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Hornby Clan


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Have slightly backdated my Clan Stewart, away from the green cylinder cover/running plate uncertainty. I'd repainted the running plate in black, as previously posted. Yesterday I received replacement cylinders in BR lined black, courtesy of AC Model spares. These were a Clan spare, so have fitted these and removed the overhead electric flashes.

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11 hours ago, Silver Sidelines said:

For the record Clan Stewart R3996 and Clan Buchanan R2846 - using an elderly Cannon SX110.  Two different interpretations of the position of the lining on the cylinders.  I would also suggest that the lining to the running board is finer on the older model - it is certainly a different colour.

 

51565422102_5e39c7ea76_3k.jpg


 

 

An interesting and telling image. The l/h  Clan having the stamp of authenticity 

 

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On 09/10/2021 at 09:32, rembrow said:

Have slightly backdated my Clan Stewart, away from the green cylinder cover/running plate uncertainty. I'd repainted the running plate in black, as previously posted. Yesterday I received replacement cylinders in BR lined black, courtesy of AC Model spares. These were a Clan spare, so have fitted these and removed the overhead electric flashes.

 

Hello Rembrow, you might be interested in a Blog Post I wrote over summer:  https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blogs/entry/25040-a-tale-of-two-Hornby-super-detail-‘britannias’-plus-a-clan-part-2/

 

There is a picture of Clan Stewart in 1961 with overhead warning flashes and still with Early Emblem.  There is a bit more history in the Post and in  the subsequent Post where I moved the top lamp iron from its lowered position back up to the top.

 

Good luck

 

Ray

 

 

Edited by Silver Sidelines
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10 hours ago, Silver Sidelines said:

 

 

Many years ago 'Apollo' arrived minus a lamp iron.  I reported the loss to the supplier Bourton Model Rail who in turn sourced one from Hornby.

 

I have just fitted a replacement top iron to Stewart.  I used Bluetak to position the lamp iron in the hole.  I then removed the Bluetak and adjusted the postion of the lamp iron using finger nails.   I should have said that I had taken the body off the chassis and I was then able to apply super glue to the hole in the back of the smokebox door.  A bit time consuming but much more controlled than trying to use 'glue' from the outside.

 

Good luck

 

Ray

 

I spoke with my preferred retailer this morning who advised that I send it back to them as they don't hold spares. A shame as it runs well and seems a bit OTT to send the whole thing back because of a tiny missing piece. They were very understanding and helpful though and said that I could wait for my reply from Hornby about the missing lamp iron before I decide what to do. 

 

On a more positive note, I ran the Clan in fully yesterday on a simple fourth-radius loop and it's now very smooth and free-running. It's going back in its box now until the missing lamp iron debacle progresses further.

 

Henry

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12 minutes ago, Silver Sidelines said:

 

Hello Rembrow, you ight be interested in a Blog Post I wrote over summer:  https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blogs/entry/25040-a-tale-of-two-Hornby-super-detail-‘britannias’-plus-a-clan-part-2/

 

There is a picture of Clan Stewart in 1961 with overhead warning flashes and still with Early Emblem.  There is a bit more history in the Post and in  the subsequent Post where I moved the top lamp iron from its lowered position back up to the top.

 

Good luck

 

Ray

 

 

Thanks Ray, that's very late for a lined green loco to still have an early emblem. Will have to think about a name change.

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3 hours ago, Silver Sidelines said:

 

There is a picture of Clan Stewart in 1961 with overhead warning flashes and still with Early Emblem.  There is a bit more history in the Post and in  the subsequent Post where I moved the top lamp iron from its lowered position back up to the top.

 

Those overhead warning flashes only started to appear that year so they must have been newly fitted. The loco's livery was irrelevant but the flash/early emblem combination does seem to have been unusual (I hope I'm not prompting an OT diversion here......!)

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34 minutes ago, Neil Phillips said:

 

Those overhead warning flashes only started to appear that year so they must have been newly fitted. ---

 

Thanks Neil, David Hey in his page on Britannias comments that warning flashes were fitted to all engines by sheds between 1961 and 1962.  Meaning that engines received them 'in service' rather than at a specific overhaul.

 

https://davidheyscollection.myshopblocks.com/pages/david-heys-steam-diesel-photo-collection-90-br-britannia-class-7-1

 

There is also a picture of William Shakespeare, another classic example of an engine which survived for a long time with an Early Emblem.

