2FS - Smokey Bacon

[SteveBedding]

best wishes to you steve - assume that cake is now history?

 

Sadly not yet

 

This is on two counts 1) It looks too good to eat, and 2) still too stuffed replete after the large intake of croissants/pastries, turkey etc, nibbles, more turkey (cold cuts this time), cheese platter, with all those pesky little gaps filled with copious quantities of sherry (?!) , G&T, vino, and vintage port... .

 

The body finally decided that the cake may be the Xmas equivalent of Mr Creosotes 'wafer thin mint' and at last the brain over-ruled the eyes and said ENOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

(Why can't Santa bring Gaviscon / Alka-Seltzer instead of socks and Old Spice )

[SteveBedding]

I like the wagons despite your concern re the transfers. The 2mfs/N gauge size issue is bound to crop up now and then.

I wonder if the GWR was happier taking its own vehicles on the end of passenger trains hence getting faster delivery so maybe that why Harris used them a lot.

I think there was some brass chairs at expo probably went quick though.

Don

 

Merry Christmas Don,

 

I wholly agree with you in liking the wagons and my observation was a reflection on the differences between N and 2mm scales (not a criticism at all ). I think the Neate (and Pinniger) PO Wagon transfers could be from Robbies Rolling Stock and are aimed at the RTR Peco/Farish 5-plank wagons; for 2mm ones (especially the 1887 RCH 5 plank open wagon) it may be more appropriate to print your own (as Mitziblue has done on Witney Euston) to get the correct overall size and proportions.

 

 

Other representations I have seen for the Pinniger and Neate wagons are...

 

 

...these are the ones from Robbies, and below is one from Powsides...

 

 

...all this leads to another 'project' that I'll get round to eventually

[queensquare]

I wholly agree with you in liking the wagons and my observation was a reflection on the differences between N and 2mm scales (not a criticism at all ). I think the Neate (and Pinniger) PO Wagon transfers could be from Robbies Rolling Stock and are aimed at the RTR Peco/Farish 5-plank wagons; for 2mm ones (especially the 1887 RCH 5 plank open wagon) it may be more appropriate to print your own (as Mitziblue has done on Witney Euston) to get the correct overall size and proportions.

 

 

Robbie is happy to resize the transfers to fit scale length wagons. I have had a number done to fit the excellent Matheison wagons and intend getting some more done to suit 2mm Association kits. Another advantage is that they look a lot better on scale length wagons as a lot of Robbies artwork has been stretched to fit the way over scale Peco wagons which distorts the lettering.

Do you know if any of the Calne merchants got any of their coal in North Somerset - if so I might try a couple on Highbury. Merry Christmas to one and all and hope to see some of you at the Calne show in a few weeks.

 

Jerry

http://www.jerrycliffordmodels.co.uk/

[M.I.B]

I am loving the Neate's wagon - does anyone do it RTR, or a kit for it, or even just the decals in 00?

 

I agree with the Harris vans, but it'll be a pleasant reminder of Calne rolling along amongst the rest of my stock. There's a fair bit of modeller's licence issued to my collection - it's all GWR, mostly post war, but there's room for a Dean Goods and rakes of clerestories of different sizes. My 9707 is going to be a little further West than would be expected, but each to their own.

[SteveBedding]

I am loving the Neate's wagon - does anyone do it RTR, or a kit for it, or even just the decals in 00?

 

Merry Xmas MIB

 

I think Robbie will do 00 transfers if you ask him (see Jerry's post above) - its certainly worth asking the question. Otherwise, Powsides do the transfers for Neates in 4mm for £3.80 (but they don't do the Pinniger scheme) . The also do 4mm kits for that real feel of achievement / challenge / frustration...

[SteveBedding]

Do you know if any of the Calne merchants got any of their coal in North Somerset - if so I might try a couple on Highbury. Merry Christmas to one and all and hope to see some of you at the Calne show in a few weeks.

