Langford Lane & Marlingford - GWR 1940s Oxfordshire

[The Great Bear]

Recently, I've been addressing some running issues with the layouts, points and signals not working as they should and a few problem areas with derailments. I'm getting there with this, though the signals don't work quite as well as I'd like some are inconsistent in their movement, something to explore further in due course.

 

I've also made a bit more progress on the point rodding, the run from the box in the 6' up to the bridge now completed. I think this is getting easier with practise - just as well as the big one, with up to 11 rods is next...

 

So here's the recently added rodding and a freight train.

 

 

 

 

The rodding has managed by itself to acquire a somewhat weathered look, something reacting with the gun blue I used to blacken it. If only the stock and locos could weather themselves - acquiring that skill is moving up the to-do list, along with re-numbering and changing liveries to my chosen post-war period.

 

Thanks for the interest shown

 

Jon

[phixer64]

Coming on well now Jon,

 

Regards Jeff

[The Great Bear]

A couple more shots of the same goods train

 

 

[The Great Bear]

So, with the layout construction on the last lap, my attention is turning toward the trains.

 

One of the skills I need to acquire is weathering - anything weathered so far was bought from Ebay thus - so here's my first attempts, starting with some old wagons...

Old indeed, the Coke wagon is 70s era from childhoold trainset

 

and then enough courage to try a loco, albeit a non-runner...

 

 

I don't have an airbrush, something which fills me with fear, so the weathering's just some dry brushing of enamels and a diluted black wash. Most of the books and articles, seem to rely on use of airbrushes, even after saying they're not essential. The loco I followed some techniques given by Chris Nevard in a Model Rail article a few years back.

 

What I've done to date is following generic guidelines, rather than follow a specific prototype photo. For that, finding the right photo is a challenge - for my modelling period (immediately post WW2) colour photos will be rare and I don't yet have the imagination to see the colour in a black and white photo. Apropos, for instance, I have the Martin Welch Art of Weathering which has lots of detailed photos, of course all in black and white.

 

As it's something I'm new to I'm not sure about my results. Not a complete disaster, I hope and it's a first go and I should improve with practise. Any comments, suggestions, sources of reference (books, links) or techniques would be welcomed.

 

Thanks

 

Jon

Edited April 3, 2016 by The Great Bear

[spiket4]

Lovely layout with great detaling.

 

Mark

[The Stationmaster]

So, with the layout construction on the last lap, my attention is turning toward the trains.

 

One of the skills I need to acquire is weathering - anything weathered so far was bought from Ebay thus - so here's my first attempts, starting with some old wagons...

 

Old indeed, the Coke wagon is 70s era from childhoold trainset

 

and then enough courage to try a loco, albeit a non-runner...

 

 

 

 

I don't have an airbrush, something which fills me with fear, so the weathering's just some dry brushing of enamels and a diluted black wash. Most of the books and articles, seem to rely on use of airbrushes, even after saying they're not essential. The loco I followed some techniques given by Chris Nevard in a Model Rail article a few years back.

 

What I've done to date is following generic guidelines, rather than follow a specific prototype photo. For that, finding the right photo is a challenge - for my modelling period (immediately post WW2) colour photos will be rare and I don't yet have the imagination to see the colour in a black and white photo. Apropos, for instance, I have the Martin Welch Art of Weathering which has lots of detailed photos, of course all in black and white.

 

As it's something I'm new to I'm not sure about my results. Not a complete disaster, I hope and it's a first go and I should improve with practise. Any comments, suggestions, sources of reference (books, links) or techniques would be welcomed.

 

Thanks

 

Jon

 

I think weathering (easier to say than do) is as much about observation as it is about technique therefore you final comment about sources is very important.  The first are is to observe where dirt develops, what that dirt is and - just as important what that dirt isn't.  (the last applies particularly to lime stains from water - they were very much influenced by where the water came from and thus weren't found everywhere but were very 'geographical'.

 

The sources of dirt vary enormously - brake block dust tended to be low down in the steam age and more often than not was lost among other grime.  The other grime was basically oils/grease in the wrong places, coal dust,soot and cinders, and ash plus the effects on all of them of weather such as heavy rain.  Water/oil mixtures also play an important part in some areas.  Rust on engines in traffic was not all that common until the last years of steam - there was too much oil about and coal dust about for it to form/show (apart from on smokebox doors.

 

So the key I think is too look for pictures of the real world (and maybe modelling books for techniques - but not so much for examples).  Period modelled is also important - I have quite a lot of pics of pannier tanks in the pre-war period and very few of them were clean - most were filthy. Different sheds also cleaned to different levels (usually because of availability of labour - or not having any).

