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GRANBY JUNCTION - Shunting Siphons for the Up Parcels with a Manor!


john dew
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hi as another DCC automated fan, is the layout buildings etc lit, so you can run in the dark, I also put philpips hue lighting and simulate the daylight (rising and seting sun etc) . so while i am shunting, as the pasanger trains automate to a random schedule atm (like you), the sun goes down and station lights up.. :) 

 

and one more q: what are you using to block detect, clamp meters, IR leds ? 

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11 hours ago, john dew said:

One of the attractions of TC is to run a number of trains automatically while at the same time manually shunting the branch yard

 

 

 

Hi john,

Thanks for the reply, it definitely helps understand how these systems work when you can see other people's layout and how they run them!

 

The point above is exactly why i'm interested in setting up computer control when i finally start building my layout!

 

Luke

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15 hours ago, BWsTrains said:

Hi John,

 

more lovely work in those recent posts, haven't been here for a while so a question about your post of 27 Mar, this phot in particular

 

 

 

15 hours ago, BWsTrains said:

 

how did you create the effect in between tracks in foreground, to left of small shed where where man in cap is standing? It looks very effective.

 

regards,

 

Colin

 

Hi Colin

 

Thank you......good to hear from you

 

The question stumped me...I had to go down to the train room to check!

 

Its been there a while so its acquired a certain patina.  It started off with Woodland Scenics 2mm ash ballast.....then when I relaid the parcels siding some of the new ballast drifted on to it ...I painted over thatbut you can still see some.....there is a very very light touch of grass and the dark spot is where I had a sign ....repositioned it and filled in the hole! 

 

Felt a bit like an archaeological dig recalling different  years of modelling!

 

Cheers

 

John

 

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8 hours ago, calvin Streeting said:

hi as another DCC automated fan, is the layout buildings etc lit, so you can run in the dark, I also put philpips hue lighting and simulate the daylight (rising and seting sun etc) . so while i am shunting, as the pasanger trains automate to a random schedule atm (like you), the sun goes down and station lights up.. :) 

 

and one more q: what are you using to block detect, clamp meters, IR leds ? 

 

For block detection I use Lenz LB101 occupancy detectors connected to Lenz LR 101 decoders. Perhaps a bit old fashioned but very robust and ultra reliable.

 

To my regret I dont have lighting...... your system sounds very cool. I had a quick skim through your layout thread, will go back later and spend some more time......you have built some amazing buildings. I was very impressed with the detail and working semaphores as well!

 

Cheers

 

John

 

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7 hours ago, calvin Streeting said:

 

The key to it is get you DCC blocks right, for platforms you really need 2 at min, one for train has entered and one for train stops here.. :)

 

I do agree that getting the correct block structure is the foundation for successful automatic operation. I am not sure you need two blocks per platform. Two separate detectors per platform block can help although with RR&Co you really only need one.

 

With RR&Co the rough rule of thumb is that a block should be at least as long as the longest train that will occupy it. Its not always possible but good to bear in mind. Trains overhanging into the preceding block can be dealt with but its not ideal.

 

RR&Co has a feature called shifted stop and brake markers..........you specify the distance from entering the block that you want the train to stop. Lets say the block length is 48" and you want the train to stop at a signal (or over an uncoupling magnet) 6" from the end of the block. So you set up a stop marker with a distance of 42"...........the train will stop automatically 42" after entering the block. Rather than have it halt abruptly you can set up an associated brake marker that will activate 30" after it has entered the block, it will then,   for the next 12",  progressively slow from the block entry speed to stop at the 42" marker.  Correctly profiled locos will do this consistently  to within 1".

 

You can set up multiple stop markers in a block specifying which schedule or trains will activate them and under what conditions.....its a very powerful feature.

 

 

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I had hoped that Andy would have got the on line member registration sorted for this post.:rolleyes:

 

It would have been neat to have a gold top beside a post about milk (and I dont mind bling)

 

More importantly I wouldnt have had to split the post into two again!