 

Jerry

http://www.jerrycliffordmodels.co.uk/

 

Jerry

 

I can't for definite say that some of Highbury's coal made it to Calne - but conversely, I can't say that it didn't! On that basis I would expect to see a Highbury coal wagon mysteriously appearing on Smokey Bacon eventually

 

If subsequently proven to be not 100% prototypical, we can just put it down to advertising and a PR stunt for your layout

[queensquare]

Jerry

 

I can't for definite say that some of Highbury's coal made it to Calne - but conversely, I can't say that it didn't! On that basis I would expect to see a Highbury coal wagon mysteriously appearing on Smokey bacon eventually

 

If subsequently proven to be not 100% prototypical, we can just put it down to advertising and a PR stunt for your layout

 

 

As Highbury colliery, and the wagons are completely fictitious I'm afraid........

 

That said, I would love to see a Highbury wagon at Calne and can let you have a suitable set of Robbies transfers when I see you next - see rear cover of 2mm mag a couple of issues ago.

 

regards Jerry

[Kris]

NIce to see the start that you have made on the point work Steve. As far as the cast chairs go I don't think that you would ever notice if one chair was not there and was replaced with some solder. Having threaded on the brass sleepers for the plain track, I found these more problematic than threading on the chairs for point work, not much but enough to cause much amusement in others from the language used.

[Pilgrimsjulie]

Well Swmbo is pleased that the track work is being started.... I have also seen a little wagon being tempted along the track to test it and that was so exciting. Not only that but exceptionally pleased that I get my dining table for every meal time...thanks for that Wont be long until it will be made into the modelling room again!!

[SteveBedding]

As Highbury colliery, and the wagons are completely fictitious I'm afraid........

 

That said, I would love to see a Highbury wagon at Calne and can let you have a suitable set of Robbies transfers when I see you next - see rear cover of 2mm mag a couple of issues ago.

 

regards Jerry

Ahhh - that's probably why I couldn't find it on the map - best I read the layout descriptions more carefully in future... ...and yes please to the Highbury transfers; I'll be at the Calne show with Mark (and maybe SWMBO) in the Saturday and will no doubt see you there.

 

...Having threaded on the brass sleepers for the plain track, I found these more problematic than threading on the chairs for point work, not much but enough to cause much amusement in others from the language used...

 

Thanks for the top-tip Kris - I get in the doo-doo often enough already without adding any more causes

 

Anyway, back to the layout.

 

Several weeks ago, I started to try and make the crossing assemblies for the points using the 2mm Association Easitrac filing and soldering jigs, and have found that this process, whilst theoretically simple, became quite a challenge. After a lot of practising, I have finally achieved what I consider to be an acceptable standard and feel I can move forward again . As I suspected, the difficulties were all due to the operator (ie Me), rather than the equipment and the concept!

 

The obvious approach (well I thought it was ) to soldering the metal strips across the rails in the soldering jig was to use my trusty resin-cored solder and normal iron, and hey-presto, everything would work out just fine! WRONG! Subsequent experimentation with differing solder types, putting the aluminium jig on the iron to minimise the heat-sink effect, and even using a blow torch all proved to be interesting but ultimately it came down to using 145 solder, with the rails and brass strip pre-tinned, and (surprisingly) only a minimum amount of flux!

 

 

...I've had the old 100W solder 'gun' since the early '80s for fixing the electrics on an '69 Austin 1100 MkII and wouldn't normally consider using it for modelling purposes . (A side benefit of this experimentation is that we now have a 'spare' iron, and I've suggested that SWMBO may like the the larger blow-lamp to make crème brulée).

 

Previously (after building the first assembly) I had considered that the suggested positions for the cross bracing of the crossing was not going to provide the most robust solution, and following further discussion had considered an alternative...

 

 

...in practice, when the cross braces were properly soldered, I found that the 4 positions could 'closed-up' with no loss of rigidity - this had the benefit of allowing additional chairs to be used thus better structurally and cosmetically. Coincidently, the easiest 'scrap' etch/brass strip to hand was 0.010" x 0.060" which could be 'lost' if aligned with the sleepers. The most significant change was to put one of the cross-braces directly under the 'knuckle' of the wing-rails; this prevented compression and distortion when the crossing assembly was fixed down...