Edited by Silver Sidelines
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33 minutes ago, Neil Phillips said:

 

Those overhead warning flashes only started to appear that year so they must have been newly fitted. The loco's livery was irrelevant but the flash/early emblem combination does seem to have been unusual (I hope I'm not prompting an OT diversion here......!)

 

1959. After an accident on the ER.

 

By 1960 they were pretty much universal on the LMR.

 

 

 

Jason

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On 09/10/2021 at 14:38, Steamport Southport said:

 

1959. After an accident on the ER.

 

By 1960 they were pretty much universal on the LMR.

 

Jason

 

Quite right Jason, I've checked some 1960-dated photos and found LMR Peaks and Metro-Vicks, ER Baby Deltics (in original condition) and ScR Sulzer Type 2s (Inverness variety) with them. My library is heavily Western Region where the first Warship to get them was D805 in July 1961. Bizarrely they weren't at all universal on the LMR's AL1-5 overhead electrics, or AL6 until the mid-80s, but this has very little to do with BR Clans so I'll acknowledge your correction and :stop: here!

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On 09/10/2021 at 14:36, Silver Sidelines said:

 

Thanks Neil, David Hey in his page on Britannias comments that warning flashes were fitted to all engines by sheds between 1961 and 1962.  Meaning that engines received them 'in service' rather than at a specific overhaul.

 

https://davidheyscollection.myshopblocks.com/pages/david-heys-steam-diesel-photo-collection-90-br-britannia-class-7-1

 

There is also a picture of William Shakespeare, another classic example of an engine which survived for a long time with an Early Emblem.

That's an interesting site on Britannias, Ray.  One point made is that from 1963, all Britannias had the top lamp iron moved down to the right hand side of the smokebox door, like Clan Stewart here,  and middle iron on buffer beam moved to right to match.  Never noticed that before. 

This is a very helpful thread, and I've changed my pre order to 72004 instead of Clan Stewart, as 72009 is in the condition it was in at the end of things steam but the earlier condition one would fit in better on the layout.  I'm told it's on its way....

 

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6 hours ago, Silver Sidelines said:

72000 Clan Buchanan, British Railways postcard from the 1950's.

 

Shared from Dave Wragg on  Flickr.  He has titled it a 1950s British Railways Postcard.  Now what colour is the shiny paint on the firebox?


I’ve seen another picture of 72000, brand-new, on a running-in turn at Shrewsbury. The nameplates are fitted, but covered up.

 

Looking at the picture above, and that other one, I have to ask - is there a possibility that 72000 is painted black?

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4 minutes ago, pH said:


I’ve seen another picture of 72000, brand-new, on a running-in turn at Shrewsbury. The nameplates are fitted, but covered up.

 

Looking at the picture above, and that other one, I have to ask - is there a possibility that 72000 is painted black?

Looking closer there’s a definite difference in colour between the smokebox and boiler barrel so I’d say it’s not black. 

5922AB6D-37F8-4EFB-AE60-01C3F12C806D.jpeg

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5 minutes ago, pH said:


I’ve seen another picture of 72000, brand-new, on a running-in turn at Shrewsbury. The nameplates are fitted, but covered up.

 

Looking at the picture above, and that other one, I have to ask - is there a possibility that 72000 is painted black?

 

When you enlarge it, there is a distinct change in tone between boiler and firebox, thus I think it is green.  Isn't film odd! 

 

edit, Oops hilux beat me to it. 

Edited by robmcg
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No, but their smaller wheeled cousins were.......:rolleyes: A take on an alternate Standard universe - 5'8" driven MT loco.

 

IMG_1926.JPG

 

Apologies - that is a 5'3" version - I've been busy....- here is the larger one.

IMG_1920.JPG.15330623243dace1591aba3c64af8967.JPG

Edited by Ben Alder
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16 hours ago, pH said:


I’ve seen another picture of 72000, brand-new, on a running-in turn at Shrewsbury. The nameplates are fitted, but covered up.

 

Looking at the picture above, and that other one, I have to ask - is there a possibility that 72000 is painted black?

No, i put the image above through several filters. The picture is underexposed, but with added brilliance you can clearly see the GWR style double orange with inside black lining on the tender… its definitely green, without doubt in my mind.

