brian777999 Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 I am building a Ratio OO gauge clerestory roof LMS coach. It is one of those projects that has spanned many months. I built and painted the roof section first then set it aside for a few months.When it came time to fit the roof to the completed body I found that the roof had a large bow in it. Acting on some advice from the old forum, I painted underneath the roof as best I could (lots of ribwork prevent total coverage) hoping that this might eventually pull it back into shape. I have also placed it between the pages of a large and fairly heavy book. It has been about 4 weeks now and the bend in the roof is still there. I think it may have lessened a bit but there is still too much curvature to attach it evenly to the coach body. Does anybody have any other possible solutions I could try ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poor Old Bruce Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 I would not have thought you should get any problems with these roofs unless you have used some unusual paint which has attacked the plastic in some way or it has been exposed to excessive heat. It is a bummer if you have spent a lot of time fitting all the vents and lamp tops but your best bet may be to get a new set of roof mouldings from Ratio. Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
3 link Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 I model in o gauge but the same applies when I have had trouble with coach or van roofs, what I do is paint on Butanone solvent around the area with the bend in it and then actually attach it to the body with the Butanone as well. I use a couple of rubber bands to hold in place until finally set. Butanone seems to soften the plastic just enough to make it pliable and is more commonly used with harder plastics like A.B.S. Regards, Martyn. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian777999 Posted November 1, 2009 Author Share Posted November 1, 2009 The problem is that it is not one small area with a bend ; the whole coach roof is slightly bent. Looking at it from the side, the middle of the bottom edge of the coach roof is about 2mm higher than the ends. I have thought about buying a new roof assembly but I doubt that Ratio/Peco would sell me one. I will keep the heavy book on it for now. Perhaps putting it in the hot sun for a few hours might soften the plastic enough to flatten it out. The rubber bands are a good idea; I will remember that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 96701 Posted November 1, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 1, 2009 Perhaps putting it in the hot sun for a few hours might soften the plastic enough to flatten it out. You don't live in Britain, then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 I have thought about buying a new roof assembly but I doubt that Ratio/Peco would sell me one. I think that you might be pleasantly surprised ! Ratio used to have boxes of individual mouldings, including roofs, for sale, very cheaply, at model exhibitions. Always worth an e-mail, anyway. Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertiedog Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 You would appear to have an advantageous situation if the middle is bowed up and the ends down, what is wrong?, as if the centre is pulled down to fit the warp should settle nicely, and firmly hold the ends down. Few makers of coaches think through fitting the roof !! The best way is still to use long bolt from the floor to the ceiling, hopefully concealed by structure, and in the case of the ratio it would only need a single long bolt to secure all and cure the warp in one go. I have had amazing conversations with kit coach makers , especially brass etched types , who when pressed admit that the reason they do not cover how to fit the roof, and imply it is up to the builder due to the many ways people do it, is that the real reason is, they have no idea how to arrange the fit properly anyway!!!! A coach should have a removable roof, or a removable floor or both! too many kits use the structure to support the roof, when it should simply be a top hat that fits!! I am pretty sure Ratio would supply spares, ask for help, they will not want to lose a customer. Stephen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 I have had amazing conversations with kit coach makers , especially brass etched types , who when pressed admit that the reason they do not cover how to fit the roof, and imply it is up to the builder due to the many ways people do it, is that the real reason is, they have no idea how to arrange the fit properly anyway!!!! That explains a lot When I first started building brass coaches and vans, I thought it was just me who didn't know. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertiedog Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 That explains a lot When I first started building brass coaches and vans, I thought it was just me who didn't know. Nick I had some seven mm coaches where the side structure was supporting and aligning the roof, and roof was aligning the sides, and acting as part of the structure, which aligned the floor, which did not exist, as it was not supplied... where do you start correcting such idiocy? It appeared the hand of God would be involved by some miraculous intervention to hold the whole thing together, as no method was supplied in the instructions. The kit maker suggested glueing the lot together, solid, no way of getting in, and no way of glazing etc., what was he thinking of? Stephen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian777999 Posted November 1, 2009 Author Share Posted November 1, 2009 Some good points have been made : 1. I will contact Ratio and see what they say about a spare roof. 2. I had considered a screw or bolt from underneath the floor and fastened to the underside of the roof but I thought I was being a bit desperate. I will have another think about how it might be done. At the moment there is not much plastic under the roof into which anything can be screwed. This is how Triang/Hornby fastened their clerestory roofs to the coach. 3. Yes, I live in Cairns,Australia... plenty of hot sun here ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertiedog Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Some good points have been made : 1. I will contact Ratio and see what they say about a spare roof. 2. I had considered a screw or bolt from underneath the floor and fastened to the underside of the roof but I thought I was being a bit desperate. I will have another think about how it might be done. At the moment there is not much plastic under the roof into which anything can be screwed. This is how Triang/Hornby fastened their clerestory roofs to the coach. 3. Yes, I live in Cairns,Australia... plenty of hot sun here ! The bolt to the roof does not actually have to be a long bolt, for instance a wire, rod, tube, will do, with a nut of bolt soldered to the end under the floor for tightening down. With a clerestory roof a block of plastic can easily be added and hidden under the roof to thicken at the point the bolt or wire runs from, even on an ordinary roof a block thickener will not show. Brass tube is uesful for extending bolts, solder stubs of thread into the tube. Stephen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poor Old Bruce Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Ratio used to have boxes of individual mouldings, including roofs, for sale, very cheaply, at model exhibitions. They don't carry them round these days ( I doubt they got to Australia anyway) but told me that they can supply by post. Richard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian777999 Posted November 2, 2009 Author Share Posted November 2, 2009 Good news : I have just received a reply from Peco/Ratio. They asked for my address and are sending me out a replacement roof. You cannot ask for better than that ! Still, I like the idea of a removable roof and I will give this idea some thought when building future projects. I agree that all roofs should be removable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60B Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 How about clips inside the ends that keep the roof on under operating conditions and come away with some effort? Only problem could be with lighting, but that could be solved with a plug. Brian, good to hear you got a result. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Still, I like the idea of a removable roof and I will give this idea some thought when building future projects. I agree that all roofs should be removable. Crudely, this is how I do it. (I'm using it on a rake of Kitmaster Midland Pullman cars at present). The false ceiling is stuck to and braces the roof moulding - helps avoid warping !! Typically, the side / roof joint is very poorly (if at all) thought out by the kit manufacturer. My solution braces the sides apart and gives you something to screw the roof fixing screws into. The false ceiling is fairly thick plastic card, with the nuts encapsulated by a couple of additional layers of plastic card. I use two screws at approximately the 1/3 and 2/3 positions, to suit partition positions. Suitable length countersunk screws are quite easily obtainable in BA sizes at least. This roof-on-last arrangements aids the installation of the interior, I find. Regards, John Isherwood. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Just to be contrary, I prefer the floor to come out - I have much less trouble hiding a solebar level joint than a removable roof. I use the same approach as Danny Pinnock - small bolts into captive nuts in each corner. A glance at my workbench should show you what I mean. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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