 

 

...depending on how this works out, I may consider putting in a 5th brace (under the nose) on later iterations. The picture below shows the completed crossing, and how the cross braces are 'lost' over the sleepers.

 

 

Using the usual range of gauges, the main elements of the two points have been completed...

 

 

...other than the threading of the various chairs (Top-Tip: It really is essential to put the effort in to properly dressing the ends of the rails; any sharp edges will break the chairs!) the actual construction of the point at this stage is very straight-forward, and after the frustrations of soldering the crossings, and real feeling of progress and achievement. :dance_mini:

 

And lastly, just prove that it all worked (to this stage at least), the first 'train' ran on the railway! Well OK, an old test chassis rolled all of 145mm when the board was on a slope but the thought was there...

 

 

Now, I need to learn how to file the blades and make the stretcher/tie-bar, but, since SWMBO has poured me a G&T that would stop a charging rhino at 50 paces, I think my concentration could get impaired

[Chrislock]

Hi Steve, glad to see you are making progress.

Interesting to see how you fixed the V with one rail slightly overlapping the other.

I find on my jig that the 2 rails won't sit correctly when filed away evenly, as the photos in last Feb/Mar magazine seem to show? I assume there is some leeway in this as long as its filed to profile afterwards.

I'll be following your track building with interest.

Regards,

Chris

[Chinahand]

Hi Steve,

 

When I first read through your post and saw the iron in the vice I had wild imaginations of you getting clobbered by SWMBO when she found out.

 

As it turns out my fears were unfounded and you have my total admiration for your track building. I just do not have either the skill or the patience for it.

 

Keep up the good work.

[Kris]

Have you filed the sleepers down to account for the scrap etch under the frog? It's good to here that the wagon ran through happily.

For filing the blades patience is your best weapon. Don't do it to fast or you might stab yourself with the blade you are filing down, guess how I found that out

 

Chris - overlapping the rails at the frog provides for a good join. The images on the 2mm website show this done, and I do it this way.

[mitziblue]

Excelent work Steve

Now got two tutors when it comes to building my points

Still think my guess of 2011 to yours of 2020 was closer for compleation.

 

Mark

[SteveBedding]

...Interesting to see how you fixed the V with one rail slightly overlapping the other.

I find on my jig that the 2 rails won't sit correctly when filed away evenly, as the photos in last Feb/Mar magazine seem to show? I assume there is some leeway in this as long as its filed to profile afterwards...

 

Hi Chris

 

Although I can't find the reference at the moment, the 'overlapping' of the rails is correct. The 'point rail' (excuse the terminology errors) of the main direction leads spur rail (divergent track); I had a long chat with some people on the P4 stand at Warley (it was easier to see this in the larger scale ) and even their demonstration display had half of the points incorrectly made (but they did acknowledge the fact).

 

One thing I did find with using the filing jig for soldering the 'Nose' was that great care had to be taken in ensuring that the rails were sitting true in the grooves; because of the offset clamping effect, it was usual for one or other of the rails to naturally sit at a slight tilt and if not spotted would completely bu$%^& up the assembly

 

 

Hi Steve,

 

When I first read through your post and saw the iron in the vice I had wild imaginations of you getting clobbered by SWMBO when she found out.

 

As it turns out my fears were unfounded and you have my total admiration for your track building. I just do not have either the skill or the patience for it.

 

Keep up the good work.

 

Thanks for the concern Trevor

 

I confess to not being brave enough to risk the wrath of SWMBO in using her iron; I did considerately purchase my own (for purely modelling purposes) from that big green butt-slapping supermarket for the princely sum of £3.84 (less the 10% staff discount of course) and even she cant accuse me of being extravagant at that price

 

 

Have you filed the sleepers down to account for the scrap etch under the frog? It's good to here that the wagon ran through happily.

