"Evening Star"

[70022Tornado]

I was at Swindon Steam exhibition to day.

 

I was delighted to sit in the driving seat of "Evening Star"

 

I was not delighted to find that she was carrying a "50C" shed plate on the smokebox.

 

Canton (86A) Green Park (82F) even Swindon (82C) but Hull (50C) ?

 

The mind boggles !

 

70022Tornado

[Oldddudders]

I was at Swindon Steam exhibition to day.

 

I was delighted to sit in the driving seat of "Evening Star"

 

I was not delighted to find that she was carrying a "50C" shed plate on the smokebox.

 

Canton (86A) Green Park (82F) even Swindon (82C) but Hull (50C) ?

 

The mind boggles !

 

70022Tornado

Canton only became 86A in 1962, having been 88A before that, and possibly 86C before that. By that date, I think ES was doing her thing over the Mendips, so 88A would be more appropriate for her early career, perhaps?

[Ed-farms]

She carried that during her running days at York (as she was based there for running), they must have just kept it, not right for BR era but fine for preservation.

[The Stationmaster]

92220 is actually carrying a 50A shedplate, not one for Botanic Gardens

 

Still a sacrilege tho' and presumably inflicted by 'someone' at the NRM - as I pointed out to my daughter when we first approached the loco.

[asmay2002]

Canton only became 86A in 1962, having been 88A before that, and possibly 86C before that. By that date, I think ES was doing her thing over the Mendips, so 88A would be more appropriate for her early career, perhaps?

 

Canton was 86C in 1959 just before 92220 entered service.

 

ASM

[Oldddudders]

Canton was 86C in 1959 just before 92220 entered service.

 

ASM

Ah - thanks! I thought so, with school quadrangle talk of it changing to 88A in about 1961, I think. Some lucky pupil or two had Trains Illustrated every month, so were as up to speed as it was possible to be in those days. My last Combined Volume, published in 1961, shows it as 88A, but it's been crossed out and 86A scrawled alongside. Given that we all lived in Surrey, this was info of a pretty remote nature, really! Nearest one got to Cardiff in those days was OOC - where I did indeed find ES on one occasion.

[chrisf]

I too saw 92220 at Swindon today and noted the 50A shedplate. What I don't recall is whether it was also carrying the Red Dragon headboard. For those who don't know, Evening Star found itself working the up Red Dragon and down Capitals United on several occasions in June and July 1960. This merry adventure began when the rostered Britannia failed one day and the only available substitute at Canton was 92220. On at least one day it is said to have made a nonsense of the schedule, arriving in Paddington 15 minutes early.

 

Chris

[70022Tornado]

I stand corrected on shed numbers but....... !!!

 

70022

[APOLLO]

Good job she never carried an 8F shedplate, or she would have been scrapped !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Brit15

[LH&JC]

Well 50A is her home shed, she's only on loan to STEAM (hopefully there'll be a swap for the Star in the not too distant future).

[60B]

Whilst this is technically sacrelige, its not really something to get angry and fly off the handle about.

[roythebus]

Funnily enough I was thinking about Evening Star when I was driving my car. The odometer was on 92220. Creepy!!

[Oldddudders]

I stand corrected on shed numbers but....... !!!

 

70022

Not corrected, I hope. I was just adding a bit of history, that's all!

[Flying Pig]

I too saw 92220 at Swindon today and noted the 50A shedplate. What I don't recall is whether it was also carrying the Red Dragon headboard.

It was.

[Chameleon]

I'd be more concerned with the fact that the last built loco by BR is almost certainly never steam again due to its completely ###### boiler (as someone at the NRM so eloquently put it!)

[Dagworth]

I'd be more concerned with the fact that the last built loco by BR is almost certainly never steam again due to its completely ###### boiler (as someone at the NRM so eloquently put it!)

58050 doesn't have a boiler.....

 

Andi

[G-BOAF]

seem to recall from an NRM publication that its driving wheel tyres are scrap. I'm fast coming to the opinion not every voice that comes out of the NRM is completely correct. With five years BR use and about 10-15 preserved use off and on, the boiler should be more or less OK. 92240 has done 7 in BR and 12 on the Bluebell and is OK. And there are locos designed for 30 or so hard working years.

And after the scotsman, the NRM can never claim a boiler is knackered (well, at least not if you throw enough money at it).

 

Would have been nice to have seen it have a mini overhaul to allow yard/limited heritage use in its 50th year, but then again a set of 9F tubes can't be cheap.

 

Did 92220 have a brass smokebox plate in BR days or is this a preservation modification?