 

 

In contrast to the last post......lots of pictures ( too many apparently!) ...... not too many words I hope


The Down Milk Train from Shrewsbury headed by 6832 Brockton Grange approaches Granby Viaduct


1997948984_1.1Milktoviaduct.jpg.c3019a9dff9a083d0dfea9d307e7beab.jpg


636773005_1.5Brakevan.jpg.144475570bc3b90c9b66a938857a356d.jpg
 

 


286034528_1_8BW.jpg.227b38344d790c7593b6601453abcd99.jpg


Note the tail lamp......a stopped clock is right twice a day.......bit like that with my lamps

 

 

823261204_2.2reliefapproachesTT.jpg.14dac6097ab82d1191fabd78d3e838ec.jpg

 

No I havent got the photos mixed.....this is 4918 Dartington Hall in GWR Wartime livery preparing to leave Granby Shed to relieve Brockton Grange.

 

The sequence of schedules to get 4918 on to the exit road via the turntable is triggered at the same time as the Milk Train leaves the storage yard
 

3_01P5.jpg.35f51b6b31e9de4a4b8992b6bfc57039.jpg



The Grange crawls to a halt,  just over the magnet, on Platform 5 . In the background on Platform 6 you can see the relief Hall in readiness


1243899569_3.1Uncouple.jpg.36a83260ed82b54ecb5d049d7d90351d.jpg

 

 

3.3.jpg.0be589ba97b5f17af66afd122364f2e7.jpg



The Grange uncouples, moves forward to clear the xover points and then reverses back on a schedule that will take her direct to the Shed reception. Once there, the suite of schedules, seen on the video, will take her through the ash pit, coaling stage, turntable and finally to her home on Shed #4. 


I must confess that the shot above was staged so I that could show both locos. In reality the relief loco stops out of sight behind the station roof thus allowing adequate clearance for the relieved loco................guess how I worked that out?

 

 

As the Grange exits the Down Main block  in front of the xover, the schedule to bring the Pilot and tankers from the Up Siding is started

 

249800668_4.1Pilotcouples.jpg.9c0684d5fd3bc64e0c4aac1a79635ae1.jpg



To be continued shortly.............................................

 

Edited by john dew
Photos 2/9/22
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Right I am back.......apparently if you exceed the photo download limit you have to exit and then re enter the thread.

 

I left you with the Station Pilot Collett 2259 pushing two Milk tankers to join the recently arrived Milk train in Platform 5
 

890373658_4.0Pilotjoins.jpg.acbf88bd0b77ff635bf2370d7e7c9bff.jpg

 

 

4.2.jpg.ccbc2021112a0f72d81b03b6b7d78234.jpg

 


365393442_4.9Pilotuncouplesfromtrain.jpg.413979c2c84ebbcb1495fcc1afddeba9.jpg

This was one of the more difficult schedules to accomplish both physically and getting TC to recognise what was happening.

The pilot has to push the two tankers into contact and then continue pushing...but now its the entire train. It then has to stop so the loco tender coupling is just short of the magnet. A short distance move back and forward couples the new tankers with the train and at the same time opens the pilots tender coupling
 

When completed the next schedule starts.......... the pilot moves forward leaving the train in P5
 

1223621536_5.1ReliefandPilot.jpg.939a14b990c179f9c32136c85fb34f70.jpg


The pilot moves over the xover and on to the Up line before reversing into Bay Platform 1 and its stabling point near Bronwen's washing.....she will be thrilled

As the pilot enters the Up Main block this action starts the schedule that will bring Dartington Hall from Platform 6


5.2.jpg.b0b002bdf22c30e6bc6072cf7b761a8b.jpg

Over the Xover to the Down Main

 

5.3.jpg.990d495e741c6c5994aa7c5860de16f1.jpg

Where it reverses to couple with the milk train in P5 ready to depart for Hooton

 

 

1791702749_5_4BW.jpg.440f65b35419a5901c457161bce1cad7.jpg


Thats 36 schedules from when the tankers were picked up from the dairy... some weeks ago

Two more and we are done!

 

 

Regards from Vancouver

 

 

John

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On 21/02/2019 at 04:42, richard.h said:

At the moment no, it has two separate power sections which are split into five sections (2 and 3) each with their own short circuit protections.

 

If I am thinking correctly though I could split it into smaller occupancy units by making fine cuts through one rail and feeding the power to the new section created through detection units.