For filing the blades patience is your best weapon. Don't do it to fast or you might stab yourself with the blade you are filing down, guess how I found that out

 

Chris - overlapping the rails at the frog provides for a good join. The images on the 2mm website show this done, and I do it this way.

 

Kris

 

I found it wasn't necessary to adjust the sleepers in any way. The chairs lift the rail slightly more than 0.010" above the sleeper and by using 10 thou brass strip I found that it sat nicely on the sleepers. I did remember to fill down any excess solder on the underside of the strip before fitting the assemblies.

 

Thanks for the tip on filing the blades - I'll make sure the First Aid kit is on hand before I start!

[SteveBedding]

Excelent work Steve

Now got two tutors when it comes to building my points

Still think my guess of 2011 to yours of 2020 was closer for compleation.

 

Mark

 

Thanks for the vote of confidence - I'm still sticking to the 2020 target, though I'm gradually beginning to believe that 2011 may be possible for the track-work...

 

...but don't let SWMBO know of the revised time-scales

[Chrislock]

Hi Chris

 

Although I can't find the reference at the moment, the 'overlapping' of the rails is correct. The 'point rail' (excuse the terminology errors) of the main direction leads spur rail (divergent track); I had a long chat with some people on the P4 stand at Warley (it was easier to see this in the larger scale ) and even their demonstration display had half of the points incorrectly made (but they did acknowledge the fact).

 

One thing I did find with using the filing jig for soldering the 'Nose' was that great care had to be taken in ensuring that the rails were sitting true in the grooves; because of the offset clamping effect, it was usual for one or other of the rails to naturally sit at a slight tilt and if not spotted would completely bu$%^& up the assembly

 

 

Hi Steve,

Funnily enough I naturally resorted to setting the V in the way you have, mainly out of inevitability as it was the only way I could get it to sit in the jig properly- I can't think why I felt "guilty" doing it this way - as they work anyway!

It shows how sound the advice is to always look at the prototype - or larger scales - or indeed others work!

Regards,

Chris

[SteveBedding]

Hi Steve,

Funnily enough I naturally resorted to setting the V in the way you have, mainly out of inevitability as it was the only way I could get it to sit in the jig properly- I can't think why I felt "guilty" doing it this way - as they work anyway!

It shows how sound the advice is to always look at the prototype - or larger scales - or indeed others work!

Regards,

Chris

 

Chris

 

Found the reference. Look at the top of Page 30 of 'The Beginner's Guide to 2mm Finescale Modelling' (I'm guessing you have this ?) ; this covers the alignment / staggering of the point rail (I got that right) and the splice rail (OK not the spur rail...)

 

Hope this helps, Happy New Year

[SteveBedding]

Outstanding - I'm on a roll !!!!

 

Having got the crossing assemblies and the main parts of the points successfully completed, I felt brave enough to try the blades! After much unsuccessful 'Googling' to look for guidance I finally found a useful chapter in 'The Beginner's Guide to 2mm Finescale Modelling' - why I didn't think to look there first is beyond me - I suppose it's like reading the instructions with any new toy / device / tool / kite etc

 

So, after finding a piece of aluminium angle section (convenient off-cut from cassettes) and some double-sided sticky tape (here I express my gratitude to the office stationary cupboard for the useful items it stocks - at my request... ) the careful use of assorted files and fine wet & dry produced four very acceptable blades in quite a short time. This was another task I was not looking forward to and I have to say I was pleasantly surprised how easy it really was!

 

...For filing the blades patience is your best weapon. Don't do it to fast or you might stab yourself with the blade you are filing down, guess how I found that out ...

 

Thanks to Kris' timely and pertinent advice I managed this with only drawing blood once... The 2 blades (switch rails) fitted very comfortably and produced a nice flowing curve...

 

 

Having found the necessary reference work, it appeared that 'perceived wisdom' indicated that joggles were not necessary - if the blades were suitably filed to a 'wafer' thin end.