 

I’m of the opinion the firebox below the frame is also black, as is everything below the running plate.

 

70000 was black though for a while. That was recreated about 10 years ago where it did a couple of trips in black.. it looked very good at the time… Memories of it shunting / light engine at 7am one saturday at London Euston, when only an hour later I saw 70013 from Kings Cross. Another occasion was a memorable pairing of 34067 + 70000 in black on an ACE re-run.. looking a bit like a 9F!

 

Here is preserved Black 70000 from a very similar angle, definitely in Black, in colour and Black and white, to compare the image of Green 72000..

 

 

E2B1E36F-AFE6-473E-AB0B-25B41E97ED40.jpeg

E5FE0C61-8EB8-43DE-B22F-73641251D269.jpeg

Edited by adb968008
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17 hours ago, Halvarras said:

 

Quite right Jason, I've checked some 1960-dated photos and found LMR Peaks and Metro-Vicks, ER Baby Deltics (in original condition) and ScR Sulzer Type 2s (Inverness variety) with them. My library is heavily Western Region where the first Warship to get them was D805 in July 1961. Bizarrely they weren't at all universal on the LMR's AL1-5 overhead electrics, or AL6 until the mid-80s, but this has very little to do with BR Clans so I'll acknowledge your correction and :stop: here!

 

ISTR reading somewhere that electrics didn't get them as it was assumed that the crew knew they were electric.

 

I don't think the SR electrics got them either, including the Class 71s.

 

 

Jason

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A much-appreciated prompt reply from Hornby this morning about my two Clan-related qualms. Despite giving them the product code for Clan MacDonald, I think they were replying about Clan Stewart. They attached an old colour photo which does suggest a green running plate underneath the grime. I'm still not convinced this applies to 72004 though but really appreciated their time to make their case. 

 

They did also tell me they wouldn't be able to provide a spare lamp iron and that the model would need to be returned. I appreciate that may be the policy but it does seem bizzare to send a perfectly-working product back because it's missing a tiny detail. The one I get in replacement might be worse!

 

Henry

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23 hours ago, robmcg said:

 

When you enlarge it, there is a distinct change in tone between boiler and firebox, thus I think it is green.  Isn't film odd! 

 

edit, Oops hilux beat me to it. 


This is a curiosity. What draws me back from any conclusion that it might like Britannia 70000 have been outshopped in black is the fact that it appears as only  partially lined …tender and cab but nowhere else. Although one perhaps could conclude that the photo has been subject to a touch up.It could be almost any shade but the lining would naturally lead to the conclusion the shade is green. Somewhere there might be records of the paint shop at Crewe for that year but slim chance of any evidence surfacing.

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23 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:


This is a curiosity. What draws me back from any conclusion that it might like Britannia 70000 have been outshopped in black is the fact that it appears as only  partially lined …tender and cab but nowhere else. Although one perhaps could conclude that the photo has been subject to a touch up.It could be almost any shade but the lining would naturally lead to the conclusion the shade is green. Somewhere there might be records of the paint shop at Crewe for that year but slim chance of any evidence surfacing.

It is lined on the running plate, if you change the brilliance/ exposure (as its not my image I cannot share it, but once downloaded and the tones adjusted the lines become apparent) everywhere you would expect them to be, boiler bands, running plate, cab, tender tank.

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Hi all, My Clan Stewart has arrived and its mostly fine, except for the RH crosshead assembly, which has a notable downward angle, I think there maybe a wonkiness to the Cylinder, which doesn't fully reach the running plate. Any ideas on a fix?  

 

IMG_0127.JPG.fa17e0e0911ae902ad4f326bdf156db8.JPG

 

ScR

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5 hours ago, Ian Hargrave said:


This is a curiosity. What draws me back from any conclusion that it might like Britannia 70000 have been outshopped in black is the fact that it appears as only  partially lined …tender and cab but nowhere else. Although one perhaps could conclude that the photo has been subject to a touch up.It could be almost any shade but the lining would naturally lead to the conclusion the shade is green. Somewhere there might be records of the paint shop at Crewe for that year but slim chance of any evidence surfacing.

 

It is lined on the boiler and running plate...

 

72000_clan_Image1a_r2080.jpg.e6dfed6e2388910d2c3a963779959c86.jpg

 

my guess is BR green

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