 

Books - any good photo albums covering the period you are modelling but few are in colour, well worth a look if you can find one is 'Railway Liveries' by Brian Haresnape (the GWR version of course) which is small format card bound

 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Railway-Liveries-Great-Western/dp/0711012512

 

and this one -

 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Big-Four-Colour-1935-50/dp/1899816089

[Ruffnut Thorston]

Your Weathering is looking good...

 

While this is the 1950s....it is a grubby Pannier Tank loco!

 

[Richard Mawer]

I agree with Mike. The Big Four In Colour is a good reference book.

 

I was surprised just how dirty many locos were in the 1930s (my modelling period), but of course precious little rust.

 

I'm loving your layout. Very realistic.

 

Regards

 

Rich

[The Great Bear]

I've summoned up the courage to make a start at changing the livery of my locos and stock to the post-war period that I intend to model.

 

Firstly, in at the deep end with a new Hornby Collett...

The Hornby transfers came off pretty easily - the ones under the windows nothing more than light rubbing with a cocktail stick, the GWR crest a little bit more effort (but not too much) and some T-cut. The replacement transfers are HMRS Pressfix. One I got the knack of these, pretty straighforward except the coach numbers where cutting out and placing each number is a right pain.

 

I also had a practise go (before potentially ruining a nice new BR Collett) at a wartime brown coach with a 1970s vintage one.

 

A Hornby Clerestory acquired from Ebay already in brown but now with transfers added and handles painted brass.

 

And finally a Hall...

Re-naming / numbering locos is another task I need to learn, plates are on order to convert Sketty Hall into something more appropriate.

 

I had recently thought of re-thinking my choice of post-war period rather than do this, but so far, whilst not perfect, so good and I'll stick with the original plan. Plenty more to do, though...

 

Thanks for looking

 

Jon

[The Great Bear]

A few pictures showing this lot combined...

 

 

 

[Ruffnut Thorston]

I think that modelling the Post World War 2 period, before 1948,  is not that common....

 

1930s Big Four is common...even Pre-grouping seems to be pretty common again these days.

 

1950s BR is gaining popularity....

 

The "golden age" of Steam and Diesel together, the mid to late 1960s is very common.

 

BR Blue, and all that comes after is, not surprisingly, gaining a good following, since this is the period a lot of "new" modellers remember...

 

 

The very early 1950s (my preference) does allow some late Post War Big Four liveries to be about as well!

[Edwardian]

I think that modelling the Post World War 2 period, before 1948,  is not that common....

 

1930s Big Four is common...even Pre-grouping seems to be pretty common again these days.

 

1950s BR is gaining popularity....

 

The "golden age" of Steam and Diesel together, the mid to late 1960s is very common.

 

BR Blue, and all that comes after is, not surprisingly, gaining a good following, since this is the period a lot of "new" modellers remember...

 

 

The very early 1950s (my preference) does allow some late Post War Big Four liveries to be about as well!

 

Until these new Colletts came along, modelling the GW before the late '30s was quite difficult, because there were locos, but no decent coaches.  Late '30s onward was OK because you had Collett Sunshine Stock, and then Hawksworths and Mark Is.

 

Although BR(WR) seems still to be more popular than GWR, I think 1947 is relatively popular as a period for GW layouts.  Think of Kings Torre (EM), this excellent layout, the excellent A Nod to Brent.  MIB of this Parish is planning another for this period.  I can think of some inter-war GW branchline layouts on RMWeb, but a high % of mainline GW subjects are 1947.

[The Great Bear]

Until these new Colletts came along, modelling the GW before the late '30s was quite difficult, because there were locos, but no decent coaches.  Late '30s onward was OK because you had Collett Sunshine Stock, and then Hawksworths and Mark Is.

 

I am no coach expert but my impression from photos is late 30s, 40s the Collett bow-ended stock is the mainstay especially for my layout with no named trains and most being run of the mill 4 coach passenger trains. So the Bachmann Sunshine stock is of limited use to me I think and similarly the Hawksworths - though of course I have them anyway!

 

Although BR(WR) seems still to be more popular than GWR, I think 1947 is relatively popular as a period for GW layouts.  Think of Kings Torre (EM), this excellent layout, the excellent A Nod to Brent.  MIB of this Parish is planning another for this period.  I can think of some inter-war GW branchline layouts on RMWeb, but a high % of mainline GW subjects are 1947.

 

and not forgetting Granby as well. MIB's work is particularly of interest - a lot of his projects I am going to copy in the fullness of time.

 

For the post war period getting the variety of liveries (especially the coaches) and filth is a particular challenge, if that less "chocolate-box" look is what one wants to model. I have a lot of weathering to do in due course, I may change my mind about this aspiration!

 

(As an aside, I think the late 20s or earlier would be an interesting period to model too especially on a secondary mainline, before the "take over" by the Halls, with Cities, original Counties and pre-grouping types still there and before the decimation of the outside frame classes - I do like a straight-frame Bulldog - and railmotors. Also, in the context of my layout, perhaps the elegant Robinson GC classes.)