 

Firstly apologies for the photo! This close up it really does show all the warts; thankfully (hopefully?) painting and ballasting will cover this... Bearing in mind that the rail is approximately 0.5mm wide, the tip of the blade tapers to a thickness of less than 0.1mm!

 

 

I have one elongated chair plate to replace and still got to come up with the details of how the stretcher / tie-bar is going to be done. but I have remembered to drill through the baseboard for the throwing mechanism from the tortoise motor. I know this sound obvious but........

 

Lastly, the trusty test wagon came out to play, and now can freely roll a grand distance of 35cm !!!

 

 

Now that's done, I can sit back and enjoy a well earned drink and see in the New Year with the feeling that progress is being made :D

[Donw]

Steve if you look up all the prototype guff the curved switches semi curved and straight. I file mine as straight and then curve them if required. For an A switch about a 1:24 taper and 1:36 for a B switch. FOR 0.5mm wide rail thats over a 12mm or 18mm length. I start with a medium file and finish with a fine file otherwise it takes ages. The big no-no is to produce a curved taper its not so bad dished but a convex curve will not fit snuggly against the rail. A set in the curved rail ( as per prototype) helps. And do remember to always file towards the point. I like your ideas on the brass tabs to connect the wing rails. I have been using just the two in 0 gauge. I found using the C+L 0 gauge chairs I need to fix some before soldering the tabs on. I presume your chairs will just be cosmetic and the brass tabs will hold the assembly down. Makes sense.

Don

[mitziblue]

Steve posted at 22:55,what the hell is up with you should of been in a pub. rambling over just got in off to bed

 

Mark

 

p.s god i'm suprised i can still type

[SteveBedding]

Steve if you look up all the prototype guff the curved switches semi curved and straight. I file mine as straight and then curve them if required. For an A switch about a 1:24 taper and 1:36 for a B switch. FOR 0.5mm wide rail thats over a 12mm or 18mm length. I start with a medium file and finish with a fine file otherwise it takes ages. The big no-no is to produce a curved taper its not so bad dished but a convex curve will not fit snuggly against the rail. A set in the curved rail ( as per prototype) helps. And do remember to always file towards the point. I like your ideas on the brass tabs to connect the wing rails. I have been using just the two in 0 gauge. I found using the C+L 0 gauge chairs I need to fix some before soldering the tabs on. I presume your chairs will just be cosmetic and the brass tabs will hold the assembly down. Makes sense.

Don

 

Don

 

I have to put my hands up here and acknowledge my ignorance - I never realised that there was a difference in the way you would prepare a curved switch rail I have followed the practice you described (probably accidentally...) and although the 2mm reference suggests a taper of about 1:10, I thought this was a bit steep and have gone for about 1:20.

 

As to the brass tags, these will secure the rails (prevent slippage in the chairs) and provide power connectivity, and I have got some Versaline cosmetic chairs to apply if possible.

 

Happy New Year

[bcnPete]

Old Spice

:lol: didn't know they still made that...

 

I always used to get given the 'Hi Karate' giftpack...which was great for rinsing brushes out with

 

Great progress on the track steve...not sure why you were doing it on new years eve...but great progress anyway - best for 2011...

[wagonman]

 

Do you know if any of the Calne merchants got any of their coal in North Somerset - if so I might try a couple on Highbury. Merry Christmas to one and all and hope to see some of you at the Calne show in a few weeks.

 

 

 

Hi Jerry

 

Don't have any conclusive evidence about Calne merchants buying from N Somerset, but there is a photo showing a Wm Evans (Old Mills Colliery) wagon at Calne c1910, so somebody there must have done!

 

 

 

Richard

[SteveBedding]

Hi Jerry

 

Don't have any conclusive evidence about Calne merchants buying from N Somerset, but there is a photo showing a Wm Evans (Old Mills Colliery) wagon at Calne c1910, so somebody there must have done!

 

Richard

 

Richard

 

Which photo would that be? Could you post a copy (if permitted) or point me towards the source please?

 

Cheers

 

Steve