[The Stationmaster]

seem to recall from an NRM publication that its driving wheel tyres are scrap. I'm fast coming to the opinion not every voice that comes out of the NRM is completely correct. With five years BR use and about 10-15 preserved use off and on, the boiler should be more or less OK. 92240 has done 7 in BR and 12 on the Bluebell and is OK. And there are locos designed for 30 or so hard working years.

And after the scotsman, the NRM can never claim a boiler is knackered (well, at least not if you throw enough money at it).

 

Would have been nice to have seen it have a mini overhaul to allow yard/limited heritage use in its 50th year, but then again a set of 9F tubes can't be cheap.

 

Did 92220 have a brass smokebox plate in BR days or is this a preservation modification?

 

I'm sure that brass smokebox plate is quite a late addition in preservation - but maybe it's been there all along and painted to fool the accountants ?

 

As far as the boiler is concerned it is out-of-ticket and therefore needs an overhaul, whether that could be defined as 'knackered' is debatable but then perhaps there is something wrong with it which amounts to more than normal maintenance or repair?

 

As I see it the big problem would be what to do with it? It's not the only 9F in preservation so it won't be of much interest to many minor railways that either have one of their own or can get one on loan from another line - thus it is unlikely that any of them are very keen to take it on with the work even a normal overhaul entails. And as it is barred from running on NR lines it obviously isn't a particularly attractive option for the NRM to do any work on it, especially when they are lavishing money on the likes of 4472.

 

Net result - there it sits - as an item of some historical interest in the right place and, as was the case last Saturday, as a plaything for ill-supervised children who would have had a much more beneficial time learning about its history than trying to pull bits off it.

[coachmann]

Sure, the 9F has its accidental place in history and yes, it looks pretty in green. But it is still a 9F. In steam days, a 9F was like finding a Derby Type 2.... Ughhh.They simply hadnt been around long enough to be regarded as interestingly historical. Besides, I doubt anyone wanted to see their favourite class of engines replaced by the new boy on the block.

I suppose with the passing of time all steam locos are viewed on a level playing field because they are all old and historical now.

[Guest stuartp]

With five years BR use and about 10-15 preserved use off and on, the boiler should be more or less OK. 92240 has done 7 in BR and 12 on the Bluebell and is OK. And there are locos designed for 30 or so hard working years.

 

Thirty years maybe, but not without boiler maintenance/replacement from time to time, and all sorts of problems can shorten a boiler's life. 60007's is shot three years into its ticket, it's being retubed at the moment.

 

We've had the preservation -v- restoration discussion before. If Evening Star is in more-or-less original condition, then NRM may take the view that it should be conserved 'as is' rather than destroying the original fabric (which is what restoration does) to create something with limited opportunity to run. NRM is a national museum with a remit to conserve and educate; providing engines for day trips is a secondary function for them which they can only do if it doesn't conflict with their primary purpose. Scotsman is different - it's not in original condition so little of real historical value is lost by rebuilding it, and it's a national icon which people expect to see out and about.

 

Preserved railways and private owners are not bound by such restrictions, it's literally their trainset.

[Pennine MC]

Whilst this is technically sacrelige, its not really something to get angry and fly off the handle about.

 

Aye, but if the middle pages have fallen out of your mag as well, it could push a man over the edge...

[Harry Basset]

I'm surprised that the tyres are at scrapping size. After its visit to the NYMR in the eighties 92220 had its tyres turned at Thornaby and I don't think it did very much running after that. The tyre turning session was very interesting. The loco was driven down from Grosmont, the fire was dropped, the rods were taken off and the loco was at the wheel lathe all within two hours. It was almost like a Formula 1 pit stop.

[RedgateModels]

Personally I'd pay big money to see Evening Star in steam, but I don't think there are enough of us to sway the NRM from their conservation stance. Shame

[Guest 838rapid]

It was said by myself to some of the Steam museum staff at the time it was delivered that the shed plate was wrong.

 

I recieved the reply,whats a shed plate! !

 

A small matter,in all reality I know.

 

But still a quite important one.

 

Have found a picture in the Steam archives of my Grandad standing next to the loco after it was built.

 

Personally I am looking forward to getting Lode Star back instead,although I wonder if they have removed all the asbestos from its boiler yet??

[stewartingram]

Some time ago in one of the mags (Steam Railway possibly?) a suggestion was made that the new preservation sites that exist today, could be given shedcodes in the manner of the old BR steam sheds. Quite a plausible suggestion, and many of the sites indeed took up this challenge and still use it. As the NRM used to be York shed,I suspect this stems from the same idea, as the loco is normally "shedded" there. So for modern times, it is absolutely correct. However, it does make a big dent in the theory that all NRM exhibits must be conserved in accurate condition doesn't it?