Jump to content
 

Lancaster Green Ayre - The Barn Owls have returned.


jamie92208
 Share

Recommended Posts

  • RMweb Premium

Thanks to all of you for that information about Tarrif vans.  To be honest I had no idea what they were for but do know that one of the brake vans that I have was a tarrif van.  That now makes sense.  I oresume that they would be marshalled near the brake van so that the guard would be able to deal with the traffic whilst the driver was shunting.

 

Jamie

  • Agree 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
34 minutes ago, jamie92208 said:

 I presume that they would be marshalled near the brake van so that the guard would be able to deal with the traffic whilst the driver was shunting.

 

 

That's what I would think too, but in the upper of these two photos posted by @Lecorbusier, the tariff brake is the fifth vehicle:

 

That's the only photo I'm aware of that shows either a tariff van or tariff brake van in traffic.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The LSWR Road Vans were break vans with doors in the side for the smalls traffic.  The SECR break vans didn't have such a compartment, but when I was measuring up Lyminge station (my late mother lived in the village) I found out there was a Roader corridor.  So we have three different names - road, roader, tariff - for what was basically the same traffic.

 

By the by, when I was building the infamous L&Y open wagon, I found out they were called Fruit wagons.  Funny way to transport bananas, I thought, until I discovered that "fruit" was probably a corruption of "freight".

 

Bill

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
10 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

This has implications for the operation of our model railways: a stopping goods train with a tariff van will come to a stand at the passenger platform and then detach wagon-load traffic and shunt into the goods yard - the timetable providing enough time for this, with the rest of the train occupying the running line under the protection of the guard's brake.

 

I would not argue that this is what happened in practice but I would be wary of the timetabled allowance.

The (admittedly very few) pre-Grouping timetables that I have seen only seem to allow around 10 minutes for shunting at any station.

My assumption has always been that these times were nominal and simply served to advise staff to expect a goods train sometime in the morning, for instance.

The staff would presumably alerted to it's imminent arrival when the signalman had it on the block.

 

Ian T

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Good evening all from a misty bit of France. No modelling today but I have just had chance to go over to the shed and look through my file of transfer sheets. By good chance I have found one sheet with some large NE lettering and a sheet of pre grouping LMS constituents which has some L & Y letterring.  A bit of googling has found me the kit instructions which show the 3 plank wagon as being grey.  I have searched for details of the NE tarrif vans but with no joy.  If anyone can point me towards any photos of them, I would be grateful.

 

Jamie

Link to post
Share on other sites

Jamie,

 

The L&Y open is painted Precision L&Y wagon grey.

 

The NER vans are not Tariff Vans but are perishable goods vans to NER diagram F4.  There are photographs on page 86 of Tatlow LNER Vol 2 and Marc has information on his web site - it's FRWC 57.  Don't trust number 507, the LNER did renumber some of their older stock to release blocks for new build.

 

Bill

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
16 minutes ago, bbishop said:

The NER vans are [...] perishable goods vans to NER diagram F4. 

 

Ah, so that's why they're not grey - fitted; on close examination I see that they have 3'7" wheels and clasp brakes. North Eastern Record Vol. 2 says all wagons and guards vans complying with full coaching stock requirements were painted Indian red from June 1903.

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
1 hour ago, bbishop said:

Jamie,

 

The L&Y open is painted Precision L&Y wagon grey.

 

The NER vans are not Tariff Vans but are perishable goods vans to NER diagram F4.  There are photographs on page 86 of Tatlow LNER Vol 2 and Marc has information on his web site - it's FRWC 57.  Don't trust number 507, the LNER did renumber some of their older stock to release blocks for new build.

 

Bill

Thanks Bill. The wagon is still in it's box so I will look at it in daylight tomorrow 8n between other tasks. Thanks for the NER info. I will have a look on the sheet for the correct size leters.

 

Jamie

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Good evening all.   I got the transfers on the L & Y wagon last night and it looks well.   

PC100289.JPG.577d460efb5d258a56fac641dc905265.JPG

I was going to do the NER vans but then discovered that I don't have any transfers that say N.E.R.  They need to be quite small to fit below the left hand vents.

PC100290.JPG.5a448f17d8fac838735d7fa2f73f3957.JPG

If anyone has any NER transfers of the right kind I would happily swap some others for them.

 

I need to take photos of my stock for insurance purposes after seeing this mentioned on another thread by BarryO.  I will need to find a way of linking them into my stock spreadsheet. It would be a useful way of checking my inventory.

 

Jamie

 

  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites

The correct transfers can be got from Powsides. The NER was used up to about 1910 and after that they went to a large NE one either side of the door. Someone bought my prototype so I can't even get you a photo.

There are some in the LNER wagons Vol 2

 

Marc

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Thanks for all the comments.  I will have to investigate storage options though it might end up as a CD or memory stick with them on. I already have a systematic numbering system that can be used for the photos as well.  I will certainly look at Powsides Marc.