 

Regards

 

Richard

Hi Richard,

 

what sort of short circuit protection do you need with your NCE? When I shifted to using the NCE PowerCab I couldn't find any mention in their manual (not the clearest or best laid out IMO) of needing to install any.

 

Colin

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20 hours ago, BWsTrains said:

Hi Richard,

 

what sort of short circuit protection do you need with your NCE? When I shifted to using the NCE PowerCab I couldn't find any mention in their manual (not the clearest or best laid out IMO) of needing to install any.

 

Colin

Just to answer your question here if I can.

 

My first NCE system was the power Cab with the SB3a Smart Booster and although it does have short circuit protection I found it was constantly tripping out and trying to restart if there was a short and as this was my only power source it meant that the whole layout was tripping until I found the fault. I didn't leave the layout switched on but had to keep turning it back on to check until I cleared the fault.

 

Eventually it started running hot and misbehaving but I am not sure if this was caused by the short problem or just that the layout had got too big for it.

I then installed five of the DCC Specialities PSX- 1s, these are electronic and shut down the power instantly if there is a short and as there are now five independently protected areas only the affected one loses power leaving the rest of the layout running which makes fault finding much easier as they have LED  displays.

 

I later upgraded to the NCE Power-Pro and Pro-Cab for better performance but still using the PSX-1s and everything now works fine.

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Thanks Richard,

 

Mine is a tiny setup but one unit sounds like a good idea given the cost of the PowerCab if something does go wrong. I've the manual downloaded so will read up how its used.

 

Sorry John for this minor diversion in your topic.

 

Colin.

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16 hours ago, BWsTrains said:

Thanks Richard,

 

Mine is a tiny setup but one unit sounds like a good idea given the cost of the PowerCab if something does go wrong. I've the manual downloaded so will read up how its used.

 

Sorry John for this minor diversion in your topic.

 

Colin.

 

No worries!

 

I have the same set up as Richard with 4 Psx 1s. Best investment ever.......must have saved me a fortune over the years.

 

cheers

 

John

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8 hours ago, john dew said:

 

No worries!

 

I have the same set up as Richard with 4 Psx 1s. Best investment ever.......must have saved me a fortune over the years.

 

cheers

 

John

Hi John,

 

where did you buy this? I can't find it listed by my usual suppliers UK or Australia

 

Colin

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Thanks for all the buttons gentlemen:)

 

This is definitely the conclusion of the milk train saga

I left you with the fully assembled train, complete with new loco, waiting at Down Platform 5
 

281923080_1Milkready.jpg.af8b87119d01eefabdb24ab488105a8d.jpg



The reason for the delay is hardly prototypical........space has to be found in the storage yard!

I didnt design the storage approach roads very well. They are fine for continuous circuits but it is difficult/impossible for out and back schedules to start and finish in the same siding.

Thus the Down Milk train we have been following started in Down Siding 3 but will terminate in Up Siding 1......currently occupied by an Up Parcels/Newspaper Train. 

So another schedule has to be started with the Parcels Train clearing U1 for the Milk Train.

Here we see the Parcels train on Granby Bank Up Main alongside a Local Goods in the Down Relief....or should it be slow?

 

1894057589_2Parcels.jpg.ce75c53a27878f0fd895cbceec4b3361.jpg
Approaching Granby Junction as the Down Milk train finally departs for Hooton (U1)


424755199_5Parcels.jpg.fecc28ce5ab7fbd4893604132f7671fa.jpg

 

1546866967_6.3Milk.jpg.d69eca2f4c3db705824ebfa73a1c381a.jpg

 

1938099746_7.3Parcels.jpg.aa711f1fd8be00181fa0a218372378c3.jpg







There are a number of routines available for the Parcel train. Vans can be added and taken away, along with a loco exchange like the one seen previously with the the Down Milk......but thats for another day.

There is so much happening with the Milk Train that on this occasion its a simple touch and go.....or even an express. Its sole purpose is to move from U1 to D3 the siding vacated by the Milk Train. I am still fine tuning the start point currently its started by the Pilot when it has returned to the bay and the Up main is clear but on reflection it will be better to start it the moment the Milk Train releases the Down Storage siding

I think that for legend purposes, at this time in the afternoon, it could be a Newspaper train with the evening editions from Manchester

Having passed through the stations the two trains continue on their separate journeys....clockwise and anti-clockwise....