[Richard Mawer]

Era: An interesting topic.

 

As you may know, my layout is based on mid 1930s secondary line (glorified double track branch - take your pick). I've blurred the early to mid 30s to have locos I like, such as a City and a 48xx, to name but two locos that would never have met.

 

I am more of a fan of 4-4-0s than 4-6-0s. I have 4-4-0s:- County, Bulldog, Dukedog, City and because of the proximity of the GCR, a Director (I agree that Robinson produced some very elegant locos). My sops to 4-6-0s are a Saint, Star and Castle. The latter being the only really "modern" GWR loco I have. I do not have any Halls, Granges, Manors or later Counties. Certainly not a King, on my line. I seem to be in a minority because of that, but each to his (or her) own. :-)

 

I think there are far more late 1930's and 1940s GWR than earlier.

 

Coaches are a bit of a nightmare for my period. I am sure mine are not correct for the period, but they are a variety of Colletts (mostly Hornby) and different Hornby clerestories. I now have all I need to run the timetable (or to fit on the layout). The new Colletts look really good. I may have to retire some of my existing stock and invest. Hmmmm

 

I like your war-time brown coaches Jon. Its rare to see such a variety of livery on a layout unless its in BR days.

 

I took a couple of Hornby (Lord of the Ilses style) short clerestories and painted them in GWR Crimson lake, heavily weathered. They must be the last two to be painted in that livery (1922) and which hadn't been repainted or withdrawn by the mid 30s!! No doubt left in a siding, long forgotten :-) They have been pressed into action for the workman's train along with a couple of 6 wheelers.

 

Now can I blur the years further and argue a case for a Dapol Flying Banana?

 

Rich

[Edwardian]

Great Bear, Richard,

 

I agree. There are far more late '30s and '40s GW layouts than earlier.  It is harder to go earlier. I have chosen 1935, and have had enough trouble with that!  Prior to the release of these Hornby Colletts, I think the only RTR GW passenger-rated vehicle of acceptable quality that I could use more or less OOB was the Hornby Horsebox!  Oh, but for those Colletts in full faux panelling with some Toplights and some locomotives with Garters to pull 'em!

 

I have chosen a principal mainline, so my research experience is perhaps subtly different, and it gives me both some secondary mainline traffic coming cross-country and the principal mainline traffic itself:

 

• 50% of express services are Paddington - WoE, so, aside from the Riviera, pretty much all 70' stock 
• The other 50%, cross-country/ North to West, has a high % of LMS stock, mainly ex-LNWR (as it originally would have been LNWR) and early period LMS.  For GW 57' stock there are a lot of Toplights (including steel sided), Bow-Enders and a fair sprinkling of the Flat-Enders from the beginning of the Thirties. 

From 1936, odd examples of Sunshine stock crop up in trains with sufficient frequency to irritate when researching sample diagrams on particular services.  Granges do much the same.

 

The 4-4-0 classes are all gone (if memory serves the last Duke departed the area around 1932) and the mainline passenger engines are almost all 4-6-0, 2 or 4 Cylinders, with Moguls sharing the work with Halls on the stoppers.   The exception to this is the retention of the Bulldogs for front of train assistance on the banks. There was a nice mix of the standard straight-framed and the deeper framed Birds and even a couple of Curly-Wurlies kicking about.    

 

Hurrah for the '20s and '30s!

[OnTheBranchline]

Absolutely superb - exactly as a mixed GWR coach rake should be! Has the clerestory composite been downgraded to an all third yet? If so then the Lord of Marlingford and the Lady of Begbrooke will be unable to board!

 

Great Bear is completely right about the missing style of coach: toplights. My prediciton? Oxford Rail by the end of 2018...

 

CoY

 

At 60 quid a pop the way prices are going...

Edited May 28, 2016 by OnTheBranchline

[OnTheBranchline]

A few more photos of the same train.

 

 

This photo shows two things:

1) The moulded, filled in, steam pipes on the Hornby Hall aren't that obvious, if at all

2) That I need to vacuum this bit again as there are still off-cuts of the hanging basket liner all over the place.

 

Probably the headlamp should be red at least to match the stock, but I bought white ones as in theory my layout's set post war. Also, when did the smokebox lamp positions change, didn't they move later to the top of the smokebox, that's what I see in BR era pictures?

 

The last photo should be used by Hornby for advertising purposes.

Edited May 28, 2016 by OnTheBranchline

[57xx]

You've made a good job on the coaches. The added variety with the all brown ones is good.