 

Jamie

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

As Beth is getting better I seem to be establishing a pattern of doing a bit of work on an evening when I go over to fill the log basket up.   Today I spent a bit of time on the Powsides site and ordered some NER transfers along with some LBSC and LSWR as I knew I had some of their wagons nearly finished.   I had a root around in the shelves of part finished wagons tonight and found an LBSC 3 plank open ready to run but unpainted, another LBSC, but 5 plank with round ends, part painted and some LSWR ones that need more work.   I also found a tin of Precision LBSC Goods Grey with just enough in to paint the 3 plank wagon and finish off the 5 plank.   These will be ready when the transfers arrive.   I did bring back various modelling supplies from the UK including supplies of White metal flux so plan to try and get some more wagons finished.   I have finally got the HMRS LNWR sheet so will work on some of theirs.

 

Jamie

Edited by jamie92208
  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites

Jamie,  I have two LNWR wagons that need transfers.  I think they are a four plank and a two plank, but would the latter just have the illiterate diamond?  They are packed away somewhere!

 

I think the L&Y van is slightly down at one end.  Do not, repeat not, attempt to correct it; it is a sheer fluke that I managed to get all four wheels touching the track at the same time.

Bill

 

Edited by bbishop
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Thanks Bill. I will check the L&Y.  I will look out some transfers for your LNWR wagons and get them to you. I've got several that need transfers.  I've seen a lot of references  to the illiterate symbols and most seem to have dropped out of use by 1914.

 

Jamie

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
47 minutes ago, bbishop said:

Jamie,  I have two LNWR wagons that need transfers.  I think they are a four plank and a two plank, but would the latter just have the illiterate diamond?  They are packed away somewhere!

 

 

Prior to 1908, both types would have displayed just a pair of diamonds on each side. From that date, wagons started to acquire the LNWR lettering as well; from late 1910 the diamonds were no longer painted on new or newly repainted wagons. Of course it took some time for these changes to occur across the whole wagon fleet. Some examples on the LNWR Society website here. The 4-plank wagon would have displayed the load on the top plank 7 TONS (D4) / 10 TONS (D9) in all versions of the lettering.

Edited by Compound2632
  • Thanks 1
  • Informative/Useful 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Gentlemen,

 

Jamie has offered to send me transfers for my two LNWR wagons.  They are both ABS kits, and comparing them to the Wagon Book the 4 plank is to Diagram 84 and the 2 plank is to Diagram 6.  If anyone still has the original boxes and/or Adrian's list, could they confirm for me? 

 

Bill

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you Stephen, just a comment that my D84 wagon is whitemetal (lovely kit from ABS apart from the infamous floor, replaced by scribed plywood).  Adrian may yet have some of his released kits in store, but we are unlikely to see any of the "yet to be released".  I'm not in touch with Adrian, but I know someone who is and enquiries could be initiated for released kits.  Adrian never had more than a dozen kits in stock and as a kit sells out, that's it .....  I know, I acquired the last LBSC open a couple of years ago.

 

I have split my pre grouping wagons and kits into two piles.  Northern kits are painted as at 31/12/1922 and are going to Jamie;  I will keep the southern kits, painted as at 31/12/1912.  The LNWR wagons fall into the latter pile.  In truth, Jamie already has enough LSWR and LBSC wagons on LGA. 

 

On a historical note, by 1922 the D6 wagon had migrated to engineering stock and very unlikely to be seen on LGA.

 

Bill

  • Informative/Useful 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
1 hour ago, Furness Wagon said:

the list is a bit out of date ABS haven't been in business for some time.

 

 

Those sorts of lists on line society websites are designed to frustrate. Most stuff is either once was or never will be.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Good morning all.   A bit of good news rather than what I'm seeing on the TV.   Anyway after hanging decorations round the village I've been over to the shed for some more firewood.  En route I just happened to have a look through the shelf full of wagon kits.  I found various ABS kits most of which had instructions with them.  By chance one had the instructions for various LNWR opens including 2 and 4 plank.   I've scanned them and they are here.

 

1336205422_LNWRopenwagons.jpg.5663c9ce83c95aff5b5f6877f00cdc38.jpg

 

Using this as a guide I'll sort out the necessary transfers and post them over along with a copy of the drawing. It's amazing what you find among the various kits on my shelves.

 

Jamie

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Lettering on both wagons appears to be:

 

sides: ◊ LNWR ◊   the D84 has 10 TONS on top plank

 

solebar: plate with L.N.W. above number

 

ends: number

 

Suitable numbers are: D6 = 38909; D84 = 30582.

 

Bill

 

 

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

My modelling mojo must have crept in from somewhere.  I actually got a soldering iron out and plugged it in this evening.  I went over to the shed and listened to the wind howling.  However it's still a reasonable 10 degrees.   I took a box down from the shelf.  This was a box for a Slaters 3 plank Midland Wagon.  it was marked in pen, two, LNWR D 84 4 pl.   Inside were indeed two ABS kits for D84's with all the parts wrapped up in tissue or plastic bags.   The box was one of a job lot that I got at auction a few years ago.  I bought 24 Slater's kit boxes and found they contained 32 kits of assorted types.  18 of those were correct for Green Ayre so I sold the rest on Ebay and made more than I had paid for the whole job lot.  

Anyway I set to work and in about an hour and a half had this to show.  The box label is shown as well.

PC130291.JPG.cbf984f1e275cef62e82153db15ed06e.JPG

 

I was quite happy with that work. All the axlegaurds soldered on along with the buffers and sundry other details.  I won't get much done tomorrow as it is the village Christmas meal aka a drinkathon as the town hall.   I may be out some time and will certainly not be wielding a soldering iron on my return.

 

Jamie

 

  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...