 

 

771595768_10Parcels.jpg.f1eeca6cdd61749faa6d369bb3102bfd.jpg

 

 


4905 Barton Hall heading south past Granby Sheds and Carriage Sidings
 

 

73630654_11milk.jpg.16798006c7a9866bd5219fb1ea28b894.jpg


 

4918 Dartington Hall heading North on the Down Main passing Chester Road Goods Depot on its way to Hooton.

Both Locos started life as Hornby 4901 Adderley Hall*.......repainted, reliveried and re tendered (not very well in the case of 4918) ...........exhibition quality models they most definitely are not but they are perfect layout models. Powerful and super reliable....they have to be with all that automated uncoupling.  Heavily weathered work horses suit Granby......and also help disguise my less than perfect paint job.

 

*  The sharp eyed may have noticed that the LH side of Barton Hall has reverted to type..........somewhere on the layout is a tiny brass plate reading 4905 (on one side). Virtually all my GWR locos have engraved plates but this is the first I have lost without trace.

 

Back to the topic......Once the two trains arrive in their respective sidings, both locos uncouple, get turned on the storage turntable and recouple at the other end of their respective trains..........One sentence covering a great deal of activity

Thus 4918 Dartington Hall is ready for the return journey taking the Milk Train (now Empties) back to Shrewsbury. Stopping at Granby to drop off the two tankers for MacPeters Dairy at Cynwyd  ( which they left in Milk Train Part 1.....about a month ago )

Similarly 4905 Barton Hall is now ready to take a Down Parcels through Granby and on to Birkenhead. The Milk train activity on this routine is pretty straight forward so there is now a lot more movement with the parcels train .......but as I said that is for another day

Next week something completely different.

 

Regards from Vancouver where after a few days of endless rain it is a very pleasant sunny spring morning.

 

John

 

Edited by john dew
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"Next week something completely different"


Well I suppose nothing is different    I am afraid Easter got in the way.....my apologies.

Short post today but definitely different from the Milk Saga.

A people painting factory:

 



1107383627_1Peoplefactory.jpg.add7cee91a0346e32ddf284914dc0d9c.jpg

This is a recent delivery of 3D printed figures from Modelu being prepared for painting..........ideal summer job.

I have mentioned them previously (usual Disclaimer). Like Robin of ANTB, when I need more figures they are now my first port of call. I think you may lose a little fine detail definition but the overall effect is, I think, very realistic. Because they are scanned from real life the postures seem more natural......these guys are mostly Drivers and Fireman set up for GWR right hand drive. I like to use them on open cab locos like the Dean Goods but I am hoping the leaning figures will work in the large Prairies many of us are looking forward too. 

 



Alan has changed the resin he uses.....it used to be a very bright red!  So I am experimenting without undercoat.....its very easy to clog the detail with acrylic paint build up.

I generally spread the painting over a couple of weeks using only one or two colours per session. I started with the extremities.......hats, boots and flesh!  On reflection the footplate crew caps caps should have Navy tops and  only black (shiny) peaks. I vaguely remember a DVD about the early days of nationalisation when one of the main complaints of the two GWR drivers was being issued with LMS type caps with black shiny tops!

 

2037654634_3CloseUp.jpg.a670963dbfe91cf1ef22f4750d5e0e84.jpg

Ultra close up. The two figures in the foreground are not signalmen (despite being bobbies). I have found it quite difficult to get policemen for the immediate post war period. Lapelled tunics with shirt and tie were not introduced for Constables and Sergeants until the fifties. These guys have collared tunics but somehow there is a Victorian look to them......it may be the belt is a bit obvious and I am sure truncheons were not carried outside the tunic in 1947.

The right hand  PC, with a notebook, is not leaning on pointed sticks......this is how they come out of the box with the printing supports still attached.The attachment point is minute and very easy to cut with a scalpel leaving no trace.

The guy at the back is a Goods train guard all ready to lean on the rail of one of my Toads. He does demonstrate rather too well a minor downside of using figures recently scanned in real life, on a 1947 layout. I can only assume that Dai Jones was a cook sergeant during the war......how else could he acquire that much weight?
 