[checkrail]

Hi Jon

 

Great photos, great layout, great modelling!  I came across the earliest iteration of M & B from 2010 when I was first planning my own layout in 2011/12, and found it of interest, but it's obviously undergone a complete metamorphosis since then and I've a lot to catch up on (and a lot to learn from it).  That will be a pleasure over the next few days in between sporadic bits of modelling.

 

BTW, thanks v much for kind words about Stoke Courtenay.  It would appear that the results we're both pursuing aren't a million miles apart!

 

Best wishes,

John C.

 

My layout: STOKE COURTENAY, 1930s GWR junction station. See layout topic. 

[wigancg]

Hi Jon,

 

Just stumbled across your stunning layout. Wonderful details and life within your models and scenery. Excellent!

 

I've happily spent a great deal of time just now browsing here. You've just gained another follower.

 

Chris

[Richard Mawer]

Recently, I've been addressing some running issues with the layouts, points and signals not working as they should and a few problem areas with derailments. I'm getting there with this, though the signals don't work quite as well as I'd like some are inconsistent in their movement, something to explore further in due course.

 

I've also made a bit more progress on the point rodding, the run from the box in the 6' up to the bridge now completed. I think this is getting easier with practise - just as well as the big one, with up to 11 rods is next...

 

So here's the recently added rodding and a freight train.

 

 

 

 

The rodding has managed by itself to acquire a somewhat weathered look, something reacting with the gun blue I used to blacken it. If only the stock and locos could weather themselves - acquiring that skill is moving up the to-do list, along with re-numbering and changing liveries to my chosen post-war period.

 

Thanks for the interest shown

 

Jon

This is looking great. I love the ROD. I have one and love the slow running.

 

How are you operating your signals and points?

 

Rich

[The Great Bear]

This is looking great. I love the ROD. I have one and love the slow running.

 

How are you operating your signals and points?

 

Rich

 

Thanks, Rich

 

The trains, the signals and the points are all DCC.

 

The signals are driven by servos which are connected into Team Digital SC8 or SMC4 accessory decoders (the former working 8 servos, the latter 4 servos and 4 point motors). The points are driven by DCC concepts Cobalt motors (the original version) connected into a variety of accessory decoders.

 

The signals and points are then operated via a lever frame of DCC Concepts Cobalt-S levers and then NCE AIU computer interface units and a laptop running JMRI to link these to the DCC system. More detail on that in this post, the aim being to eventually use JMRI to do some interlocking. The interlocking hasn't been done yet, other than a test to prove the idea works.

 

Hope this makes sense; happy to answer any queries you may have.

 

All the best

 

Jon

[Richard Mawer]

Thanks, Rich

 

The trains, the signals and the points are all DCC.

 

The signals are driven by servos which are connected into Team Digital SC8 or SMC4 accessory decoders (the former working 8 servos, the latter 4 servos and 4 point motors). The points are driven by DCC concepts Cobalt motors (the original version) connected into a variety of accessory decoders.

 

The signals and points are then operated via a lever frame of DCC Concepts Cobalt-S levers and then NCE AIU computer interface units and a laptop running JMRI to link these to the DCC system. More detail on that in this post, the aim being to eventually use JMRI to do some interlocking. The interlocking hasn't been done yet, other than a test to prove the idea works.

 

Hope this makes sense; happy to answer any queries you may have.

 

All the best

 

Jon

Jon

 

Thanks for that explanation. I use servos for points and signals. I have a mate who uses the Cobalt point motors and the S levers. I love the levers.

 

My club uses laptops and JMRI with touch screens for the fiddle yard on the new Oxford layout. Thats beyond me I'm afraid. I'm an analogue type of guy. My interlocking is very basic - the signals only clear if the points are correct. Drive by the signals and you should be ok. They are easier to see than which way the points are. Sounds like your interlocking will be proper. Will you have facing point locks?

 

Your layout is looking great.

 

I should have also complimented you on putting your cattle wagon next to the loco. Very protypical.

 

Keep the photos coming. I need something to keep refering to!

 

Rich

[gazmanjack]

Apologies Jon, but it has been quite some time since I looked in last. Must admit the layout has come on in leaps and bounds. The pics on this page are fantastic. The second pic in post 303 is absolutely stunning. Keep the great work coming.

 

Cheers, Gary.

[checkrail]

Have now had time to read through your topic retrospectively.  (I first viewed it when it was just Marlingford and I too was thinking of a BLT to start with.) I can see the big change came with the shed.  So, uncannily, we've both been developing GWR junction station layouts in near-as-dammit the same space, supported by L girders, and using RTR models in a similar way. I really enjoyed going through recent pictures, which really capture that GW atmosphere.  I'm also full of admiration for your point rodding (mine is a much more impressionistic stab at things), and the lovely scratchbuilt structures.

 

Please keep the pictures coming!

 

John C.

 

My layout: STOKE COURTENAY (see layout topics), GWR 1930’s junction in 4mm scale.