for me Gilbert.

Edited February 23, 2021 by Brian Hawkins

[great northern]

Just a dirty run down V2 next. As grey as the morning is here.

 

 

[jollysmart]

Beyer - Garratt for me, such a big ugly beast of a locomotive.

[Sandhole]

11 hours ago, manna said:

G'day Folks

 

I'm going for the Fowler 2-6-2T, Ugly as sin, and basically useless, so I've been told.

 

manna 

The Manchester boys called 'em Breadvans.
Willesdon called 'em Surface Raiders. Made loads of smoke and all else.
The Bacup boys thought they were great.
Chris.

[great northern]

Another very close poll. Fowler 2.6.4T 8, Beyer Garratt 7. I suppose the reason for preservation matters when making these decisions. Are the locos to be museum pieces, or are they meant to have a working life? A Garratt would seem to fall firmly into the first category. Also, what about technical innovation, historical significance, and to a degree the loco's success or failure in traffic?  A Stanier 3mt for example was reputed to be a complete dud.

 

Next was going to be the Southern Railway, but there may be a major problem here, as a bit of research seems to show that just about every class introduced after the grouping has a preserved example. Of course I may be wrong, it happens quite often, so can anyone think of a Southern loco built or rebuilt after 1923 which hasn't been preserved, but ought to have been?

[great northern]

3 minutes ago, jollysmart said:

Beyer - Garratt for me, such a big ugly beast of a locomotive.

Vote came in after I had started the count I'm afraid, otherwise we would have a tie again.

[Sandhole]

Z 0-8-0, H16, G16, W2-6-4., J class 4-6-2 tank.
U1 2-6-0., Remembrance 4-6-0.
I'll stop now. I'm rambling.
Chris.

Edited February 24, 2021 by Sandhole

[Oldddudders]

Rebuilt after 1923 would include N15x 4-6-0s, and E1r 0-6-2s. The former were rather average performers, having started life as LBSCR Baltic tanks, where they could lift the heaviest trains up Grosvenor Bank with little difficulty, but in their new incarnation on the former LSWR were not equal to the N15 they resembled. The E1r began in the C19 as little 0-6-0 tanks, but were rebuilt into something a little more powerful that lasted into the 1950s.