Regards from Vancouver

John

2.1 Close up.jpg

Edited by john dew
Photos 2/9/22
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Gluing them temporarily to corks for handling while painting them is a good idea. I use coffee stirrers but I think a vertical hand grip below the figure is easier than one out to the side which the stirrer provides. Time for a glass or three of wine to start up a figure painting support collection.

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In addition to the figures, I got a batch of GWR (WR) head and tail lamps from Modelu
 

 

1789739899_1HeadLamps.jpg.bab0a660d3c9745237a60a091daac6eb.jpg

Unlike the Springside models these dont come ready to plonk. They have to be painted and the tiny shiny lens inserted

A neat idea, which I had forgotten to use until this batch, is the minute slot in the base of each lamp.

With a pair of tweezers you can insert the lamp on to the relevant iron on the loco or coach.......no more fiddling around with super glue.Still has to be glued to older stock of course

These shots do show what a high standard Horbvy have achieved with these Collet non corridor coaches



1758915428_2Side.jpg.d46570c91e220ae3278531758e939f7e.jpg


2035027780_3Rear.jpg.64187851f56aef43344f71714a67f757.jpg
 

1904756453_4RearCloseUp.jpg.245850ea6ca3ecda9561df1b69a12b51.jpg


I suspect I will still top and tail my coach rakes and those tank engines that work bunker first but it will definitely make changing loco head codes much easier!

 

As an aside this close up sure exposes the difference between Railtec transfers (Granby Division) and the ancient #12 I applied from my leftover box. Not my wisest move hopefully some discreet weathering will make it less obvious



Regards from a sunny Vancouver

Edited by john dew
02/09/22 Photos
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4 hours ago, Martin S-C said:

Gluing them temporarily to corks for handling while painting them is a good idea. I use coffee stirrers but I think a vertical hand grip below the figure is easier than one out to the side which the stirrer provides. Time for a glass or three of wine to start up a figure painting support collection.

I have a large collection of wine corks thinking they will come in handy one day I can sell you some at £10 for five  or 5 for £10 :biggrin_mini2:

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3 minutes ago, 81C said:

I have a large collection of wine corks thinking they will come in handy one day I can sell you some at £10 for five  or 5 for £10 :biggrin_mini2:

 

Hopefully with  bottle and contents attached?

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16 hours ago, john dew said:

In addition to the figures, I got a batch of GWR (WR) head and tail lamps from Modelu
 

918037455_1HeadLamps.jpg.b8fa0c5a480a387ba13d9e02ef4a2208.jpg



Unlike the Springside models these dont come ready to plonk. They have to be painted and the tiny shiny lens inserted

A neat idea, which I had forgotten to use until this batch, is the minute slot in the base of each lamp.

With a pair of tweezers you can insert the lamp on to the relevant iron on the loco or coach.......no more fiddling around with super glue.Still has to be glued to older stock of course
 

These shots do show what a high standard Horbvy have achieved with these Collet non corridor coaches


1016350960_2Side.jpg.29add74c6c723a853dde41c8392ef91d.jpg


523866655_3Rear.jpg.a66d1db4ffc4009890fb4749d4c14054.jpg

960145853_4RearCloseUp.jpg.a7dcd8f704192f7a9fb96842ddebfbe6.jpg

I suspect I will still top and tail my coach rakes and those tank engines that work bunker first but it will definitely make changing loco head codes much easier!

 

As an aside this close up sure exposes the difference between Railtec transfers (Granby Division) and the ancient #12 I applied from my leftover box. Not my wisest move hopefully some discreet weathering will make it less obvious



Regards from a sunny Vancouver

Interested to see you have painted the roofs, just in the process of doing my Hornby corridor stock, they do look so much better

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Hi Richard

 

Glad you like it. Its always a bit nail biting when you start painting brand new, right out of the box, stock. Particularly this time because our latest dog sheds hair like confetti!  I have never mastered the art of spraying so its all hand done.....I was quite relieved when it turned out ok in the close ups

 

Kind Regards

 

John

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Great work and detail as ever John.

 

You'll find the plate for the ex -Adderley Hall when it shorts out a section,

 

I have noted what you say about footplate staff cap tops - I have put that n my list of "catch up" jobs.

 

All of your photos and videos have been great, but the milk passing the afternoon papers has got to be a favorite of mine now.

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